Questions about training Foals

[CHARLOTTE & JOHN]

Hello,

My husband and I are new to miniature horses. We have been reading a lot about mini's here on this forum.

We got our first mini a couple of weeks ago (a 4 month old colt) He was our only horse and was getting to know us pretty well (Letting us pet him and letting us put a halter on him).

Then last weekend we purchased a 4 month old filly. The 2 horses are not related and were bought from different places. Both are double (AMHA/AMHR) eligible. We put them in the same pen and they have bonded well. He was still very friendly and we had put halters on both horses and had taken them for a walk and they did fine.

But this morning, neither one of them wanted us to get near them. Would really like some advice on training them. Neither of us has any experience with horses. We want to be able to clip and bathe them. We would like to be able to show them and teach them to drive someday.

Thanks in advance.

Charlotte

 

[mininik]

I think stalling the foals separately at night would be best. You can get away with turning them out together for now, but eventually your colt will start playing stallion. By play biting on eachother, especially on the legs, they'll make it that much harder for you to teach them to accept handling such as hoof trims and clipping. They will also bond to eachother if left out as you are finding.

Are you planning on gelding your colt or breeding him to your filly?

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

Oh goodness... get thee to a trainer!! Buying your first horse is wonderful... but,

1) 4 months old

2) colt

3) no experience

= three strikes.... you know what they say, "green plus green equals black and blue". This is not a good situation, not at all. You need professional help and fast, if you want these horses to end up with manners and class.

 

[CHARLOTTE & JOHN]

I think stalling the foals separately at night would be best. You can get away with turning them out together for now, but eventually your colt will start playing stallion. By play biting on eachother, especially on the legs, they'll make it that much harder for you to teach them to accept handling such as hoof trims and clipping. They will also bond to eachother if left out as you are finding.

Are you planning on gelding your colt or breeding him to your filly?

We don't have seperate stalls. We have a 3-sided shelter in one lot and a second lot with no shelter.

Yes he will be the stallion for her.

We did just put them in seperate lots that share a common fence. They are both staying close to the fence but will let us approach them and touch them, as before they were running away as a pair when you went toward them.

 

[TTF]

Just saying, and I'm sure you're already aware, but keep an eye on your colt. We he starts acting (physically and through actions) more stallion-like you will need to keep them separated as your filly must be around 3 years old before you can breed.

: Correct me if I'm wrong...

 

[Brandi*]

I don't think you need to "send" them to a trainer but you should def. be reading and asking questions and doing your research...like you are. If if was me, I would have the little guy gelded. There is so much to learn about horses in general and having a stud just makes things A LOT more complicated. Plus if they aren't handled correctly from the beginning, stallions can become very rude and dangerous. If you do send them to a trainer I would suggest taking some lessons of some sort so that you can learn along with them. I have seen many "newbies" to horses do very well but then again they haven't started with a stallion...Good luck with your two little ones and have lots of fun!

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

Look, I hate to be rude, but what are you doing purchasing two young horses, intending to breed them together? You are brand new to horses, you do not want to be starting with a stallion. It is very possible (almost guarenteed if you don't change anything) to have them "fool around" in a few short months (puberty hits around 12 months). They are not physically ready to carry a foal that young, and you are asking for severe health risks, ESPECIALLY in minis, by allowing this. This is a huge mistake. You took a bad situation and made it a lot worse by planning to breed already.

This happened next door to me just yesterday. Someone told the owner that if they remove the mares from the paddock twice each year they won't get pregnant from the stallion. Well, surprise surprise they had a foal that ended up killing the mare this year. Now they are giving all their horses away for free. Now six horses need homes immediately, and are being given away for free to anyone that wants them.

 

[mininik]

If you've not had experience with stallions or breeding horses, I believe you're in for a rude awakening. I don't know where you're located, but I agree with the poster who said to contact a professional trainer right away. Your filly should be at least 2, if not 3 years old before she is bred. Keeping your boy sane in the meantime will take a lot of work. You won't be able to keep these two close for much longer, so I'd start looking for somewhere else to keep your mare where there's no risk of her being bred unintentionally.

 

[kaykay]

Welcome to miniatures! It would be too lengthy to post here but if you would like help via email or phone just contact me. [email protected] 740-323-4341

the best thing would be to get a mentor that lives not to far away to help you learn to handle them etc

 

[CHARLOTTE & JOHN]

Look, I hate to be rude, but what are you doing purchasing two young horses, intending to breed them together? You are brand new to horses, you do not want to be starting with a stallion. It is very possible (almost guarenteed if you don't change anything) to have them "fool around" in a few short months (puberty hits around 12 months). They are not physically ready to carry a foal that young, and you are asking for severe health risks, ESPECIALLY in minis, by allowing this. This is a huge mistake. You took a bad situation and made it a lot worse by planning to breed already.

This happened next door to me just yesterday. Someone told the owner that if they remove the mares from the paddock twice each year they won't get pregnant from the stallion. Well, surprise surprise they had a foal that ended up killing the mare this year. Now they are giving all their horses away for free. Now six horses need homes immediately, and are being given away for free to anyone that wants them.

Nathan, I never said we were breeding right away. We fully intend to wait until they are both 3 years old. We have 4 1/2 acres so there is room to seperate the horses. The situation just showed up today and we are trying to remedy it, that is why we asked for suggestions.

We looked at some older horses and saw many health and attitude problems so we decided to get the young ones and grow and learn together.

 

[Katiean]

A common fence is not a good idea when it comes to boys and girls. Because Boys will be boys and girls will be girls. I had a Standardbred mare that shared a fence in the paddock with an arab stud. It was chainlink fencing all the way to the ground. There was a tension wire that ran through the bottom. She still crawled under the fence to get in with the stud. At this point I have a 3 sided shed for my horses and I just put a gate on the shed. Instant stall. The second shed is being put in and I will be putting a gate on that. the gate will be the width of the shed or if you want to call it a stall because of the gate. I do have a question for you. What are you intending to do with your horses? Are you going to show them, use them for driving around the neighborhood, pets? Or are you intending on breeding for that adorable foal? I need to point out that foals grow up and without training they grow up and the antics aren't so cute. Are you selling the foals? are you keeping them? How many horses do you intend on keeping? I don't mean to give you the third degree but, there are a lot of horses on the market. There aren't a lot of high priced buyers right now. There are a ton of horses being sold for next to nothing. I have 2 mares and a stud. I am not breeding this year and maybe not even next year. Some people think a mare has to have a foal every year. Not true. It is better for them if they don't.

 

[txminipinto]

Weanlings can be sooo much fun! But they can also be soooo much trouble. I agree with the other posters. But I also want to touch base on something no one else has mentioned. You've brought a lot of joy into your life with these minis. However, while your intentions are good, there's a lot of room for error (and you're doing the right thing by joining a community such as this). Minis are literally a dime a dozen; especially poor (pet) quality ones. I'm not saying that every mini born must be show quality, but just like the dog and cat population, our mini population is booming. And it's booming in the wrong direction.

I strongly recommend that you geld your stallion. Only the very best of the best should be bred, regardless of your reasons for breeding. You may have the next National Grand Champion in your hands, but chances are you don't nor do 99% of the people on this forum. Stallions are a pain in the butt (PERIOD). They can be just as dangerous as they can be sweet and loveable. You must never turn your back or completely trust a stallion. They will bite and kick you just for the sheer fun in it(I have one that will).

My next recommendation is purchase Blessed are the Broodmares. A book on mare/foal management, that includes many of the things that can go wrong. This book is based on full size mares so you'll have to multiply the reproductive issues of a mini mare ten fold. Miniature horse foaling is NOT for the faint of heart. It is often very disappointing.

There is a WEALTH of information here but there is also wealth of MISINFORMATION here as well. Find a reputable breeder or trainer(or vet) in your area that is willing to mentor you. We all give advice freely here, but without a clear picture of the situation, some of the advice may not be in your or your horses' best interest.

Good luck with your new minis! But heed the advice and warnings found here with an open mind because there are many who will be more than willing to let you learn from their mistakes.

 

[Miniv]

Right now they are okay being together for part of the day, but if it were me, I'd seperate them, next to eachother at night. Work on handling each of them either in the evening and/or first thing in the morning before reuniting them. By keeping them together 24/7, they will be more focussed on eachother and you'll be only a food source.

Both of them will start developing sexually as early as February of 2008, so that means no more visits from about January on........but they can be buddies through their fencing.

If you have only one shelter, split it in half with fencing down the middle.

So much of this horse stuff is basic common sense........and I'm sure you would have figured it out on your own by just sitting and down and thinking it out.

:

MA

 

[CHARLOTTE & JOHN]

Right now they are okay being together for part of the day, but if it were me, I'd seperate them, next to eachother at night. Work on handling each of them either in the evening and/or first thing in the morning before reuniting them. By keeping them together 24/7, they will be more focussed on eachother and you'll be only a food source.

Both of them will start developing sexually as early as February of 2008, so that means no more visits from about January on........but they can be buddies through their fencing.

If you have only one shelter, split it in half with fencing down the middle.

So much of this horse stuff is basic common sense........and I'm sure you would have figured it out on your own by just sitting and down and thinking it out.

:

MA

MA, Thanks! I really appeciate your down to earth advice. You are right about the common sense part. My husband had already thought about splitting the shelter with the fence in the middle. He has a bobcat and can easily move the shelter. This is a temporary fix as we are working on a second pen with a shelter and seperate pasture, that will have at least a acre of ground between the two areas.

You are the only one that has not made us feel like idiots for even thinking about raising mini's. My husband and I are both in our late 40's are semi-retired and with the horses 24/7.

PS. We look forward to your opinion in the future

For those who mentioned gelding, we have no intentions of gelding our colt.

 

[horsehug]

Hi Charlotte,

I do not think you are idiots!

When I started out, I did not know much about raising horses but I started out with a 4 month old colt and a few mares and fillies. And I have never regretted it. I had grown up with a HUGE love of horses but in a big city, so never really had had the opportunity to raise them until I was in my late 30's either.

Over the years I read a lot and met other breeders whom I also learned from, and have tweaked my breeding program from time to time. I still do as time goes by and as I remember my goals.

But I still have that very first colt and he is 19 years old and my most cherished stallion out of quite a few!

I am sure like MA that you would have figured out a lot on your own, and that you will as time goes by.

Raising minis has been for me the greatest joy of anything I have ever done other than my first love....... raising my human kids And now that my kids are grown, I am so glad I have my minis.

I wish you much success and enjoyment also of these fantastic lovable and loving little creatures.

Susan O.

 

[Relic]

Enjoy your minis while they are babies and they all go through stages along the way till adults some minis with others become a running bunch of fools when you want one while others just stand and let you handle and halter without any fuss. They will come sooner or later they test no different then human kids to see what they can get away with. Heck sometimes the mares behind the barn see you coming with a halter and pack together and keep just out of reach other days you can come and they just put the halter on themselves. l think stallions are the smartest of the batch they keep you on your toes and your mind active staying a step ahead of them is second nature in your head once you can read them. lf l could the only minis we would have would be stallions...and not because they breed they can and we have a lot that don't breed and live just fine with a regular routine and lots of driving etc...l always hear stallions are suppose to get antsy if not bred but l believe otherwise they have purpose besides breeding and being nasty things as l always seem to hear..none of ours are kept away from sight or sound of anything on the farm but each lives alone. Getting my butt flamed most likely but love those studs regardless just because l can... :bgrin

 

[PaintedPromiseRanch]

but they can be buddies through their fencing.
If you have only one shelter, split it in half with fencing down the middle.

we learned the hard way that one fence between boys and girls is NOT ENOUGH, they will breed THROUGH THE FENCE... we lost a beautiful jennet that way, she was never "with" the jack so the only way could have been through the fence, both cooperating... she got pregnant as a yearling and bu the time we realized it was way too late to give a shot to try to stop it... she was unable to deliver the baby, we lost them both

it still kills me to talk about it but if sharing the story saves someone else the same pain, it's worth it.

 

[Floridachick]

I erased because It was not my intention to hurt anyones feelings.

 

[kaykay]

Hi Charlotte

I apologize for some of the responses you have received

Please know that I was sincere in saying you can call or email anytime and I will help you with what I can. Everyone has to start somewhere and learning is a big part of the fun!

For some great books (and they are having a sale right now!) try Small Horse Press. They have about every book and dvd on owning, breeding, showing miniature horses Small Horse Press

I think everyone needs to take a deep breath here. Charlotte came asking for advice and help and shes gotten a lot of negative responses which doesn't help anyone!

 

[nightflight]

Welcome to the mini horse world!

As to your catching problem, you might try this....

1) Seperation is a great solution. If you horses can get all the attention they want from other horses, why would deal with you? Great advice so far! (Edit: Applies to catching problem. Horses as social animals vs. running colt with young mare has been talked about by others.)

2) Next time you catch your horses, right before you release them, give them a treat. A really good treat. A few really GREAT treats. With your stallion please do not give him treats while you are working with him. This could lead to biting or just being a PITA later. Leave it until you are done, so the last that memory he has of you is "the treat bringer". Release him, offer him another treat when he comes up to you. When he finally takes it, walk away. Do not attempt to pet, catch or visit. Just leave. Repeat later in the day or the next day. When catching him is no longer an issue (about a week), stop with the treats (fingers are a good thing to have).

At this point in time a good trainer or mentor would be a great asset to you. It will usually take an experienced person a few hours to get your horses on the right track, and give you the tips you need to keep them there. It's a time saver, and an effective simple solution.

If this isn't an option you could also try the Pony Club Books/Manuals. I've given the sets on groundwork and horse care to many new mini owners just because they take everything step-by-step. By teaching you correct behavior, they help you encourage correct behavior in your horses. If you see any bad habits starting at all please pcik up a book or hop on the forum and ask for help right away. You guys are doing it right.

For now, read, rent videos and learn. The reason so many of us put up with the work of horse ownership is because it is a joy. All of us started out where you are now, brand new and learning. Feel free to e-mail, call or smoke signal...

ADDED:

Taking it further, Blessed are the Broodmares is a wonderful book and has saved lives here. The rewards of raising your own foal are right there in front of you, but often people don't talk about the price that breeders pay. I'm there when my horses are born, and also the person that holds them and nods to the vet when it's time for them to leave this earth. If you decide to open yourself up to the joys of rasing foals, you will also have to open yourself to the possibility of heartbreak.

Hang around the mini horse world for awhile, and then talk to us about your goals in breeding, what you like and don't, etc. There are lots of people that will be willing to help you out once you have an understanding of the breed.

Regards,