Color help please :)

[2minis4us]

I need help from you color experts out there

My filly is a bright silver chestnut, wide blaze, 2 blue eyes, one white foot with a stripe (back right), and "possibly" a white belly spot, hard to tell because she has such a thick winter coat but I can see some white hairs under there. Mare is a black sabino and sire is LWO Frame. Is she an overo ?

 

[Jade10]

Im going to guess splash

 

[REO]

Looks like she carries Splash for sure. Maybe some other patterns.

Overo is Spanish for oval (as in egg) It describes the pattern FRAME. So overo means frame (LWO)

So if your filly tests as being LWO then yup! She's an overo!

Cute girl!

 

[2minis4us]

Ok... how to you explain splash ? I mean, as opposed to tovero, tobiano, etc. I though an overo meant no white on the back.

Would she be a high color producer ?

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

I need help from you color experts out there

My filly is a bright silver chestnut,

I have to object to this statement. Your very pretty filly is indeed a chestnut but silver, if she carries it, is not expressed on red horses. So while it is possible she carries a silver gene (her sire may have it and have passed it to her but there is no way to tell without testing) she is not a 'silver' chestnut.On the subject of whether or not she carries the frame gene (LWO), since her sire is positive for frame I would make the assumption she was until you are sure from testing that she is not if you have any intention of breeding her in the future. Its seems very likely she carries both splash and frame and depending on what color patterns are carried by the stallion you breed her to you should be able to expect a variety of patterns in the foals.

 

[2minis4us]

I will not be breeding her. I thought she was silver because the hair next to her skin looks silver,grey. The sire does NOT carry the silver gene.

Here is a pic of her sire

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

He looks very familiar but I can't quite place him. No wonder your filly is such a pretty girl, just look at her sire.

 

[2minis4us]

Her sire is Circle S Bright Red Baron : )

 

[horsehug]

You could test her, Tia, for Tobiano, LWO and splash white. Then you would know for sure which of those she carries. If she carries both Tobiano and one of the others she is Tovero.

Susan O.

 

[2minis4us]

Thanks Susan. Since I will not be breeding her I don't feel the need to test. I was just curious.

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

Her sire is Circle S Bright Red Baron : )

Good grief!! I need the smack the forehead smiley 'DUH' I have a brother to your filly and several pictures of Baron in Cruiser's file. No wonder he looked so familiar (again I say good grief ... some days I'm just slow)

 

[2minis4us]

Reignmaker, who is the brother ?

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

His registered name is SMO Smokin Hot. He is very much like his sire in appearance but much taller (34") Here's a picture of him the very first time he was driven last summer.

 

[2minis4us]

He looks very handsome !!

 

[paintponylvr]

The sire in that picture does look like he is a silver bay. I have a silver bay Tobiano mare that looks very similar. Regardless - he is BEAUTIFUL!

Love your heads up filly w/ those bright blue eyes & white chrome.

***************

I have a ? for the Overo folks. Are all miniature horses with Frame patterns testing LWO positive? Because the big APHA and PtHA horses do not (or they didn't used to). They were a frame overo that could test neg for LWO (stands for Leathal White Overo) or one gene for LWO. If two were bred that were both carrying the positive, then foal could be homozygous for LWO, born white & dies usually w/i 72 hours of birth. ...

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

I'm not sure what exactly you're asking Paula. If a horse is visually frame it will test positive for the gene but not all horses referred to as overo are frame. They might be splash or sabino or a combination of tobiano and one of the overo patterns. To the best of my knowledge nothing looks like frame (which is to say carrying LWO) visually except frame and that would be true of both minis and full sized horses.

FYI, Baron has been colour tested and is sorrel not silver bay (as is Cruiser)

 

[paintponylvr]

I'm not sure what exactly you're asking Paula. If a horse is visually frame it will test positive for the gene but not all horses referred to as overo are frame. They might be splash or sabino or a combination of tobiano and one of the overo patterns. To the best of my knowledge nothing looks like frame (which is to say carrying LWO) visually except frame and that would be true of both minis and full sized horses.

FYI, Baron has been colour tested and is sorrel not silver bay (as is Cruiser)

When we had "biggies", we were part of some breeding programs that had frame Overos in Colorado (some bloodlines came out of major western pleasure/halter bred horses from Iowa. Others were working horse bloodlines - typically good in roping & cutting/team penning) and were tested via UC-Davis in the 70s & 80s. Not all of our horses (& yes they were visual frames) tested positive for the LWO gene at that time. We also had horses that were "solid" (registered AQHA or APHA breeding stock - not much chrome), yet produced a lot of the double gened LWO horses. They did test positive for 1 LWO gene - even tho not visual overos. As recently as 1999, my parents owned a palomino Overo stallion that was a visible frame, also carried some sabino characteristics and did not test LWO. He was not a Tobiano. I don't know which testing company he was tested by. I always prefered the Tobi's myself. He was all cutting/roping bloodlines (wish I could remember names - but I can't even remember barn name much less his registered name. I didn't particularly care for him) and was a 14.3 hh, 1300 lb chunk that could stop a bull in his tracks from the end of rope! Wish I still had some pics of him. I don't. He was gelded while still w/ Mom and <step>Dad & when Dad passed away, Mom sold him w/i 2 years as she couldn't care for him. Actually, I think he made her miss Dad more...

I just went back and re-read the info at horse testing dot com as well as a couple of other sites. It's confusing. It looks like the tests are different now than they used to be... It looks like the "naming conventions" have been changed. Hmmm.... I know that there are also Splash (testable) and several genes affecting Sabino - some not testable/known yet. That answers that question, LOL.

Ah - the shading in the pic makes him look like he "could" be a silver.... and since she called her filly a silver...

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

He looks very handsome !!

Thank you, I am rather fond of him - which is why is a gelding and still with me rather than sold as an intact stallion.

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

Ah - the shading in the pic makes him look like he "could" be a silver.... and since she called her filly a silver...

I find a lot of people think a sorrel/chestnut with a flaxen mane and tail is a silver. It can be a bit confusing when so many genetically different coloured horses actually look like they are the same colour. In this case at least I know for sure since the horse in question has been tested, its the ones who aren't that get harder to judge.

 

[Lindi-loo]

No idea what colour she is BUT she really is very very cute in that picture they both are