Really low prices

[wendyluvsminis]

I have seen some really nice horses go incredibly cheap lately. Like $150 for buckskin weanlings with good pedigress (Buckeroo, Aza Destiny..). $400 for bred mares to a very nice stallion. $200 and under for trained drivers. Is this a good idea, to sell so low? I want to sell my horses, but I just can't lower my prices to that level. When I have spent several thousand for a mare, I think her NICE baby is worth more than $150, even $500. Are breeders holding on to their stock, when they can't get their price, or dropping prices until they sell.

 

[wendyluvsminis]

I have seen some really nice horses go incredibly cheap lately. Like $150 for buckskin weanlings with good pedigress (Buckeroo, Aza Destiny..). $400 for bred mares to a very nice stallion. $200 and under for trained drivers. Is this a good idea, to sell so low? I want to sell my horses, but I just can't lower my prices to that level. When I have spent several thousand for a mare, I think her NICE baby is worth more than $150, even $500. Are breeders holding on to their stock, when they can't get their price, or dropping prices until they sell.

Some comments, Please! I know this is a group with lots of opinion, and I would love to hear them!!!

 

[CrescentMinis]

Personally, I feel when people sell horses for too low a price, it hurts all of us because the general perceived value is lowered. I would rather hold onto my horses and not sell any until the market improves.

 

[Relic]

l love my free mini only cost me the price of paperwork...and is one of the better ones on the farm so l consider that a good deal for me but maybe not for the breeder.

 

[Joanne]

Where were they selling these horses that low at?

Auctions???

I could only see that low a price for retired horses that could no longer breed or truly pet quality horses (ones that could not be bred due to a problem).

 

[Katiean]

The big problem is when someone is selling for $150 they may be desperate to move a mouth out of their barn. I don't think they are intentionally selling low to make sales tough on everyone else. I think things will get much worse before they get better. I remember as a kid ponies were as low as $5 at auction and as a teen I was given several ponies and a mini. It is just like the housing market. It will get better. The question is how much better will it get.

 

[sdmini]

Well you did ask for opinions and that is one thing I've never been short of.

Right now lots of people are in survival mode so if they have to sell at greatly reduced prices to stay afloat who am I to judge. In the end I think the breed benefits from being able to buy good quality miniatures for low prices verses the over inflated prices some ask and seem to get for subpar animals, even if the animals are well bred.

If I could I would be on a shopping spree as I this trend will not last forever. Unfortunately I promised I would not increase my numbers and as I sold off the mares that did not work for my program in order to be able to buy the retires out of my uncles estate I'm stuck at my current level at least till spring.

 

[HGFarm]

Since there is NO market here right now due to the economy and nobody realized it was going to go down the tubes this badly, those prices do not surprize me. Many people I know have always in the past had no problems selling horses, but all that has changed. Friends I know are retired and have some really nice horses- that have brought, at most, a few hundred dollars this year- around the $600 mark, give or take a hundred or so.

My foals have always been sold well before even weaning time- not this year, nor last. I still have one for sale that is 2 yrs old now, that I am seriously just thinking about keeping because she is awfully nice and I also feel is worth much more than the asking price. I just sold my last 08 foal to a wonderful and experienced home- I held out and fended off the ridiculous buyers that wanted a cheap pet to throw out back with the family dogs for their kids, and NO idea what is required for horse care.... I just wont sell to what is an improper or bad home, regardless of price. And I will NOT take one to the auction -

My foals have usually sold for decent prices and is also my 'second job' and income, since I am single and have no one else to depend on. Our overtime at work was cut off over a year ago, and with nothing selling, and the price of everything rising- it hurts. It would be bad enough on the same income when prices double - or more, but when your income is also cut along with the price hikes, it's like the cost of living went up 400% instead of 200%.

I am thankful I still have a job at this point- many people are not so lucky- so waiting for months to find the right home may not be an option for some, and with no income and trying to feed their families, I see why many are ending up at auctions, etc.... When your electric is being shut off, or you have no gas money for next week, or your child is sick and needs to see a doctor, I guess some figure $50.00 is better than what they had, and one less mouth to feed.

The longest 'recession' was noted to run about 16 months---- well, this is going to be a record breaker folks- and the price of horses (and everything else) are reflecting that. So for those that can afford to feed them, have pasture to help ease the bills, etc... that's great- but many do not.

 

[Maple Hollow Farm]

I agree that the prices are terrible right now but that does not mean that the market is that bad people are still buying horses for thousands of dollars. It is all a perception that "the economy is bad so I think I should be able buy cheaper". The problem with that is that when people actually give in and lower their prices to 500 or less, then people are thinking "hey I can get a great horse for cheap" and they wont buy one for even 1000 because they know there are others out there for cheaper. I have my prices as low as I am willing to put mine now but I plan to raise them once the horses are trained. I try to stay reasonable no matter what the market is, for the quality of the horse. I will always look at the more expensive horse first because chances are it will be the better horse but that is not always the case and I have bought cheap horses myself but I have also helped to bid people's horses up... if I think it is a good horse that I wouldnt mind having even if I dont need it then I will bid it up to the point I feel is reasonable and let the others finish it off. This helps to keep the prices up even if you end up with an "accidental"

purchase along the way.

 

[My-Lil-Pony]

I think in the original post the description was buckskin weanlings. As if the color somehow makes them worth more. Good horses are going for less money now for a majority sellers. Dropping the price would depend soley on how quickly you needed to sell your horses.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

If people are still buying animals for thousands of dollars they are nuts!!

People need to take a good deep breath of realism .

Good horses will hold value??

Will they??

They won't, you know, they just won't sell!!!

Maybe some buyers have not caught up with the economic climate but they will soon, you have, at most, a year in which to get your houses in order, believe me.

This is NOT going to go away, not even for America, Obama seems like a nice man but as far as I know he has no magic wand.

$600.00 for a mare in foal sounds like a good price to me, and if it were a good home I would be happy with it if I were selling.

But I'm not, I'm sitting tight and digging in.

May have to start growing veggies, shall have to start raising hens again, and I already grow hay....that I can trade off for other things.

Believe me, any market is better than no market if you cannot pay for feed.

 

[wendyluvsminis]

I think in the original post the description was buckskin weanlings. As if the color somehow makes them worth more. Good horses are going for less money now for a majority sellers. Dropping the price would depend soley on how quickly you needed to sell your horses.

I only mentioned they were buckskins, because their breeding was really top buckskin breeding, and it seems lots of people like buckskins, pintos, & blacks, and might buy those first.

 

[Songcatcher]

I have not seen any quality animals in my area for the prices mentioned. I have seen some animals in that price range, but they were what I considered culls.

I do think all this talk is contributing to a panic and driving the prices lower. I hear talk of how expensive it is to feed, and I realize it is worse in some areas than it is in mine. Planning is important. I bought large round bales of hay (mostly Bermuda) for $35/roll. I bought 8 rolls and will have enough to last through the entire winter. I also feed pelleted feed and provide salt and mineral supplements. With average rainfall, I will have plenty of grass to last through the summer. If my finances change to where I cannot afford to feed, I will sell or give away my horses BEFORE I get to where I cannot feed them.

I am pretty much at my limit on the number of mature horses I can house on my property, but I have upgraded my mares over the years and am anticipating my best crop of foals yet (sorry to those of you who think it is a crime to breed). I sold all my 08 foals and for rather decent prices (far better than those mentioned in the original post). If my 09 foals do not sell similarly well, I will sell a few of my mares and refine my program even more by keeping some of my own foals, and thus reducing the number I am producing for the next few years.

The problem with the horse market is that there are too many people who want to save every cull. Those culls wind up being bred and producing more culls and the market is saturated with inferior animals. When you have too many culls with no market for them and no means of disposal, they wind up starving to death.

 

[Littleum]

The market stinks. And a lot of people are at the point where they HAVE to get rid of the horses somehow, some way and it doesn't matter if you roll up and give them $50.

I was looking at a couple of websites the other day and saw horses traditionally offered in the $8,500-$12,500 range now in the $3,500-$5,000 range. I think we've gone beyond a needed market adjustment into a "bad place"

Anyone who has cash left to spend has found it goes a lot farther right now as people just try to lighten the load.

All this does is really squeeze the lower end of the market, which was saturated to begin with.

What worries me is the real disaster of the financial crisis didn't really slap the general public awarness upside the head until this summer/fall, after breeding season ended. I don't think '09 is going to be very pretty for the horse world.

 

[icspots]

I agree with whoever said we have to try to ride it out, so dig in and budget. Take it from someone who has 25, yes you heard it, 25 full sized horses, and NO MARKET! These are not cull animals, they are very nice animals and I have no intention of sending them down the road to someone who won't take proper care of them, or sell them to kill, they are too good for that which is why I currently have so many. Now the mini market seems to be following suit. Do I condemn people who let them go so cheaply, not in this market, as was mentioned before, other bills have to be paid and choices must be made. Do I think it helps the market...NO. But then neither do the people who seek out newbies and convince them to pay too much for sub-standard critters, since EVERYTHING on their farms are show and/or stud quality! Yeah right. I'm at the point where I'm going to have to let some boys go really cheap, still not at the point where I'll hack the price on fillies or mares, I'm not intentionally trying to destroy the local market, but overcrowding isn't a good thing either. I get plenty of calls and e-mails, but people don't want to spend any money, and I'm talking dirt cheap, $500 stud colts, and they just won't give that much for a kid's gelding or backyard pet, but are somehow willing to spend the money on a dog. Go figure. It is a buyers market, but if you're buying I'd say git r done, because this won't last forever!

 

[~Dan]

If you can, I would hang onto the horses until the economy pulls through, or you find someone thats willing to buy them for the price that you are selling for thats my opinion, I do think people should not sell their horses for that little money thats ridiculous

 

[HGFarm]

It is ridiculous, but hay here is $14.00 for a 3 wire bale of alfalfa and timothy, if you can find it is $20.00 for a bale! Bermuda hay (which sucks here) is in between. If you have kids to feed, bills to pay, or are going to lose your job, nobody wants another mouth to feed and yep, $100 might look pretty darned good when you are in the hole and no where to turn.

I also have seen the entire market dropping, not just Minis. I think the full sized horses are doing even worse cause it's more feed, etc... for those. Horses that used to be priced much higher have come down a lot, and I have also seen the same horses for sale for a looooooong time, and not sell.

Nope, there is no magic wand, and somebody is going to have to do some real creative thinking to even start pulling out of this mess we have allowed ourselves to get into. Many laws have been changed, long ago, to allow us to get into this situation and until that is dealt with (I noticed not one politician seems to want to address any of that) it is going to continue.

They have just announced here at work that there will be even more cut backs on employees. That's just great, yet they hire more overseas for much less money to take the place of those here. Gosh, wonder why the economy continues to decline?

 

[Marty]

Laurie I heard about those Arizona hay prices last night. Holy cow!

It would be worth your while to come hither darlin and I will be more than happy to fix you up. We have quite a surplus of really nice hay here in Tennessee in 08.

 

[JMS Miniatures]

I think in the original post the description was buckskin weanlings. As if the color somehow makes them worth more. Good horses are going for less money now for a majority sellers. Dropping the price would depend soley on how quickly you needed to sell your horses.

I only mentioned they were buckskins, because their breeding was really top buckskin breeding, and it seems lots of people like buckskins, pintos, & blacks, and might buy those first.

How do these horses look? Are they show quality? Are they breeding quality? Doesn't matter what the color is or the bloodlines it has if its not a good horse. Perhaps the owner feels that is how much they are worth.

Market stinks. Too many horses for sale, and will just get worse with all the new foals coming and they will be for sale. We have a problem.

We should honestly not focus on breeding until we get new members. Once we get new people coming in we don't have to sell to eachother anymore. That is what we are doing and that is whats killing the miniature horse breed. We need new people.

 

[RockRiverTiff]

I think the low prices are a combination of things. The economy has hit everything hard, and horses--minis included--are a luxury for most people, so they're going to be the first thing to go. When you can't afford to feed your horses, let alone yourself and your family, you're going to be willing to let them go for a lot less. Then you add to that the fact that we've been increasing supply without increasing demand for a long time. Minis are no longer a rarity or a novelty which means we now have to prove their value beyond the "cute" factor. People trying to sell their minis on cute alone are going to have to settle for less. You can pick up a mini at auction or from backyard breeders for practically nothing these days, so why are people that only want a pet/companion going to pay several thousand dollars for something they have no intention of breeding or showing? Just as with big horses, the base price for our minis has dropped significantly now that they're so common, and naturally that along with other factors is going to drag the whole market down.

I do want to say that I think saying we need to stop breeding altogether is ludicrous. What then would be the value of all the high profile ex-show stallions and mares? Ultimately isn't showing--geldings included--a demonstration of how each breeder is improving the breed? I think breeding for a better horse is one of the most challenging and rewarding aspects of mini ownership. Obviously NO we shouldn't be breeding everything with a uterus, and we definitely should be putting more emphasis on the value of our geldings, but if there's one upside to the falling prices of minis it's that good stock is now more accessible than ever before.

I could yap about this all night! I guess what you have to ask yourself with your own horses is what they possess that solidifies their value. Are they visibly better than other similarly priced horses? Have you invested enough of your own time, money, care and training into the horse to justify your price? If your horse is already reasonably priced, then I understand how hard it is to lower the price, but if profit is a consideration then you have to assume another year of vaccinating, worming, trimming, feeding, and vetting the horse is probably going to eat more into your profits than reducing the price now. So what's your priority--to move the horse quickly, to make a profit, or to find a good home? If we're being totally honest, my priority is always to find a good home...in which case it's very hard to make a profit regardless of the market.

Which brings up unethical sellers and how they've also hurt our market...but since I've already written a book I'll get off my soapbox now.