Sorry this is long- But- We have been reading and watching and waiting for this to come to this point. I have taken full names out (except our own). Now- Lets get the true facts out.....
The horses that were purchased at the Oktoberfest Auction here at Little King Farm were 3 weanling colts- selling with applications for registration. 2 of which were consigned by another breeder. These are the horses that were purchased and for these prices:
1. Little Kings Junior Jupiter- Little Kings Little Buckeroo x Arion Aaprina Destiny- colt selling with AMHA and AMHR Application purchased for $600.00
2. COH Buccarra Bourbon- Little Kings Buckeroo Buccarra x Boones Little Midnight Special- colt selling with AMHA and AMHR application- purchased for $300.00
3. COH Red Hot Buck- Little Kings Buckeroo I Stand Grand x Sweetwaters Rolls Royce- colt selling on AMHA and AMHR application- purchased for $450.00
Now- these horses are all very good colts- I can even send pictures of how nice they are. Their stud fees alone are 4 and 5 times the price these colts were sold for. This was an "As Is" Auction and announced as such. These horses were sold at extremely low prices. Most buyers were overwhelming surprised and happy about their purchases for the money they had to spend. One reason why we allowed them to sell so cheaply was due to the costs saved by not having to register them ourselves. Some had to be DNA'd, some had to be taken temp to perm etc. We were eliminating some cost and lots of time for us by selling them now instead of waiting later. All paperwork was in order- all forms were signed for all parents of each weanling selling on application. Some paperwork was pending in the offices.
Then something unexpected occurred and the change in events has caused most of the issues here. We had our house/office burn to the ground- including all the paperwork, buyer information etc on all the horses in the Oktoberfest as well as all the horses here on LKF. I have to say- it was life altering. Honestly in comparison to all my clients and people we know in this business, there were only a handful of people who were compassionate, understanding and accepting of the fact that it took us several months to re-create and re-issue paperwork. I will also have to say the people we had the most trouble with in 30 years experience were the people who paid less than $500 for their horses or returned a bundle of used blankets because of a missing buckle and wanted a refund check for $130.00. Why is that- especially within one month of the sale and when they knew what had occurred here?
We tried to do everything possible to get the paperwork out as quickly as possible to the buyers. Some people we had to wait until they called us and asked for it, because we had no record of them, address, payment etc or what horse/s they purchased. The registries had to figure out what to do with our "special" situation in which all the certificates were lost or severely damaged. That took time and several BOD approvals. Now- as you can see from the 2 e-mails below- we tried to handle things the best we could. This is just a sample of the many, many that went back and forth.
Email- #1 Hello ______,
I just received another letter from you today. I am aware of all your requests, emails, notes, letters, calls to us and AMHA etc. etc. concerning the registrations of the colts that you bought at the Oktoberfest Sale this fall. I am not sure you are aware that we had a devastating fire the first of Nov. here that burned up our entire house-- everything- nothing was salvagable. Our farm office was in our home. We are trying to start over. We had a considerable amount of paperwork pending with both AMHA and AMHR just prior to the sale some in the office and some at the registries, all the Octoberfest paperwork and all, all, of our registrations, stallion report, breeding reports, all records etc etc. for over 450 horse. Maybe you can not comprehend what this entails. We are working as diligently as humanly possible to recreate this business.
You seem extremely anxious and adament that we attend to your needs asap.
I am becoming extremely anxious and adament that you will need to take a number and take a seat.
I have enough of your correspondence to remind me that these things need to be taken care of, but if you are not going to be patient, I will be happy to send someone to your farm immediately with a check for $1350.00, and pick up the 3 colts, Bourban-$300.00, Red Hot- $450.00 and Jupiter- $600.00.
I have been in this business for over 30 years, we know what we need to do. I am sorry if you feel I seem rude or insensitive to your needs but in the scope of what we have been through, your problem seems very insignificant.
If you feel so inclined to accept my offer to return the colts, please just email me.
Marianne Eberth
LKF
Email #2-
Mrs. C_____,
This is my last response to clarify any questions you have. When you constantly asked about the paperwork for the mares, I asked the person who is doing all our paperwork. She at that time said the paperwork had been sent in, she was referring to the AMHA for Duplicate papers that were burned and DNA , to then send to AMHR. We needed copies of the A papers to get R papers.
Regardless of who, why, or when anything was done, You need to refer to your OKtoberfest Sale catalog.
I discussed your accusations with the sale manager and was reminded:
These colts were not sold registered, they were sold with R applications, and it states that in the catalog There was no agreement at all about the cost of the R registration. What that means, Ms C______, is that the new owner is responsible for the registration costs regardless of what it is, we merely supplied you with the information and signatures.
As a matter of fact, if those horses had sold for 13,500.00 each, we would have paid the hardship fee to register them if necessary but that is one of many reasons we sold them with just the application and why you were able to buy them at such very cheap prices. Those colts are worth far more than you paid for them, and far more than if you have to pay for them to be registered at your expense- surely you know that.
Up to this point, we have done all we can do to decrease the cost of registration of the colts, I have every intention of registering the Aaprina mare R but I have no control over what Ms Hoffmann wants to do. I suggest that you stop badgering us and maybe you will be able to register your colts at a more reasonable fee when we do complete our paperwork.
Conclusively,
M.Eberth
In this particular instance with these 4 horses, it came to a point very early- that we simply offered the buyer their money back just so we didn't have to deal with it anymore. We had 2 problems- after the fire and the sale and the owner realizing that horses weren't bringing what they used to, she decided not to spend more money registering some of her mares AMHR unless they were bred. This particular case was with the Red Hot Buck horse. His dam is not R papered, she was not bred for 07 and the owner did not want to pay for her to be R papered when it might be 2 years before getting a return.
The other problem was due to the fire- we lost a signed breeders certificate for Aaprina Destiny. The original breeder is now out of the business. We do not have contact information on the previous breeder. Now- the mare has since sold to a new owner- who may take her AMHR, but that would be up to them. However- as I said before - we had all this paperwork filled out and ready to go prior to the fire- there were stacks to be mailed to the registries and to the new owners and sellers.
As many of you understand- These colts are still able to be AMHR registered- if the buyer thought so much of them to pay a little more to do so. Each would cost an additional $400. to register AMHR off their AMHA papers. This could have been done immediately after they received the AMHA paperwork. They have all the information they need and signatures that show the colts were purchased with a transfer. Just because the registry has the mares listed on stallion reports, does not mean they are registered. They were listed as "pending"- we do this on all mares that are bred that do not have current reg. #s- in case the owners wish to register them within the year. Neither of us would then have to pay for a late stallion report filing fee.
So- since we are a "big breeder"- does it mean that we are not allowed to sell "as is" horses? I would like to know where this person was when we announced that not all sires and dams currently had been AMHR papered but many were in the process. Or that we announced that many of these horses could be taken R, if the buyers wanted to register them off their AMHA papers. That is one thing I am not ignorant about- everything that was announced is on tape. There was even a mare that was only AMHR papered, but you don't see that person coming to us wanting us to pay for her to be hardshipped AMHA- even though we announced she was AMHA eligible and we would help with the hardship forms.
I do not know where this industry is heading... buyers want everything for nothing. Buyers do not want to be responsible for what they buy or how it was represented or sold. Buyers want guarantees now for everything under the moon that cannot even be genetically proven one way or another like certain colors. Sellers are at the mercy of the buyers and then after the deal is done and the horses are gone- they still are responsible. My family has been in this industry for over 30 years. I have grown up in it and have been the sales agent for over 15 years. These are the kind of sales that make me ask myself- why in the world do we do all this work and put in all this time for a few hundred dollars? When in return on top of the meager amount of money we get hours of grief and bad press because someone wants more than what they signed and paid for.
I know what many of you are going to say not everyone is rich and can't buy the most expensive horses and I completely understand that...... Ms. C even asks that question in an e-mail- if she paid $13,500 verses $1350. You can see our response........BUT truly- in all my experience- the only trouble I have ever had (and I can count on one hand the number of times I have had trouble)- is from the people who buy the cheapest (less than $1,000) or free horses. They expect us to go above and beyond the call of duty and if we don't they cry fraud or foul play. I just hope some day when they sell horses that they will have a buyer just like them.
Since Ms. C. has brought this situation here and chose this forum to discuss it, I would like to end it. We have on numerous occasions offered Ms. C. her money back for the colts if she returns them- we even offered to come pick them up. . We do not have the ability now to register the dams to the 2 colts she purchased. As noted in the e-mail- we could have registered the one mare R ourselves and paid the hardship fees, but why would we go out of our way to help her further after all the harrassment and disrepectful distress she provoked? Her investment of $800. more would still not equal the value of these colts. The stud fee alone for LK Little Buckeroo is $1500. She would have a mere $1000. in this colt with the additional registration fee. Ms. C has never considered returning the colts and has had absolutely no compassion for what we went through during this time. This is the same lady who called at all hours of the night and day to ask and insist on paperwork. It didn't matter who she talked to- she would berate and accuse anyone who answered the phone. We are no longer wanting or willing to do business with her. I feel very sorry for the poor colts that she purchased.
The quote I have always heard is "Buyer Beware"- well I am here to say "Seller Beware."
Robin-LKF