Ladykminiature, IM BACK !!!!!!!!!! Val Foaled!!!!!! filly Mandy colt 5/2....and more to come

So sorry to see your little one didn't make it. What happened?

Sending hugs.

 

[LittleRibbie]

Liz, I was just catching up on your thread and it sounds like your little one had a tough start from the very beginning. Im so sorry for your loss. It sounds like you guys did all you could to get her out but to then to have her pass away is so sad. I hope you can find your answers. rest in peace little one.

 

[Liz k]

Here is a link to a recording of the foaling it's alittle blurry but was recorded by one of the watchers.....

Thank you as you can imagine this one is tough to swallow....after working so long and hard to bring that lil girl into this world and give her a fighting chance to lose her 3 day later...is so unfair.....apparently Saturday pm the owner came by to pick both the mare and Emmy up, they were playing, running, and no signs that something was wrong or going wrong, I got a phone call at around 12midnight that the filly had the runs and was becoming lethargic, I told owner to call the vet and take temp....her vet never returned the call till 4:00 pm the next day......Emmy passed away at 4:30 Sunday afternoon due to dehydration.......it's a shame that Emmy didn't have a chance with that vet.......

 

[cassie]

Oh no Liz, I'm so sorry to hear that little Emmy passed away, you and her owners must be heartbroken

after all the work you did saving her as well

so unfair. Thinking of you and the owners and Libby at this time. Have loved being able to watch your little guy running around and playing thank you for that

he sure Is a gorgeous little man.

Hugs going out to you Liz!!!!

 

[misty'smom]

Oh no Liz I am just now reading this

. I am so sorry for the loss of Emmy. You did so much to bring her into this world and then to loose her, I can not imagine what you and her owners are going through. My heart just breaks for all of you.............. What do you think was wrong with Emmy? Did Libby finally come around to be a good Momma? Can the first few hours of a foal not bonding/nursing with the mother affect their all over health in general?? Poor Emmy so unfair, she was such a little fighter to come into this world...... May the little Angel RIP. Hugs to you Liz!!

 

[crisco41]

I am so very sorry. What a terrible loss.

 

Can the first few hours of a foal not bonding/nursing with the mother affect their all over health in general?? Poor Emmy so unfair, she was such a little fighter to come into this world...... May the little Angel RIP.

This is a good question to ask, and the answer is yes, especially when baby has been through a traumatic birth. Most foals have no problems. For those who do suffer complications from birth or experience life-threatening conditions during the first crucial weeks of life, your diligence and attention can make the difference between life and permanent damage, or death to the foal.

Your careful watching of the foal -- learning their personality, and just playing with them, can be the KEY to noticing when something isn't quite right with them. That's why we encourage you to spend lots of time watching them in those first few days.

To me the "key" is assessing....and taking preventive steps -- was the birth traumatic or the difficulty and time of getting baby to the ground extended? A few years back, a friend of mine, Kay Baxter, had a mare that also went through a very traumatic birth. Baby and mom made it through, but by the 2nd day Kay noticed something was a bit off. Baby was getting septic and began running fever and getting lethargic. The filly was immediately started on antibiotics, and to make a long story short, after several trips to the vet hospital for IV's, lots of medication and weeks of great care -- the little one survived.

The newborn foal's nervous system is immature and is easily damaged by infection, oxygen deprivation, stress, or trauma. Little foals can go downhill in the "blink of an eye". They crash very quickly, and many times without many signs. But the FIRST thing, in my opinion, to remember is IF a foal has had a long and traumatic birth, it is in the best interest of the foal to put them on antibiotics prophyllatically to protect them from contracting a joint ill or going septic. The drugs will not hurt them, but may keep them alive as they move through their first few days of life.

Adequate colostrum intake -- signs you would look for in a newborn would be good nursing -- many times you can hear the little one actually swallowing and gulping down milk. You want to see baby nursing -- to make sure they are getting enough colostrum. Watch for the foal to be eating at least hourly -- and showing signs of energy and a rounded tummy. If you don't see baby eating as it should, get in there and help get baby nursing. "New" mommas especially, sometimes need help feeding their babies and learning about nursing. You may have to help them several times in the first day -- making sure baby is nursing often. IF THERE IS ANY DOUBT you should have an IgG test run on the foal to be sure baby has received enough. Sometimes the mom's will even reject their foals after a traumatic birth. But making sure baby is drinking well is critical to their survival. Again, if there is any doubt about the nursing It is very important that the IgG be done to ensure adequate transfer. I used to do it on all foals here, but now only have it done on any foal that has gone through a traumatic birth -- or a slow nursing process.

Lethargy -- a foal that is lethargic is a warning sign as well. Sometimes it's as simple as going to stimulate the foal and wake them up to nurse. Babies can be quite tired out by the birthing process, especially a traumatic one -- and may just want to sleep. We love to see the little ones sleep -- but too much is not good, if it's at the expense of getting enough nourishment. Remember, Joanne at Pacific Pintos had a little colt that was very wobbly when he got to his feet, and was sleeping quite a bit of the time. She quickly assessed there may be a problem occuring, and went to the foal -- rubbing and playing with it to wake it up, and then helped it nurse. After a few times, baby "came around" and went on to be a healthy foal nursing properly.

Limping -- a foal limping can be a sign of "joint ill" This is a horrible disease in a foal and without treatment the foal could die within a few days. Many horse owners take a wait and see approach when they observe a foal limping. This can spell disaster for your foal. Kay Baxter wrote a good article on "joint ill" in a foal -- the link is here. http://voices.yahoo.com/how-avoid-stop-joint-ill-foals-7746118.html

Fever - a foal with a fever in those first few days is a critical problem. It can be a sign of sepsis and many other infections that can attack newborns, and I believe vet attention is immediately called for.

Hope this answers your questions. Remember, these little ones don't give us many signs BEFORE becoming quite critically ill. But your best chance is getting to know your foal and knowing when something isn't quite right! Think about little Onyx here, and how quick action saved her life!

 

[Eagle]

Thank you Diane, that is a perfect explanation of what to look for and to expect in a healthy foal. I remember very well the problems Kay had with her little filly, she became somewhat of a mascot here as we were all rooting for her to pull through. I saw a pic of her last year and she has grown up to be a real beauty.

Another good sign that baby is nursing well and getting that vital colostrum is when you see it playing, healthy foals quickly get into a routine of nurse, poop and play and this is repeated over and over throughout the day. A foal that doesn't try and run around within the first few hours is a good sign that something is up. Some have more energy than others but they will all try out their new little legs.

 

[Liz k]

Diane that was so well put and so true......in Emmys case while she was here all the above was done except the antibodics but a very close eye was kept on her, the hard part of this is knowing she would have a better chance if she she would have stayed here one more day, just one more day and the symptoms would have been spotted and treatment would have been given ASAP.....the owner saw something was wrong, but without vet help Emmy was doomed......remember girls not only is it important to recognize when a problem might exist but just as important is to have a vet who at a drop of a dime can be reached for treatment or even advise...I can't believe that there are vets out there who truly ar a 8- 5 doctor and if you have trouble after hours well your on your own, make sure you if your vet is like that to have a plan B always.......I consider myself lucky that my vet truly has a love for all animals and can be reached anytime day or night......God I love my Vet..........

 

[crisco41]

I am not passing judgement truly I am not. I do have a hard time with this little ones fate. Perhaps I am missing something tho? My experience with foals is limited. But years ago when I got the 3 day old baby whos mom had died..and who had minimal colosrum it was very touch and go for awhile. He was hypothermic, dehydraded , down and out comatose, low glucose, cold mouth, tongue and extremities,,and he lived to all of our amazement. Once we got him revived with fluids...and then drinking and then months of doting care..he thrived and never looked back. So how did this baby end up gone? It isnt like dehydration is a lively foal and 2 minutes later a dead one. There are signs..at least their were with that little orphan. Was there no other vets? No options? I have Lactated ringers here,,and an iv set up. ,and in a case like that even though I have very little idea how to start an iv..I would. I would have nothing to lose and am reasonably confident I may save the poor soul.

I could not sit by and watch a foal slip away and do nothing. If I couldnt find help I would do my best to be that help. I do not want to sound grandiose..as I am waiting for a foal and because i have spoken I am afraid I have jinxed my own foaling. But I truly do not understand how this foal had such a sad ending. I fele bad for everyone involved..but mostly i feel bad for that precious lil baby

 

[blazingstarranch]

This is terrible news! I'm so sorry you lost little Emmy. Just know that you did everything you could possibly do to save her. My sincere condolences to everyone for your loss.

 

[Liz k]

I am not passing judgement truly I am not. I do have a hard time with this little ones fate. Perhaps I am missing something tho? My experience with foals is limited. But years ago when I got the 3 day old baby whos mom had died..and who had minimal colosrum it was very touch and go for awhile. He was hypothermic, dehydraded , down and out comatose, low glucose, cold mouth, tongue and extremities,,and he lived to all of our amazement. Once we got him revived with fluids...and then drinking and then months of doting care..he thrived and never looked back. So how did this baby end up gone? It isnt like dehydration is a lively foal and 2 minutes later a dead one. There are signs..at least their were with that little orphan. Was there no other vets? No options? I have Lactated ringers here,,and an iv set up. ,and in a case like that even though I have very little idea how to start an iv..I would. I would have nothing to lose and am reasonably confident I may save the poor soul. I could not sit by and watch a foal slip away and do nothing. If I couldnt find help I would do my best to be that help. I do not want to sound grandiose..as I am waiting for a foal and because i have spoken I am afraid I have jinxed my own foaling. But I truly do not understand how this foal had such a sad ending. I fele bad for everyone involved..but mostly i feel bad for that precious lil baby

I so agree crisco.....this was the owners first live foal, so for her she had no experience to go by but she did know something was wrong right away and called the vet and when he didn't return call she called me, so I was telling her to first take temp, then milk mare and feed baby every 20 to 30 min until vet called back told her if temp went to 102 to water down the baby and to keep trying the vet in the mean time to also give her some caro syrup rubbed on the gums and give some probios......but doing all this is just temporally to help baby till vet could give antibodics and do the IV the things the owner did helped Emmy for 21 hours which in its self is a long time to wait for help.....Emmy was running and playing and being a normal foal and I have been watching the other baby here for any signs just in case and he is great no issues so I don't think it was a infection, or illness, her IGG was good so not sure if just the stress of the move combined with the heat or maybe a kick form mom one we didn't see.... I'm just not sure, but I do know that lil girl touched a lot of people's hearts and she was special...and I don't think you jinked yourself, I did however advise the owner to look for another vet I know vets are busy, but 21hours to return a frantic clients call is alittle excessive in my option.....Libby is doing good and I'm greatfull for that.

 

[cassie]

oh the poor owners

I would definitely be looking for another vet

I guess I'm not used to not having 24 hour callouts but I have about 4 different vet clinics within an hours drive of me, it must be so hard for you guys that don't have any nearby

my heart just breaks for you Liz, and the owners and that precious filly, she was indeed an angel and too precious to stay here with us. You are such a strong wonderful person Liz, hugs for you! I'm so glad Libby is doing well. poor mumma.

 

How far away from you were they Liz?

 

[crisco41]

21 hours is crazy. I would fire the vet. I am lucky I have 2 hospitals with in an hour. One is staffed 24/7 just like a real hospital and the other opens for emergencies.A bit costly but that's what credit cards are for:>)

Usually if I need a vet NOW i call my favorite. If i don't get a call within a half hour or so I call an alternative vet. I have had messages out for 3 vets..and the first vet that returns my call is "hired" As the slow vets call me back I tell them I have got a hold of someone else. Praying I don't ever have to resort to that again...noting as scarey as a true emergency.

21 hours...I guess she could have loaded that baby up and taken it somewhere. She could have made it from Texas to TN in half that time. Hopefully if she breeds again she has some alternatives set up.

Poor little angel filly she certainly went thru too much

 

[izmepeggy]

I was saddened to hear she passed away..I've been having internet problems and been working with Isaac so haven't been able to really check up on everything..That is a shame about the Vet,but I once loaded one of my pygmy goats in the back of my Camero to take her to the Vet..She was having a kid and just the head could come out..So I just loaded her up and took her myself..I didn't have time to wait on a Vet. so I took her to a small animal vet..They got the baby out and everything was fine..And yes I hauled them both back in my Camero..

 

[cassie]

I see you have a new mare up on camera Liz? who is she? how far along.. etc etc would love to hear from you

 

OOOOoooooo, who is she! Do tell!!

 

[misty'smom]

Yes! I can barely see the new mare, the cam looks foggy and like something is on the lens. But who is this new little girl and all the details please Liz!!

 

[cassie]

cooeeeee Liz?

haven't heard from you in a while how are you?

how is that gorgeous little colt of yours doing?

I see that new little mare (still no name seeing as we don't know who she is...

) is still without a baby at her side... when is she due etc? miss you!