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Minimor

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What's your opinion of Cesar Millan and his dog training techniques?

A friend was raving about him recently. We don't get the channel that airs his show so I had never seen or heard of him before and am just curious if he's really as wonderful as this friend says?
 
Geez, my post went poof! Must be the Ouija Board thread filtering it's way over here
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Basically some good and some not so good.
 
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What do you think of Cesar Millan?
 
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Ok, I'll bite....and put on my flame suit

Basically he's set the dog training world BACK about 30 years. Though yes, SOME of his techniques MAY appear good and at the base of them they are good training techniques, you don't ACTUALLY get to see HOW he goes about getting the dogs that way...jmo....kinda like some horse trainers. Looks good from the outside, but when you really see how it's done...that's a different story. I also have some real issues with people watching his show and trying 'techniques' out on their dogs, when those 'techniques' are NOT what's needed in their situations...but again it's like horse training....

~kathryn
 
Exactly, Anoki. That's why I linked to the article by Jean Donaldson (http://www.perfectpaws.com for those who want more information on just who she is). Dr. Ian Dunbar (http://www.dogstardaily.com) is yet another highly qualified individual (a veterinary behaviorist) who doesn't agree with Millan's methods, and there are many others.
 
kathryn, i'll be the LAST one to flame you for that opinion! that man is downright dangerous, if you ask me. i would hate to see the carnage left behind when he leaves one of those "red zone" cases with an owner who is clueless. he's probably done way more harm than good!
 
Thank you for those links mininik--when I did a search on his name I didn't come up with those sites. It's not that I'm looking for a dog trainer, just that this gal was raving about how good Cesar is and just from the things she said about him I had the feeling that a good many people wouldn't care for him. Okay, I had the feeling that I wouldn't care for him!
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But, I'm not about to subscribe to cable TV nor buy his book in order to see for myself and so was just curious about what others think of him.

This friend doesn't have internet; I think I'll print out a few of those website & give them to her. She can read about what she doesn't see/hear on Cesar's TV show.

Thank you too to those who sent PM's. As I said, I am not looking for a dog trainer, nor even dog training advice, but if I were I'm quite certain Cesar isn't the trainer I would turn to. I don't have pitbulls. I have a Shepherd that doesn't need further training, and I'm currently working with my collie...my WIMPY little collie...and I know for a fact that Cesar's methods would not work on her!
 
I love the man and 99% of his ideas and methods.

He has helped so many people use their brains and THINK. Things most of us take for granted such as us seasoned horse people, a newbie just sometimes needs to learn leadership and common animal sense when it doesn't come naturally. Caesar explains how the nature of the dog thinks in his mind so he makes it easier to explain to the people that way, such as how horse people will say "we have to become alpha and the dominant one of our herd", so it is with dogs. I often say that some horses that are trouble some and ill mannered have to much time on their hands and need a job. Caesar uses that same method basically in encouraging people to walk and exercise their dogs and not leave them to their own devices. I give a huge thumbs up to the man for sure.
 
"we have to become alpha and the dominant one of our herd", so it is with dogs"

Sorry, Marty (and anyone else who believes it), but that theory is such outdated jibberish. (And it's not just me saying so, either!)

Whales and dolphins live in very complex social groups just as dogs and horses can, but you won't see their trainers neck grabbing, alpha rolling, or shanking them into compliance. Just because we can get away with it (USUALLY) with dogs and horses does not mean it's right. Violence begins where knowledge ends; there is a better way!

I recommend you all read The Culture Clash by Jean Donaldson and Don't Shoot the Dog! by Karen Pryor. If nothing else, PLEASE read the American Veterinary Society of ANIMAL Behavior's positions on

Dominance:

http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonline/ima...20statement.pdf

and

Punishment:

http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonline/ima..._Statements.pdf

"People who rely on dominance theory to

train their pets may need to regularly threaten

them with aggressive displays or repeatedly

use physical force. Conversely, pets subjected

to threats or force may not offer submissive

behaviors. Instead, they may react with aggression,

not because they are trying to be dominant

but because the human threatening them makes

them afraid.

Third, in the wild, even in dominancesubmissive

relationships that are well-established,

the relationship lasts only as long as the

higher-ranking individual is strong enough to

retain this rank. Thus, high rank may be shortlived

in both human-animal and animal-animal

relationships.

Overall, the use of dominance theory to

understand human-animal interactions leads to

an antagonistic relationship between owners and

their pets."
 
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oh darn nik, maybe i should have said THE PACK LEADER LOL
 
I respect anyone who dedicates so much time to rehabbing dogs many feel should be put down. He allows pits to live a normal and social life after being in bad situations. I think that is wonderful.
 
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While Ceaser may have "good" points in parts of his regimen, the base upon which he lays his "training" is steeped in cruelty and ignorance of canine psychology. I say this as a court appointed expert in canine behavior.

He approached us a number of years ago specific to acquiring one of our dog carts. Course I was all excited about having another "big name" on board until I talked to a very wise dog friend of mine who quickly gave me the low down on his practice. She quickly set me straight on the "dog whisperer". I have always thought it curious that a man with such a moniker would train in such a heavy handed way. The words "whisper" and brute force are diametrically opposed. In my opinion the man is a bully with a little marketing savvy. (Well more marketing savvy than I anyway...<G>)

I also found it curious that, when we were contacted, that he would not speak directly to me even though he was sitting beside his intermediary. My instincts don't trust him as for business deals and I would NEVER let him near one of my dogs. We decided that guilt by association was not for us.

Your star crossed friend is not looking deep enough. In pro dog circles Ceaser is a well known (and dismissed) factor. The only reason he is still getting any play is because of the P.T. Barnum effect IMO.

Just my opinion,

Bb

Canine Carriages

www.caninecarriages.com

Graham Carriage Works

www.grahamcarriageworks.com
 
I think that some people have a "presence" of authority that dogs can recognize. Thats why some people can work with even the worst behaved dogs & turn them around. But I also think that once this presence is removed from the dogs life, that the dog can very well revert to the problem & sometimes dangerous behavior. I think that perhaps Cesar can work with some of the behavior problem dogs when others can't, & yes perhaps his methods off camera may be not what everyone sees. I guess the big question is, what happens when he leaves? for instance the show with the white shepherd that was attacking the children in the household & was so dangerous that even Cesar had to first approach him with a trash can lid for safety. yes the dog was better behaved after his training, but frankly, I would never trust a dog that exhibited that type of behavior to be around my children again. It only takes one bite.... That same family could have adopted a sweet natured dog from their local shelter & gone on to have a loving pet that they didnt have to worry about.

I like Victoria Stillwells training methods. Like horses, I think that dogs have a language & once we learn the language, their body behavior & recognize that active dogs are usually happier dogs then we have less behavior problems. So many problems come from getting a cute puppy, no initial training or socialization & then after awhile it becomes an afterthought in the backyard. Chewing, jumping, barking, nipping for attention & boredom.

I have seen Cesar in person & also at Humane Society gatherings ( I ran a non profit vet clinic & shelter & attended seminars). Again, he does alot that others can't with the same dog. I just have a question as to what happens when he is no longer around these dogs. And remember, TV is edited, watching him day to day in real time would be a different story. It is not as quick and easy as a 30 minute edited TV program shows.
 
I watched his show a few times, and I'm not a fan. I don't agree with most of his training methods. That and he seems to contradict himself a lot. One minute he says that pit bulls (an example since my lab is part pit) are get when trained, and then next he's saying they're agressive. Well I did my research to see mainly what health issues we might face with Duke, and pits are one of the greatest dogs to have around kids (when trained properly). He acts like all the "non-agressive" breeds are great, but in fact any dog can turn on someone. So I stopped watching him, and I stopped watching It's Me or the Dog (not a fan of her either).
 
I like Victoria Stillwells training methods. .

I have to say I find her a joke. She does seem to do better changing the behavior of the humans more then the animals and maybe that in turn solves some of the training issues they have?
 
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