Dwarf friend needs help with kicking gelding....

[minimule]

I have a friend, a dwarf, that has a problem horse. This little guy is tiny but very full of himself. He wasn't gelded until he was 2 but probably should have been gelded as a weanling. He was gelded almost a year ago now. He has always been very studdy and pushy. She also has a sweet boy she got from me last year that is a big love bug and a small pony (someday will be her riding horse!).

The problem is that Harry is kicking at her and has hit her a couple of times. He is getting pushier and more aggressive. She isn't big enough to do much with him. I've told her about Bonnie but not sure she'll do that.

Help??????? Suggestions??????

 

[Equuisize]

Some years ago I used to take my 4H kids to a clinic where this

incredible horseman gave the best info and help to kids I'd ever

had contact with.... He designed each clinic around the needs

of the people attending, their questions and needs.

In response to a question about a kicker, he told a story about

a Morgan horse that had been thru trainer after trainer as the

owner tried to have him cured of his kicking.

He said he stood outside the stall watching this horse's

threatening behaviors before he picked up a metal garbage can

lid and walked into the stall with the horse.

Protecting himself, he stood to the side and held the garbage can

lid out as the horse kicked out with his rear legs....he hit the lid,

stopped in his tracks and looked back like what was that? He

said it took a several lessons with the horse before it changed his

behavior. Didn't hurt him but startled him each time.

His theory was that the horse learned that he was causing the

unpleasant noise himself.

Never had reason to use this method myself but it's stayed in

my mind.

 

[minimule]

Neat idea. I'll tell her about it but I don't know if she would be big enough (maybe not brave enough) to try it herself. Maybe I'll offer to bring him home and try it myself......

 

[~Lisa~]

I am not a huge fan but have had to use this on a stud years back- what about kick chains? I just used dog choke chains and used a cat collar to put on the back legs and attached the chain to that.

 

[Miniv]

Sorry.......but it doesn't matter if he's a dwarf or not. I'd still teach him the same......... He'd get disciplined and trained as if he was a "regular" mini stallion.

 

[~Dan]

I had this issue with my mare Polly, only she would charge you out of the paddock. I took Jill's advice, bought a crop, and whenever she would do it, I would really lay it into her shoulder, two or three try's, and well she hasn't done it since, and that was last July. Best of luck.

MiniV- I think she meant a dwarf person.

 

[Miniv]

MiniV- I think she meant a dwarf person.

Aha.......shows where my mind goes. Hey, if it were a human child that was a "dwarf" acting up, I'd say the same!

 

[LindaL]

Sorry.......but it doesn't matter if he's a dwarf or not. I'd still teach him the same......... He'd get disciplined and trained as if he was a "regular" mini stallion.

The human is the dwarf ; not the Mini.

(edited...oops...we posted at same time...lol)

I used to own a stud that was "food aggressive" (with me), so I taught him to back when I came in to his stall or pasture. It took him respect...maybe backing isnt the right thing for him, but some sort of behavior needs to be taught that teaches him to respect her. Sorry I'm not more help. I've never dealt with a kicker before (except a devil mare when she had a foal!)

 

[liltnt]

I vote ofr the loud noise. One of the clicker training books uses this meathod also and from outside the stall. Might take two people to do it though one to get kicked at and one to make the noise.

 

[minimule]

Sorry.......but it doesn't matter if he's a dwarf or not. I'd still teach him the same......... He'd get disciplined and trained as if he was a "regular" mini stallion.

Yes it's the owner that is the dwarf! She stands just under 3' tall! Her husband is also a dwarf but he isn't any help. He has to walk with crutches and when Harry is acting up, he can't be in the area. Harry has always been very studdy and now, even though gelded, is just as studdy.

I'll offer her the suggestions and if she doens't have someone else, I'll go help her out. Our schedules just don't jive very often.

 

[mizbeth]

It sounds like Harry has forgotten his manners and the new owners let him get away with bad behavoir. Gelding does not correct this. Perhaps if you took him back for a period of time and reminded him of his manners, he will do just fine for them.

He sounds spoiled to me. These little horses are very smart and he should learn quickly. If this behavoir happens again after his retraining, then I would suggest a different horse for them. Some horses better fit certain personalities than others.

Good luck,

Beth

 

[AppyLover2]

This may sound naive (and I apologize if it is), but I would't think the physical size of the handler would be an issue unless she is intimidated by him. Our ability to reason and outsmart them has nothing to do with our size. She needs the confidence to demand his respect.

 

[Annabellarose]

This may sound naive (and I apologize if it is), but I would't think the physical size of the handler would be an issue unless she is intimidated by him. Our ability to reason and outsmart them has nothing to do with our size. She needs the confidence to demand his respect.

I don't think that's naive of you at all! However, I do think a legitimate concern is that she is more danger due to her height. If a Miniature Horse were to kick me (and I weren't bent over), I would likely only get hit from the waste down and I would probably get hit in the shins (which could still break a bone or damage an internal organ), but my head would likely be safe. I would think that she would be far more likely to be kicked in the head and you really need your head!

 

[Rocky1]

I second the crop idea. She'll have to carry the crop whenever shes around him and if he goes to kick her agian, she'll have to hit him across the legs that are kicking at her. A loud "NO" along with the smack would be a good idea too. Don't be exessive with the crop, 1 good smack across the leg(s), that are kicking at her, should be good. This method should work within a couple of days/ a couple of kicks. Horses generally learn something within 2-3 tries, so he should figure out quickly that kicking at her is not a good idea.

If she can't get a crop right away, then a short 2' stick(stripped of twigs/leaves..etc) will do fine.

I had a draft mare, that was on stall rest, kick at me once when I was cleaning her hooves. She got a very loud yell"NO" and a smack(with my hand) across her leg and chased around her stall, once, to let her know that kicking at me was NOT allowed. She never kicked at me again. I know why she kicked at me was because she was tired of being cooped up and having me clean her wound(which was slightly painful) and she was frustrated at me, but that's no excuse and I let her know it.

Having any horse kick at you is serious and even though this guy is a Mini, the owner is small enough that the size comparison is probably equal to a normal sized horse for us and this situation is dangerous for her and should be dealt with quickly.

If this method is too hard for her to do, then she should get a trainer in today..the problem is not going to get any better if nothing is done.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Well, technically I am a dwarf, and I am afraid it is one of the things that made me so aggressive, verbally and physically, although I never got control of my mouth I have got control of my body and that, in it's turn, has made me cringe when anyone suggests hitting a horse with ...well, anything, actually!!

I totally agree that this woman has to protect herself but using aggression against an aggressive animal, especially a prey animal that is not normally aggressive, could just make it, justifiably, even more aggressive.

I think she needs to get to the bottom of why the horse is like this as I can assure you kicking and being aggressive is not "studdy" behaviour!!

I am therefore assuming you mean he still acts like a stallion with other horses?

In which case she needs to talk to the vet that gelded him, and quite quickly, and see if he was done properly, and enough cord taken.

No-one can really explain why leaving too much cord causes "riggy" behaviour but it is a proven fact that it does, and re-gelding the horse can easily eliminate the problem.

If none of this applies, then I would have Bonny talk to him, there is always a reason for aggression and it is very rarely that the horse is "mean".

 

[Peggy Hogan]

Food for thought....

I had a mini in training who would rear, strike, kick and bite, and aggression only egged him on. I really subscribe to the idea that if you can teach a behavior that is "incompatible" with the one you don't want, and really reward that behavior, the horse will make the change.

So for rearing I trained him to LOVE putting his feet on a mat (eventually it became a virtual mat LOL)

For biting I trained him that keeping his head forward touching the target really paid off.

For biting my feet (yes...he loved to bite feet) I taught him that keeping his head forward and "high" was the best way to earn rewards.

For kicking I taught him that if he kept his front feet on a pedestal and yielded his hind end his life would be great. He then learned that yielding the hind end was good for a click/treat.

Also, for kicking I taught him if he'd put his nose on the target while I walked around him he could get a bite of pellets.

The trick is to be proactive and catch GOOD behavior and reinforce it.

This was not an easy case, but it sure was rewarding when I saw how happy and settled this horse became. Some of you might recognize this horse as the one in Cart training part One video.

(The trash can lid sounds creative though...)

Still...the bottom line is keeping everyone, horse and human safe. So I hope your friend gets help.