Geld 'em!

[mininik]

http://www.nchorsenews.com/Geld%20em.htm

I think it would be wonderful if just ONE Miniature was gelded thanks to someone reading this article.

 

[Jill]

Good article! It's a shame more mini people do not realize the value of a nice gelding, and it's a shame there are so many miniature breeding stallions who if gelded would only be pet quality geldings (yet are siring pet quality fillies and colts who will probably be bred as well...). I love geldings and will continue to geld even the nicest of colts when I want that horse to be a gelding (for myself or for others).

 

[SweetOpal]

my vet will be here in 30 min and we are gelding 3 boys today, a weanling, yearling, and 2 year old. It would be great if others would geld but unfortunately this is one of the only breeds I know that doesn't beleive in gelding. We seem to have blinders that tell us they are all perfect and wonderful stallions.

I especially like reason # 2 for the debunking reasons! Priceless really, thanks Nicole for posting that.

 

[Buckskin gal]

Good reading material. What I might add is if there wasn't the overproduction of horses there wouldn't be the need to fix so many and there would also be fewer stallions. Unfortunately where minis are a "breeding" breed, it appears more stallions are in demand then geldings. If there was less promoting of breeding and selling and more promotion of fewer breedings there would be far fewer problems. We just aren't going to see this happen because too many use their right to breed and registeries don't want to see fewer foals being produced. Just my thoughts. Mary

 

[backwoodsnanny]

We have gelded in the past and will again in the future but $350 for one gelding is alot when a colt only sells for twice that much at best. I am tempted to load up a couple of boys and go where gelding is reasonable. I think $350 discourages gelding in this state.

 

[mininik]

Simply put, if the price of gelding is deterring people from breeding, please STOP BREEDING. Common sense says that when breeding you will either end up with a filly or colt. More likely than not, many of your colts (and fillies, too) will not be breeding material and should be gelded before being sold (or sold on a solid gelding contract). It goes without saying that not all fillies should go on to produce, either, but at least with colts we have the ability to permanently fix them before they contribute to the gene pool. If the market is such that you can only get about twice the price of gelding for an intact, gelding quality colt in your area, please STOP BREEDING if you are unwilling to make the investment to help protect your breed's future.

 

[Katiean]

Backwoosdnanny, you have high gelding prices where you are too. It costs $350 in Nevada too. It discurraged me too. That is $350 for a simple geld and more if there is a problem. I could trailer to California but that just defeats the trip. As it would cost about $75 just for the trip plus time. I don't think that will work. My colt now is a nice little guy. His two mommies keep him in line. I don't think I am gonna geld.

 

[Calekio]

Nice artical... maybe i should give it my vets! lol Maybe it because we are in the UK.. but my vets won't gold anything under a year of mine... they just say its too tricky since they are so small! (maybe i should take them to a small animal vet who deals with dogs! lol)

I've often been asked by people who are wanting a pet for there children, what do they they get.. a lot say they've seen a nice colt.. but i'll always try to steer them to a gelding.

Also seen over here people who don't thnk the colt is good enough as a stallion so sell it unreg'd... my view is.. if you don't want to sell a future stallion.. sell it gelded! I also think there is much more of a buyers market for geldings than there for colts.

 

[nightflight]

Anyone tired of me posting this yet? This is the New Mexico miniature horse club's gelding program. We've reached the program cap again, people have run us out of money twice! A fun show fundraiser, silent auction, club swapmeet sale, or youth fundraisers are all ways to fund this project. It's great incentive to join and work with local clubs too. We also have a local vet who helped us with the program and offers discounts to club members.

LEMHC Gelding Promotion Program

Purpose:

· To support members of the LEMHC

· To encourage the gelding of horses for improved quality of life.

· To encourage breeders to geld colts before selling them.

· To encourage ownership of geldings.

· To provide more geldings for the youth market.

· To support AMHA gelding incentives

· To decrease the numbers of miniatures going through public auctions.

Overview:

The LEMHC will reimburse qualifying members up to $150 for the gelding of AMHA horses. Up to $100 will be reimbursed for the first, and up to $50 will be reimbursed for the second surgery.

Rules:

1) Horses in program must by owned by LEMHC members in good standing

2) Horses in program must be AMHA Registered miniature horses.

3) A copy of the vet bill showing horses full registered name and owners name must be submitted to the LEMHC. Bill must be on veterinarian’s letterhead and have veterinarian’s signature. A copy of the horse’s registration papers must also be submitted.

4) The program will begin reimbursing vet bills dated on August 28th 2004 and after.

5) To begin with reimbursement will be limited to two horses per family, per year (Program year begins and ends on August 28th).

6) When a total of $1000 has been spent on the program, the program will be suspended and reviewed by committee. The committee will then report to the board or general membership who will decide whether or not the program should be renewed.

Recommendations:

That a committee be set up to track how useful this program is to LEMHC members. Eventually I would like to see no limits for the numbers of horses enrolled in this program, but if everyone takes part it could be necessary to find alternative funding to make this happen.

Notes:

In the past there has been a lot of talk about creating a fund for LEMHC members who are involved in mini horse rescue. This program does not take the place of that, but could help to reduce the problem. If LEMHC breeders encourage selling more geldings than colts, first time mini owners are less likely to end up with a pet stallion that they want to breed. By reducing the numbers of breeding animals that we put into the market we can reduce the number of pet quality animals that are produced. This will give the horses that are produced a better chance of finding the type of home they deserve.

 

[mininik]

Katiean, I'm sure you know that keeping your colt intact sets him up to live a life of separation, anxiety and frustration. It won't be long before he cannot live with his two "mommies" if they are mares capable of reproducing. If he does breed or you breed your mare(s) again to another stallion, what will you do if you end up with more colts? If you're planning to sell these colts, are they really the quality that should be reproducing for someone else, producing more colts that may not be gelded due to the costs involved?

What a wonderful program, Colleen! I wonder if all of the local AMHA and AMHR clubs are aware of it or have something similar? If not, I'll bet they may be interested in starting something if they knew of this as an example to follow. Please don't stop posting about it, the more people who are aware of the benefits of gelding, the better!

 

[capall beag]

Good article but I do have a Q.

Why do so many say "If he is a good stallion he will make an even better gelding" Or similar, or "he is not good enough to be competitive as a stallion but would be a very competitive gelding" or something similar.

Is the standard lower in the ring for geldings?

How would a horse be more competitive simply because it was gelded?

I am not questioning the reasoning behind the benefits of gelding, I know them. I am just curious why a horse would become 'more' competitive in the showring because he was gelded.

As said, when gelding costs are so high, $450 here in southern Maine, it is a huge added cost to raising a foal and the selling price is lower.

Unfortunately for these 2 reasons there are a huge # of colts left intact around here.

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I think people are not seeing it is a huge catch 22

If you are selling colts in tact then that person will breed him have there own foals and then be selling them in your market therefore cutting down your already depressed market (you in general not aimed at anyone )

If you truly have an amazing stallion meaning he outproduces himself a large portion of the time.. then it gets to the point of why keep him a stallion why not geld him and keep a son as a stallion if they truly are better then the sire. If they are not.. why keep going with that stallion and those crosses?

I think the sad part is this really applies to ALL OF US each and every one and yet so many read stuff like this and are sure it applies to everyone else but surely not there own herd.

 

[chandab]

As said, when gelding costs are so high, $450 here in southern Maine,

:new_shocked:

OMG, no wonder alot of owners don't geld. It's really a pretty simple proceedure (basic uncomplicated gelding), I do not understand why vets charge so much. I was griping about the $100 and $125 I paid to geld two AQHA colts a couple years ago. I do know that the new vet charges around $175 to geld a mini; a friend has had two done in the last two years.

 

[kathy'sminis]

: I have gelding mini horses that I love to bring to fairs & daycares to teach people & kids about mini horses, I do have mares & couple of stallions which one of the stallions is getting gelded this fall,they have a better life as a gelding,not all horses are meant to be stallions.I had 7 colts & young studs gelded in April this year in one day,I had one yearling colt that I was gelding the vet really didn't want to geld he was a AMHA Reg. blk/wht medicine hat paint that was a curly miniature, he has curly sheep wool like fur during winter,yes he is rare I told the vet but he will have a happier life as a gelding,which he can stay out with the other mares & geldings :aktion033: . I love having geldings they are great for kids & take places, so I don't have to worry about it being in a heat cycle being cranky or weird,It cost me $200 to have mini colt or stallion gelded here & it is worth every penny. :bgrin

Kathy K.& G. Hiddenfarm, Lebanon,ME

 

[wiccanz]

If you truly have an amazing stallion meaning he outproduces himself a large portion of the time.. then it gets to the point of why keep him a stallion why not geld him and keep a son as a stallion if they truly are better then the sire.

This is what we did with our stallion. Basically, the first foal he produced (a colt) was much better than himself, so we rebred our 3 mares, then gelded him.

We now have 3 colts (1 will most likely end up gelded) and 2 fillies from him, all are better than he. We feel he did his job for us, so gelded him. We have never regretted our decision.

 

[nootka]

:aktion033:

Awesome article!

I find it interesting indeed that the farms that I admire (personally) and tend to have the highest quality horses are the ones that are JUST FINE with gelding colts, even ones that would probably be quite nice as stallions (i.e., good, correct parentage and nice horses to begin with, even themselves often national champs).

It seems to be the ones that sell the horses for the really low prices or medium low prices that really have the problem with it, also the ones that tend to "romanticize" and anthropomorphize more than is necessary.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for giving the horses their emotions, their feelings, etc., but when they are treated like sentimental objects and that is used as an excuse for breeding more poorly conformed/badly proportioned animals, it's wrong.

The world does not need more mediocre. ALL of us should be striving for higher quality.

I wish it were easier to spay mares, and I do hope that eventuality is near.

I find another aspect interesting, that people don't realize that times change and we are "moving on" so they wish to take that stallion who was so "cool" 20 years ago, and either get him reproducing again or reproduce him. He may have been National champion then, but he couldn't cut the mustard, now...and his babies are likely not to be what they were (with some rare exceptions).

We DO tend to experiment a little bit when we breed even the best to the best. What frustrates me is to see the "ok" bred to the "ok" and then we have generations of "so so" to look forward to. At least take the "ok" and find an oustanding/superior stallion....?

Now that I see the "bigger" thing on the article, though, makes me a little nervous about gelding some of my colts so young, I guess they may go over, but I'd rather do that than breed fugly horses and/or have them breeding when they shouldn't be.

Thanks, mininik, for this....guessing that I could show it around, myself, but the ones that really need to get the msg won't.

BTW, my vet charges $95 for a gelding procedure that is with the farm call. He raised it from $65 when I had it done two years ago.

My policy is that EVERY colt here will be gelded as soon as he's ready (descended) and before he leaves here to his new home UNLESS he is that nice, and he better be darned nice. It's been that way for years, now. It ONLY MAKES SENSE if you truly have an outstanding stallion, to control his male offspring that way, and want to protect your stallion's worth as well as his future generations. YOu have no control over what mare is bred by your stallion's sons and so on and so on....

Liz M.

 

[user 488]

Simply put, if the price of gelding is deterring people from breeding, please STOP BREEDING.

STOP BREEDING if you are unwilling to make the investment to help protect your breed's future.

AMEN!

Good article! Had to laugh as I have heard every one of these excuses for not gelding. I don't care what it costs to geld. Can't afford it.....don't breed them or cut down on the number you do breed. Sound harsh? Maybe, but every single one of you that have made some of the excuses in that article are adding to the huge over population of miniature horses. And again, if you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem.

 

[mininik]

Is the standard lower in the ring for geldings?

How would a horse be more competitive simply because it was gelded?

Rarely do you see top stallion prospects or stallions proven to be exceptional who are gelded, especially in Miniatures. Many Miniature breeders will even hold off on gelding an exceptional or mediocre stallion who hasn't out produced himself "yet" because they are waiting on some magical cross. More often than not, you'll find that a great many more Miniature breeders have to find some obvious faults in their horse to feel comfortable with gelding and then there are those who just can't (more like won't) see that their stallion SHOULD be gelded. What many fail to realize is that gelding a stallion can make it great in another way and that is in the quality of life a gelding can enjoy over a stallion as well as the contribution the owner is making to the betterment of the breed.

 

[Jill]

I'm not holding my horses out for critique here on the forum, but I do feel one of my nicest horses period is one I chose to geld. His breeding is very top notch. If "they" grew back, I'd have the vet out to do it again :bgrin I don't want to show a gelding quality gelding. I want to show stallion quality geldings.

 

[Marty]

Here we go again with this topic

Here's some of what I think for what it's worth.

LB Forum members has got this down pretty good already. After all, this topic of gelding has been done to death for years. But what about the breeders that do not read this forum or any other forum or even bother to realize about the market in horses be it minis or big horses? There are tons and millions of breedings taking place left and right and of course we all have those mills constantly over producing equines. Those are some of the people that need to be reached and convinced to stop the over production too. But how's that going to happen?