Weanling woes

[Lakewood5]

Hi again!

I finally have my two weanlings home with me. Both are just the sweetest little things. Both came from nationals, the colt showed in a futurity class and my filly just hitched a ride. Both were on Ulcergard during their stay at nationals. The filly had had quite a long journey, riding with two different haulers all the way from California to NY.
Her first night home, she scarfed down the mare and foal grain I had for her. She came with that potbelly look, and was on the miniature horse and pony Grain by purina at her breeders. I’ve bought purina mare and foal, omelene 200, 300 and I also have senior on hand for my older minis. After the first night, she won’t touch grain. I’ve tried all 4 on her, she’ll sniff and pick but won’t eat. The only thing I’ve gotten her to eat willingly is chopped alfalfa, hay, and some calf manna. She loves the calf manna.
I’m leaning towards ulcers given how much she’s been through to get to me, and how common ulcers are in the wee ones. Besides her not eating grain…she has a large potbelly. I know this can mean she needs more protein, but I’ve also heard it can indicate ulcers. She’s been wormed just yesterday. She has lost weight in her top line and doesn’t have the best muscling. Her coat isn’t great, not super dull but it’s not gleaming like the colts coat is. He is doing fantastic by the way. She also isn’t running and playing around like he is or like I’d expect a weanling to do. I also have yet to see her roll during turnout. When walking, she’s very reluctant. Some days it’s like I have to pull her to turn her out. What I’m trying to decide is if this is because she doesn’t feel well, or if it’s a need for more training. Or a combo of both.
I plan to make a call to my vet on Monday if she doesn’t improve. Currently she has no fever, no other symptoms, drinking, pooping, and urinating normally. I started giving her 3cc of Aloe Vera juice a day, and I’ve started her on a 1/4 syringe of Ulcergard daily for the next month.
So I guess my question is…anyone have weanlings with ulcers and have the same issues? Can I over feed alfalfa to a little one if that’s all she’s willing to eat at the moment? And calf manna…my goodness she loves it. I’m only feeding a 20 oz scoop twice a day because I assumed it was only meant to be a supplement. But if she’s not eating any grain…how much calf manna should I feed? Thanks in advance!

 

[chandab]

Is that a typo? A 20oz scoop would be a lot of it, as that's 2.5 cups; so would be a lot to start with, even if not too much for growth. Calf Manna is essentially a ration balancer, so has a low feed rate compared to a fortified feed. Typical feed rates for a ration balancer is 1-2#/1000#BW for adult maintenance, more for growth; I'd have to look at the rates for CM specifically, but likely directions are for horses expected to mature at 1000-1200#, so it'll take some math to figure out amounts for a miniature weanling. [Most pelleted feeds weigh up at about 3 cups per pound (standard dry measure kitchen cups), always best to weigh the feed you are using to be certain, especially with minis).]
How big is she expected to mature? Knowing this will help determine how much CM she can/should have. While CM isn't equine specific, I'd feed it before feeding the Purina mini and pony feed. I wouldn't be surprised if she had ulcers, she's had a busy and stressful few days of travel to get to you, along with the stress of weaning. For now, I'd leave her on the CM and we just need to do some math to see how much she should have along with her hay, I'd prefer no more than 20-25% of the hay be alfalfa, and the rest grass, it's easier to balance nutritionally.

 

[MaryFlora]

Hi! Congratulations on your minis!!! Very exciting!

My first thought, she is a baby and has been through an incredibly hard trip, no matter how well she may have been cared for along the way. Babies often have a potbelly and over time, grow up and develop a different profile. They need a generous amount of time to be babies and just develop, especially one that has left everything familiar behind. Horses are very adaptable and she will no doubt settle in and thrive under your care.

The formula of Purina Miniature Horse and Pony is not the same as another Purina product. If you cannot get what the breeder fed, I would stick with mare and foal. Consistency in feeding is especially important, I believe, in very young horses and very old.

Calf manna is a supplement and the recommended feeding for a foal is 8 ounces daily. If possible, call the company for their input. Whenever I call a feed/supplement company, (or use their chat line) it has been extremely helpful.

I know members on the forum use Ulcergard to great effect, so, perhaps they will jump in with their thoughts.

These are just my thoughts based upon my individual experience, and I’m definitely a big fan of time - not neglect, just allowing enough time for a program, lesson, experience to develop, and ‘enough’ time is a very fluid concept.

You will probably get generous input from other members and sometimes very differing advice, again based on our experiences, location, and horses. Horses and nutrition is definitely a science and one with almost endless variables!

Calling your vet is a great idea! They are usually a great source of information!

Looking forward to watching them grow with you!

 

[LostandFound]

You've got a lot going on here. The being reluctant to walk thing is easy to figure out. If she walks around fine by herself it's a training issue and a pretty common one at that. A foal might lead like an anchor one day and a bottle rocket the next for pretty much no particular reason. But a mopey, slow moving foal has something going on for sure. That does seem like a lot of calf manna to me, and might be giving her some gas and causing the bloating. Ulcerguard is omeprazole and it is not something you can just stop taking in people. It causes a rebound effect which is way worse than the original issue. I don't have much horse experience with it, but for people you want a week of taking it, then another 10 days to wean off it by cutting the dose, then doing it every other day until you stop. So if she was on it and just stopped, ulcers are extremely likely.
Some babies handle stress better than others and it seems like this is a lot for her. You might have some luck if you feed her with the other weanling. Or maybe mixing the grain in with some soaked alfalfa pellets. Or just letting the grain in her feeder all day and letting her pick at it. My minis get about a cup to cup and a half of grain depending on what kind of work they are in.
Wait, 1/4 a syringe of ulcerguard? Is that a full horse dose? No amount of anything you give her should be a horse dose. You might want to have the vet out and check with dosages and feed amounts first.

 

[Lakewood5]

Is that a typo? A 20oz scoop would be a lot of it, as that's 2.5 cups; so would be a lot to start with, even if not too much for growth. Calf Manna is essentially a ration balancer, so has a low feed rate compared to a fortified feed. Typical feed rates for a ration balancer is 1-2#/1000#BW for adult maintenance, more for growth; I'd have to look at the rates for CM specifically, but likely directions are for horses expected to mature at 1000-1200#, so it'll take some math to figure out amounts for a miniature weanling. [Most pelleted feeds weigh up at about 3 cups per pound (standard dry measure kitchen cups), always best to weigh the feed you are using to be certain, especially with minis).]
How big is she expected to mature? Knowing this will help determine how much CM she can/should have. While CM isn't equine specific, I'd feed it before feeding the Purina mini and pony feed. I wouldn't be surprised if she had ulcers, she's had a busy and stressful few days of travel to get to you, along with the stress of weaning. For now, I'd leave her on the CM and we just need to do some math to see how much she should have along with her hay, I'd prefer no more than 20-25% of the hay be alfalfa, and the rest grass, it's easier to balance nutritionally.

Oh my gosh…oops. I should proofread lol. Yes that was a typo. 2 OZ scoop. 3 times a day. If I math right…she should be getting about a tenth of a pound a day. But Id have to sit down and do it on paper for her expected estimated height/weight. She’s expected to mature around 32-33”
I agree with the mini horse and pony feed…I’ve never been a fan. Her breeder had her on it and she came with a pot belly, so I’m assuming it was doing her no favors. I don’t have her on it currently at all…since there was time between when she left her home and came to me, I figured I just as well may introduce a new grain slowly rather than buy a bag of her old to wean her off. Thank you for your reply!

 

[HersheyMint]

I'm hoping she improves. Keep us posted on how she is doing.

 

[chandab]

Oh my gosh…oops. I should proofread lol. Yes that was a typo. 2 OZ scoop. 3 times a day. If I math right…she should be getting about a tenth of a pound a day. But Id have to sit down and do it on paper for her expected estimated height/weight. She’s expected to mature around 32-33”
I agree with the mini horse and pony feed…I’ve never been a fan. Her breeder had her on it and she came with a pot belly, so I’m assuming it was doing her no favors. I don’t have her on it currently at all…since there was time between when she left her home and came to me, I figured I just as well may introduce a new grain slowly rather than buy a bag of her old to wean her off. Thank you for your reply!

Does that scoop hold 2oz by weight or is it a 2oz volume? Just to clarify. 6oz (weight) per day for a mini foal, probably isn't too much, as Calf Manna is essentially the "original" ration balancer, it's just all-species rather than equine specific, so fine for now, but probably need to get her moved over to an equine specific product. Being the CM has a flavor most like, it'll probably help transition her over to either an equine specific balancer or an appropriate mare/foal feed.

 

[madmax]

Hi again!

I finally have my two weanlings home with me. Both are just the sweetest little things. Both came from nationals, the colt showed in a futurity class and my filly just hitched a ride. Both were on Ulcergard during their stay at nationals. The filly had had quite a long journey, riding with two different haulers all the way from California to NY.
Her first night home, she scarfed down the mare and foal grain I had for her. She came with that potbelly look, and was on the miniature horse and pony Grain by purina at her breeders. I’ve bought purina mare and foal, omelene 200, 300 and I also have senior on hand for my older minis. After the first night, she won’t touch grain. I’ve tried all 4 on her, she’ll sniff and pick but won’t eat. The only thing I’ve gotten her to eat willingly is chopped alfalfa, hay, and some calf manna. She loves the calf manna.
I’m leaning towards ulcers given how much she’s been through to get to me, and how common ulcers are in the wee ones. Besides her not eating grain…she has a large potbelly. I know this can mean she needs more protein, but I’ve also heard it can indicate ulcers. She’s been wormed just yesterday. She has lost weight in her top line and doesn’t have the best muscling. Her coat isn’t great, not super dull but it’s not gleaming like the colts coat is. He is doing fantastic by the way. She also isn’t running and playing around like he is or like I’d expect a weanling to do. I also have yet to see her roll during turnout. When walking, she’s very reluctant. Some days it’s like I have to pull her to turn her out. What I’m trying to decide is if this is because she doesn’t feel well, or if it’s a need for more training. Or a combo of both.
I plan to make a call to my vet on Monday if she doesn’t improve. Currently she has no fever, no other symptoms, drinking, pooping, and urinating normally. I started giving her 3cc of Aloe Vera juice a day, and I’ve started her on a 1/4 syringe of Ulcergard daily for the next month.
So I guess my question is…anyone have weanlings with ulcers and have the same issues? Can I over feed alfalfa to a little one if that’s all she’s willing to eat at the moment? And calf manna…my goodness she loves it. I’m only feeding a 20 oz scoop twice a day because I assumed it was only meant to be a supplement. But if she’s not eating any grain…how much calf manna should I feed? Thanks in advance!

Do you have a kind gentle adult marre that could be a step mother companion for comfort? Might be she is still depressed from weaning as well as her long trip

 

[DB Minis]

Congratulations on your new babies! Your filly is very smart, eating grain can be painful with ulcers and high calcium foods like alfalfa can be soothing with ulcers (like antacids for humans) so along with all her other symptoms she is definitely telling you she's feeling pain.

She will be okay without grain, a forage-based diet is very ideal even for growing babies. Alfalfa is very good for her right now and aloe vera juice is a wonderful addition for soothing ulcers and other stomach issues. Myself and some others here have used a 1/4 cup of aloe vera juice with good results. Calf manna is grain based too so I would hesitate using this, the taste may be so good she is overpowering her pain to have some.

Give some time for the good foods and Ulcergard to start her healing, and like Lostandfound mentioned you will want to wean off the Ulcergard slowly so the stomach acid doesn't come back so strongly it brings back the ulcers. Continue watching her for improvement or other symptoms and be forgiving as she battles through this, ulcers are so common and no fun to deal with!