I Got A Big Time Biter?? How Do I Make Him Stop??

[Marsha Cassada]

I was told there is a short time limit to discipline behavior--as in a few seconds. After that, the horse isn't sure what the reprimand is for.

I have a 9 year old gelding. I got him as a stallion at age 5 and gelded within a few months. He has always been a nipper since I have had him and nothing I have tried has cured him. I think he knows I am a big softy, as I am usually the one he does it to. He has never offered to nip a child. Using a stud chain on our walks has helped quite a lot--a walk on the stud chain with one quick pop at the first nip and he is good for quite a while. He is not a vicious biter--there isn't a mean bone in his body.

If you are not naturally a dominant person, you will have to find some tools/techniques to help you with this behavior, as horses recognize a softy type without fail. "Alpha" type personalities are always telling me what I should or shouldn't do with this behavior, but it doesn't apply realistically. If you are a softy and this stallion is very dominant, be prepared for ongoing challenges.

 

[Jill]

For the record, I do fully agree you need to project the illusion of authority to a horse. They pick up on ques you give off and they can spot fear or a lack of confidence very fast. I'm not a horse beater for sure, but I will continue to physically reprimand any horse that tries to bite me. A slow and easy correction, in my opinion, is the wrong way to go with a big time constant biter. How hard does he have to bite -- or what must he bite off -- before he is corrected physically? What would another horse do? Hurt him back!

 

[New2Minis]

For the record, I do fully agree you need to project the illusion of authority to a horse. They pick up on ques you give off and they can spot fear or a lack of confidence very fast. I'm not a horse beater for sure, but I will continue to physically reprimand any horse that tries to bite me. A slow and easy correction, in my opinion, is the wrong way to go with a big time constant biter. How hard does he have to bite -- or what must he bite off -- before he is corrected physically? What would another horse do? Hurt him back!

Thanks Jill, I think you are right on.....I am not timid around him at all, even if it takes me getting bit (even though that hurts and i dont wanna get bit!)he will not ever since from me that I am scared of him! I am sure he is thinking "Oh Crap, I have met my match!" LOL

 

[Dandy]

Well, I have a coming 4 year old gelding. He was an orphan foal from the age of 2 weeks. He has no respect for humans and never has. He tries to bite all the time. His ears are not back and he is not angry. We have tried nearly everything short of actually really hurting him. I've tried a nail, a crop, a stomp and growl, and turning of the BIG BUTT.(mine) He's a pain in the fanny. We didn't get on to him soon enough and he thinks of us as horses. I won't get rid of him cause I don't want to pawn him off on anyone else. We are trying to give him a job learning to pull a cart. I will say that we have not devoted as much time as we should have to try to correct the behavior, but have tried many things when we work with him. I'll be honest and say I dont know if we worked with him daily that there would be much difference, but since I haven't worked with him every day I can't say for sure. It is very frustrating. We gelded him hoping that would help. It didn't. His mom was not a biter, but she was an in your lap type of girl. His dad is the most gentle, laid back stallion you could ever ask for. You could crawl all over him and he would never think to bite you. I think the bottle feeding is what started it. Good luck and I hope things work out better for you.

 

[lilminiluver]

If you have ruled out any physical problems, I think you don't need to make a point to 'dominate' the animal by force. You are the human. He is the animal. Is he smart? Yes, for a horse! Are you smart? Yes, MUCH smarter than the horse! Does biting have anything to do with intellect? Not a whit.

He is a 2 year old PITA (pain in the....). You can't readily attribute human 'reasons' for the biting to the horse. 'Love nips' aside (those 'oops, I forgot you're a human and I wanna play' nips), repeated nipping is something you just have to learn to work around, either by shoving that cookie in (I loved that one!) or learning the signs of an oncoming nip and NIPPING it in the bud (sorry, I just HAD to say it!!). Remember, even negative attention is attention! You may never stop it, but you can certainly learn to protect yourself and others. It doesn't sound like he has the 'low key' personality you would really like to have, but then again, seldom are they perfect (sort of like us!)....There have been many times a horse that others thought was a little devil was a love for me, and visa versa. It's life in the barn!

Good luck, keep the kids away from him, and remember, you do what you think works best for the horse you know the best!

Hugs!

 

[Marty]

I have but two words for you:

TUNA FISH

When he opens his mouth to bite you, insert the little can..........he will not offer to bite you again. Promise.

 

[FoRebel]

OK, I am going to put in my opinion here. I agree with so many people here. I NEVER beat the horses but with the colts that we have, they are a little mouthy at times. I broke the one colt like you break puppies of bitting. Everytime he went to bite me I grabbed his lower jaw with his tounge in my hand and said "NO BITE". It worked. I have also bit back when they bite me. The colt that was born on our farm this year, I used a combination of the earlier with the bitting back. I used to sit in the stall and lay him in my lap. He got to the point where he figured that he could bite me. I just bit him back. His mare did it to him too. He hasn't bit since he was 6 weeks old.

There's some theories that I have about bitting with young horses. Hope you find something that works for you!

 

[DunPainted]

I have but two words for you:

TUNA FISH

When he opens his mouth to bite you, insert the little can..........he will not offer to bite you again. Promise.

:risa_suelos: :risa_suelos: :risa_suelos: ANY PARTICULAR BRAND? :risa_suelos: :risa_suelos: :risa_suelos:
Sorry folks, couldn't help it!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

You know Marty- only the best for her horses!!!

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

As I have said, you can take the short, aggressive, "fix" or you can teach him not to do it, it is up to you.

Aggression breeds aggression, force is met with force.

If you hit him and, instead of running away he turns round and starts kicking you, or rears up and slaps at you, he is reacting as any young stallion, faced with another one fighting him, would do.

So, if this happens, what do you do then??

Use even more force??

Punish him even more severely for acting as a normal high spirited youngster??

Or teach him firmly and quietly that this is not how you wish him to behave???

I strongly disagree and frankly am shocked that one who uses the "natural enviroment type atmosphere" would agree with this as well.

Jane you are always talking about horses and the natural order well I dont know any boss mare who would allow a colt to act like this. It is dealt with swiftly, strongly so the message gets across.

I personally dont assume every time a horse is showing no manners it is simply cause he wants to play- if your act of discipline is met with a stronger act of agression by a horse well again personally i would react to that the way a boss mare would NOT ACCEPTABLE.

Call me a horse beater if you must (however anyone who knows me knows otherwise) however biting is not ok especially if done with agression and I treat it as the ultimate sin. I go after then quickly, and harshly, if they are close enough to hit them I do if they have bitten and ran I chase them I will say that most of my horses dont need reminding more then a couple of times and after that it can be a simple Quit and they get the message. My stallions have all been well mannered and easy going and easily handled by a child even during breeding I don't expect alot of them however I do expect them to be safe and not agressive they are very clear as to what the expectations are and know exactly what to expect if they cross the line. I rarely have to raise my voice or hit but I surely wont let agressive behavior slide either.

Now all of that said I have a spoiled rotten gelding he doesnt bite never has however if he thinks you have treats or in the show ring bait he has been known to pants you if he can to get the treat- he is busy and annoying (and cute as can be) but never bites and never is agressive he is just amusing himself and therefore I deal with him differently then I would a horse who pins his ears and comes after me.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

You give this advise without knowing why the horse is biting and assuming it to be aggression??

I am tired of hearing that if a horse turns it's backside on you it is showing aggression.

If a horse rears up it is showing aggression/dominance.

If a horse attempts to bite it is showing aggression.

Horses are not very aggressive animals.

I do not , therefore, assume it is aggression, I assume it is misguided play.

That is the main difference.

Once upon a time I might have thought as you do, I have certainly tried the "Boss Mare " thing and it works but I have yet to see a horse hit another horse with a crop or yell "quit"

If you are talking in a language the horse understands, fine, but horses rarely actually kick one another- wounding another member of the herd is counter productive, what they do is threaten to hurt and that is a whole different ball game.

Stallions may well hurt one another when fighting, but again, one normally quits well ahead of real damage.

Nowadays I would rather stand back and look at the problems from all the angles before advising someone to hit their horse.

None of my horses bite, none kick, none rear as a rule, although my colt reared today as I was leading him out.

Did I reprimand him??

No, not the first time, and it did not happen again, I just looked at him hard and raised my head, that is usually enough.

I am too old and too tired to do all this "short sharp shock" thing anymore, and, to be honest, I am really glad that I am.

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

LOL

well I guess there is only one person here who knows there way around a horse one who "one upon a time " used to be as silly as most of us when it came to horse care and horsemanship.

Well at least it saves everyone time from bothering to read anyone elses posts or those of us who may have years of experience infact many a lifetime of experience from bothering to answer

:

* said with a VERY sarcastic grin*

Ok yes taking my time out now ML

:

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Lisa I have NO idea why you have to put such a horrible slant on what I say.

You must know, as most do, that that is NOT what I meant at all.

However I guess you can read into things anything you want if you are determined to do so.

 

[Jill]

Lisa, for whatever it's worth, I'm happy to count YOU among the knowledgable in this situation

:

 

[~Karen~]

Well, I vote the tuna can trick! :~) I bet a nasty taste placed in the mouth would work, "cause and effect"!

I bought an old brush goat billy once, never had one befre and never will again... they stink to high heaven! But where I am going with this is I got him to keep a mare of mine company. When he thought he was going to share my mares grain with her, well, it lead to a few events that neither of them enjoyed and we all wished we had on video for funniest videos! My Fox Trotter mare picked him plumb up off the ground by the nap of his neck, then had this puzzled look on her face like she wasn't sure what to do next, that billy just hanging in the air, with this strange puzzled look on his face as well! Next thing, my mare dropped him and started making these horrible, aweful faces, spitting and sputtering, the billy backing up until he couldn't back away any further! The mare thought she would rid the nasty taste in her mouth with a bite of grain, but she spit the grain out with no such luck, the taste was just too nasty. I must say, for the rest of the 2 weeks I had him (couldn't stand the smell, lol), those 2 never crossed pathes again!

SOOOO... back to the tuna! Put some nasty taste in his mouth.... cause and effect! Just a hunch, but I bet he will never try to nip or bite again... have others carry the nasty stuff to put into his mouth as well if they go around him, then he could associate that nasty taste with humans. ;~)

~Karen

 

[New2Minis]

If all else fails, would a muzzle work.........LOL! So far her is still a biting little fool but I haven't come "unglued" on him YET!!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Actually that is a very sensible suggestion- can you try it??

I would use it with a dog, and have done, so why not a horse??

Or you could try bitting him- I have used that on a young colt who used to nip at me in the ring- I had nothing attached to the bit, I still led him off the nose.

It worked on an Arab we had as well.

 

[Relic]

Call in someone who can show you how to put a colt in his place the little guy will thankyou. Simple fast and life can go smoother for all concerned. Or send him up here my daughter says she will have him kissing not biting in less then an hour. :bgrin

 

[Reble]

Milo ( Lori ) I am sorry, I know you are a horse trainer, But:::::

"Quote"

The nails in the hand are a good replacement for "teeth" and as you are carrying them and he essentially runs into them himself and gets an instant punishment for his behaviour they work rather well. :new_shocked:

I agree with rabbitsfizz do not use force, you want your horse to respect you and feel safe around you.

Since you did not raise him, he has already been punished. In my opinon. Scared and needs more time to settle in.

Not the word NO sounds like Whoa,

Use the Shhhhhhhhhhhh sound and clip under the chin will do the trick, never the face or other objects, lets face it when he goes to bite I bet you do not have the crop in hand.

I agree with rabbitsfizz do not need too much force, you want your horse to respect you and feel safe around you.

It will take a few times, but he will relate to the shhhhhhhhhhhhh sound and the clip (open hand) under the chin, is the safest place. Sometimes it is your first reaction that counts.

I normally do not like to react to questions and answers but:::

Good Luck,

:

 

[New2Minis]

Thanks for all the advice.......but let me ad.................he is NOT afraid , he is quite sure of himself and the main problem "in my opinion" is that his previous owner DID NOT correct him. She was very timid around him and he ruled!!!!

PS Can someone tell me how to post pictures of my little Devil, lol!!!