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Kim Rule

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Okay, My flame suit is carefully put on, zipped, velcroed and buttoned...here goes...

I CAN'T STAND THOSE SHOW CARTS!!!
Now, mind you, I've only driven in one, and it was loaned to me by a really sweet man who had made it. The problem was not the fault of the builder, but in the design of the cart itself. Yet, everyone is driving the darn things for every kind of driving class. It used to be that those darn carts with the bag to put your feet in used to be in a fine harness, or park class. I'm not so sure I would call it appropriate to drive them in a Country Pleasure class. If you are supposed to dress for Country pleasure in your Sunday-Go-To-Meeting best, it's awfully awkward to climb in and out of them. And for this overweight, stiff old bird, it can be incredibly embarrasing!!!


I would like to buy a cart that I could drive in country pleasure classes, and turn around the next weekend and drive in a dressage portion of a CDE. I would like a nice country gig, made of wood, and much more comfortable for me to ride in. I also like the Meadowbrook...they are very nice looking carts, and ride well.

Since showing is such a "fashion" thing, if I was the only one who showed up in a wooden cart, Would I stick out like a sore thumb and not place because "I'm not fitted right" or would I catch the eye of the judge and get placed because I stood out in a crowd? I suppose it would depend on the judge...but I really DON'T want to spend money on a cart I don't like, but I do want to enter classes and get at least half a chance to place...

Kim R
 

rabbitsfizz

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There was at least one Meadowbrook in Country Pleasure yesterday- I LOVE the look of them, they are really classy (I don't like the "sulky" type oh-so-fashionable carts either- I sat in one and I held the shafts while someone else sat in one and I pulled on, and I watched as the horse was driven- coupled with the inadequate show harness, I would NOT have liked to have been the horse!!) I also want one with SPRINGS!!!!!
 

justaboutgeese

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You should be looking at some of antique wagons and carts that are available in most parts of the country. I have spent many years collecting pony pieces and many of them are very suitable for use with minis. Before you ask at this time none of mine are for sale but there are numbers of them available for purchase. Since the variety is so varied you will not have to worry about every other driver showing up with one.
 
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Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis

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Well I think you need to also really try a true show cart and one that is sized for your horse instead of one in a pinch (even though it was great they lent it to you and it was a nice little cart) that might make a big difference - I think also where you want to show meaning local and or Nationals makes a difference and then again how often will you be doing that compared to CDE
 
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Jill

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You would probably like one of the carts I have. It's wooden with metal wheels and is only $500. It's very balanced and a really smooth ride. It has pattent on the shafts. I use a Houghton show cart for shows, but I think this wooden one is nice enough for most of the shows I go to, and is a fraction of the cost. Like you are saying, it's one I feel is okay for the shows, and okay to take out in the field (and I have!).

 

Kim Rule

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Justaboutgeese said...You should be looking at some of antique wagons and carts that are available in most parts of the country. I have spent many years collecting pony pieces and many of them are very suitable for use with minis.

How do I find these??? Okay, I'd like a gig, but I also would LOVE to find a governess cart...though how can I find stuff that I can afford, and that will fit my minis? Fortunately I have B minis that range in size from 35 inches to 37.5. So, I don't have to worry about fitting the really little ones. Where do I start...oh, and is there a place where I can get plans to build a cart, if I so choose??

Lisa, yes, I'm talking about local shows and Nationals. I haven't done Nationals yet...make that YET!!! I am looking down the road a few years and aiming for my goals...I gotta take baby steps to get there, and this cart thing is part of that.

Kim R
 

Ashley

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Count me in as one who hates the jerald carts............as do my boys. IM starting to wondering if that isnt why my one gelding acts up.

I only use them at shows, dont like the way they ride.

I use a easy entry at home. Much better for me. I have one gelding who drives great at home in that but put him in the ring at a show and well..............we normally dont make the driving classes to well.
 

runamuk

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I think.....that part of the problem is even a big miniature cannot pull some of these other carts......many of the governess carts are delightful to look at but would be best pulled by a team ..same with the dog carts, and many viceroys.......by the time you get the components that make those carts look the way they do.....they flat out weigh too much for a mini to really be able to pull ......

I agree the houghton show carts are quite nice of course then you have to buy the fancy custom harness...and once done with that you could have purchased a dang decent car


I believe it was AlB who brought up the idea of using some of the newfangled composites to design a strong yet light cart for miniatures ...that is definately the right idea I think but is down the road a ways.......current standard cart materials are typically heavy but strong .......which is fine for average sized ponies and horses .......

the meadowbrook carts are quite attractive but I hear they weigh 100+ lbs then add my rearend and my poor critter is lugging around well over 200lbs......very tough for a 34-36 inch mini to look light and attractive hauling all that weight more likely to look like it's towing a barge
 

disneyhorse

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I have to say that I LOVE my Jerald cart. It rides sooooo smooth, is perfectly balanced for my horses, and is soooo lightweight.

It IS a pain to "climb in" but isn't that bad... I did wear dresses and all that jazz at Nationals and managed to get in and out just fine


I do have to say that I prefer the closed-wheel carts, they ride a bit higher and I like sitting ABOVE my horse and not deep down behind my horse. Just a preference I think because I started my driving career with draft horses, where you sit VERY high


I don't find getting in and out a huge problem... have you had to ever climb up and down out of a draft horse hitch wagon???

Andrea
 

justaboutgeese

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Some of the above is true. Many of my antique pony pieces would be a struggle for a 28 inch mini. They would also look kind of small beside or infront of my vis-a-vis. But put the team in front and its not a load at all. I have a wagonette that will be a parade piece for the four in hand. I have been training them on a converted buckboard. I say converted because it was built to be pulled by a twelve hand pair but the boys have no trouble stepping right out with it. Many of the pieces will readily fit the larger minis and look good doing it.
 

Margo_C-T

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I hear you, Kim...I don't "hate" the Jeralds, and Houghtons, and Superior Sulkies, and Grabers(pretty much all clones of one another, some a bit better made than others), but have come to realize that they aren't really made for much of anything BUT roundy round in the show ring-and yes, they are a challenge to mount and dismount from, especially when you aren't particularly young and spry(which I'm NOT!!
)

I have done a lot of research on this subject. I have owned both of the styles of Jerald(the closed axle and the open axle type, the second complete with wooden wheels.) When Country Pleasure was added to the line-up of classes, I immediately began showing in it WITHOUT the boot(that cover for the basket), as mine had a basket constructed of wooden slats(some of the early Jeralds had baskets constructed of wide plywood boards, which didn't look so hot without being covered by the boot, and thus 'couldn't' be shown in without it! From then on, I ALWAYS showed in Co. Pleasure without the boot, and never felt discriminated against by judges(though I had a "know-it-all", johnny-come-lately to horses approach me at AMHA Nationals one year to tell me I "couldn't" show without the boot!!! I referred her to the rulebook.....)

After much looking, about 6 years ago, I found, and bought, a lovely and VERY authentic-in-construction-curved fenders, etc.-meadowbrook(though it did have a bit of a gig shaft, but that only made it fit my 33-34" horses better-- but it WAS just too heavy-around 150 lbs. and the driver sat too low -to be a genuine"all around" vehicle. I sold it, and bought a Pequea Road cart, built by John Stoltzfus, in Narvon,PA. It weighs around 110 lbs.,complete with spares box, and is an eminently suitable vehicle for Country Pleasure, yet would work FINE for the Dressage/Presentation portion of a CDE. Before I quit the mini breed show ring, I showed a number of times in both of these vehicles-once I was sure I was discriminated against by some judges because it wasn't what they were 'used to' seeing, but otherwise, we seemed to be judged on a par with all other entries, and did quite well. I am happy with it, but, ordered it before I got my 38" mare, and the 48" shafts are really too short for her-am trying to decide whether to look into having the shafts replaced ....for the mini breed show ring AND VSE CDEs, this cart would be what I would recommend. Country Carriages in S(or N? Don't recall just now)Carolina makes and sells a road cart virtually identical to mine-in fact, likely built by a relative(brother, I *think*)to the man who built mine!-but the one from Pequea is noticably less in price-or was, a year and a half ago! He also makes a nice looking gig, and an authentic Meadowbrook. The exact same cart pictured in Jill's post is also in his brochure-though with all due respect, I wouldn't choose that particular model for my own purposes. Like lots of Amish, he doesn't have a website, but you can contact him for a brochure at 717-768-7016. I also know someone who custom ordered a Graber wooden wheeled, easy entry type cart; however, she doesn't do breed shows, only CDEs-so I don't know how suitable the cart she got would be for breed showing.(I did have someone who actively competes in VSE CDE who emailed me a photo of her competing in a marathon in a Graber-looked like a road cart, and very suitable to the purpose. In any event, since things like road carts and gigs are the EPITOME of Country Pleasure driving, I surely wouldn't be scared off of using them in the mini show ring just because so many people don't really understand/know about them! IMO, this IS changing; I wouldn't be surprised to see the day come when THEY are the "IN" vehicles, for Country Pleasure!!

No matter who you are thinking of ordering from, ask LOTS of questions(i.e., can the seat be balanced, what size wheels are standard, what are optional, and how to measure(you probably know this, but others might not--wooden wheels are measured WITHOUT including the rubber inserts, which add @ 2" to the overall diameter!),how much the entire vehicle will weigh(most of the pipe easy entries weighs around 85 lbs., for comparison)--and the like.

Now, if you were looking JUST for a CDE all-around vehicle....I've ordered a .......

from England, and EAGERLY await its arrival.....but , that's for another thread!

Good luck, whatever you decide!!

Margo
 

Kim Rule

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Wow, you've given me lots to think about. Margo, I'm printing out a copy of your post, so that I can remember the questions to ask. This is WONDERFUL!!
I don't think I'll be buying anything until spring of next year, but I figure I better start looking now...and educating myself! I drive a metal cart right now, and have 24 inch pnumatic wheels on it. I've had extra work done on it, so it's pretty tough. The shafts remove easily, so I figure this cart will do well for marathons...but it isn't pretty...so it won't do for showing or dressage turn out.

Kim R.
 

EAD Minis

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[SIZE=14pt]My neighbour has an awsome Hackney style mini buggy.Now i dont think this is what u are looking for but it is an idea!!Here is an example of it!!Its REALY comfertable and easy to pull!![/SIZE]



[SIZE=14pt]This is Is EXACTLY what it looks like.[/SIZE]
 

rabbitsfizz

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Margo if you have ordered a Bennington you may be in for a disappointment. The guy there spent an hour trying to persuade me it was exactly like the US ones but better- they certainly are very well made, and very versatile BUT the seat is very high up and you sit right above the horse. He could NOT get the idea of sitting lower, even though that is where the full sized carts sit you with a full sized horse!!

A Governess cart would be no good for CDE as you sit sideways in them and the one we have is about as small as you get and just about fits a 39" Shetland- I think it was built for a Donkey as a lot were and the shafts are very short and narrow. It is an antique and we are not about to start mucking about with it so it only goes out on special occasions!!
 

dtdminis

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I am in a wheelchair, so I don't have to hoist this old body into anything ..... so I can't tell you how they ride, but, I have seen some carts that I think are equally "correct" in the breed show ring as in the ADS ring - The first place I saw them was at an HUGE, prestigius, International ADS Carriage Show here near my town. The model they were using was the "ADS STYLE - KATELAND" - and they were painted black. The ring at this show is humungous and the footing very deep, but these minis did not "look" overburdened by these carts - and I've seen a few carts that did make it look like the mini was going to faint from pulling them! I think they would not look out of place at a breed show, so would suit a person who wanted to do both. For ADS driving I love the looks of the Mteadowbrook - and some of the pair vehicles they have on their site are stunning!!

Kateland Farm - Vehicles

Enjoy


Nan
 

dtdminis

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I didn't read all the posts all the way through ... too early for brain function I guess! Anyway ...

Margo C-T wrote: I sold it, and bought a Pequea Road cart, built by John Stoltzfus, in Narvon,PA.
Margo.

John made the cart I use - He's FABULOUS!!! I give him two thumbs up - he does quality work, and if you want something "a lil different" he's open to new thoughts and ideas!

Here's what he did for me:



The cart is so well ballanced that my 36" gelding pulls me AND my wheelchair easily ... of course we haven't tried Cross Country yet!
AND, we even brought home 3 Top Tens from 2001 Nationals - and two of them were "Open" classes - not PMC! This Gelding of mine is a treasure (Thank you again Pam Ford - and again and again and again
).

Nan
 

Minimor

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I guess it's all in how you look at it. To me, the Jerald type show carts are appropriate for Open and Country Pleasure....Fine Harness or Park classes should be a Viceroy...after showing Morgans for years, with the rules specifying that Park horses must be shown to a 4 wheel vehicle, it just isn't right to me to see a park horse hitched to a 2 wheeled cart!

At this point in time I'm looking into getting a cart custom built with longer shafts; we're starting our stallion in harness, and the standard Mini carts just are not going to work. This 37" horse is so long strided, when he gets trotting full out he is going to hit the basket. I was making plans for when we could purchase a show cart, but that has to come AFTER an every-day cart that we can drive safely in. Then I need longer lines, and longer traces....
 

justaboutgeese

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The vehical that One Ritz-c-Kid proposed is a nice one but its a Viceroy that will be in every show a number of times. I was of the understanding she is looking for a unique vehical.
 

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