Obama

[littlesteppers]

tuition assistance in exchange for community service is NOT a bad plan.

Leia I agree. Community or national service is definitely a good idea IMO.

As far as retired military becoming teachers is concerned there are hundreds of them. Not sure what/how they got where they are, but I do know there are a lot of them in the classrooms. When we hear about retired military members becoming teachers I think it's very important to remember that in todays military people no longer just dig fox holes and fire a weapon. I sure hope this doesn't sound condescending because that certainly isn't my intent. Just something to think about.

How they got there..is that we have programs right now in place where the government will help our retired military to make an adjustment and pays for schools for the civilian life..after all what chance has a sharp shooter in the job market..maybe assasin> JK..lol..tank drivers..a.s.o. many jobs in the military just would not have a chance in the market..right now!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

As far as retired military becoming teachers is concerned there are hundreds of them. Not sure what/how they got where they are, but I do know there are a lot of them in the classrooms. When we hear about retired military members becoming teachers I think it's very important to remember that in todays military people no longer just dig fox holes and fire a weapon. I sure hope this doesn't sound condescending because that certainly isn't my intent. Just something to think about.

You're right, and I think the discipline and leadership and self-confidence that a person learns in the military can make them EXCELLENT teachers. But as littlesteppers said, right now they are given further education like any other lay-person so they know how to teach subjects other than those in which they specialized in the military. If Stephen Hawking wants to come teach a high school physics class for instance, for gosh sakes let him!

But unless we plan on teaching our kids those advanced electronic systems, tactical training, submarine operations and other highly-skilled jobs that our young people learn in the modern military, they better not be exempted unanimously from teaching requirements.

Anyway, that wasn't the subject of the thread so I apologize for digressing. I sure do appreciate our military men and women and look forward to the day when all of them can come home and do what they love, be it teaching or merely serving their country as citizens instead of soldiers.

My best friend is currently in Iraq in one of those highly skilled electronics positions and I would love to see him teaching. He'd be great at it.

Leia

 

[littlesteppers]

As far as retired military becoming teachers is concerned there are hundreds of them. Not sure what/how they got where they are, but I do know there are a lot of them in the classrooms. When we hear about retired military members becoming teachers I think it's very important to remember that in todays military people no longer just dig fox holes and fire a weapon. I sure hope this doesn't sound condescending because that certainly isn't my intent. Just something to think about.

You're right, and I think the discipline and leadership and self-confidence that a person learns in the military can make them EXCELLENT teachers. But as littlesteppers said, right now they are given further education like any other lay-person so they know how to teach subjects other than those in which they specialized in the military. If Stephen Hawking wants to come teach a high school physics class for instance, for gosh sakes let him!

But unless we plan on teaching our kids those advanced electronic systems, tactical training, submarine operations and other highly-skilled jobs that our young people learn in the modern military, they better not be exempted unanimously from teaching requirements.

Anyway, that wasn't the subject of the thread so I apologize for digressing. I sure do appreciate our military men and women and look forward to the day when all of them can come home and do what they love, be it teaching or merely serving their country as citizens instead of soldiers.

My best friend is currently in Iraq in one of those highly skilled electronics positions and I would love to see him teaching. He'd be great at it.

Leia

We (ft campbell) expecting 125 000 coming home soon..we are soo proud of our man and woman..they will come home in HONOR HUA!!

 

[bingo]

Yesterday, Obama told collage students get $ 4000 tax credit when they serve the National Military Community Service.

For once I listened to the debate and what I heard, very clearly, was "$4,000 tuition credit for those serving their country in the military, the Peace Corp, or with community service hours." I too admit I was giving him the hairy eyeball when he started with the credit-for-the-military thing, thinking "Wait, is he pushing for enlistment?" and "The military already pays for college!" but as he continued the statement I calmed down and thought "Hey, tuition assistance in exchange for community service is NOT a bad plan. Hmm! I like it!" That's something anyone could do, gives BACK to the community, and helps the individual get to college without loading on more and more debt they can't repay. I would have done it in a heartbeat if it had been available when I was going to school.

only that the words I heard used are a little different from the ones I'm hearing quoted here regarding the $4,000 for education thing.

Leia (who is waiting to be bashed, as usual)

NO bashing here I am glad someone else truly listened. In a perfect world we should not have to give our kids something to give back but sadly volunteerism has diminished in this country and this has the potential to be a win -win situation for everyone.

 

[Laura]

Yesterday, Obama told collage students get $ 4000 tax credit when they serve the National Military Community Service.

For once I listened to the debate and what I heard, very clearly, was "$4,000 tuition credit for those serving their country in the military, the Peace Corp, or with community service hours." I too admit I was giving him the hairy eyeball when he started with the credit-for-the-military thing, thinking "Wait, is he pushing for enlistment?" and "The military already pays for college!" but as he continued the statement I calmed down and thought "Hey, tuition assistance in exchange for community service is NOT a bad plan. Hmm! I like it!" That's something anyone could do, gives BACK to the community, and helps the individual get to college without loading on more and more debt they can't repay. I would have done it in a heartbeat if it had been available when I was going to school.

only that the words I heard used are a little different from the ones I'm hearing quoted here regarding the $4,000 for education thing.

Leia (who is waiting to be bashed, as usual)

NO bashing here I am glad someone else truly listened. In a perfect world we should not have to give our kids something to give back but sadly volunteerism has diminished in this country and this has the potential to be a win -win situation for everyone.

I agree, I think a volunteer based program to help with college expenses is a fantastic idea

 

[Cathy_H]

I also found it very alarming when McCain said that he was in favor of removing credentialing (is that a word?) requirements for former military to become teachers. I was like "What?! How on earth does being military qualify you to teach our children any better than anyone else??" Remove educational degree requirements in some cases, sure, fine. Let the experts teach our children in the subjects of their expertise without requiring them to go through additional years of college to be "qualified

................................ Lee is now in his tenth year of teaching after retiring from the Air Force upon retiring with 21 years of service.... He had to repeat some classes because they could not be transferred nor accepted by the college that he was getting his certification from. This was a waste of your tax dollars & ours & our time for him to complete his required classes. Also a financial hardship as we could not live on military retired pay alone during that time................................ Actually with the lack of discipline in our schools nowadays I think retired military teachers could restore some of that "self discipline" & "responsibility for ones own actions".

As far as exchanging service for money - is the student going to have a choice? THAT is the question to ask!

 

[tagalong]

As far as exchanging service for money - is the student going to have a choice? THAT is the question to ask!

It is not "for money" but tuition credit. Big difference. I see nothing wrong with incentive programs. IF they pan out as described.

JMO - but I did not get the impression that it was anything but a choice. IF you choose to do one of these things to help Americans - then you get this grant towards tuition... not everyone will go that route, anyway.

 

[LowriseMinis]

I think our military men and women do a great service to our country. I know we have some brilliant people serving, folks who have or are getting their college degrees.

I do not think that a B.S. or a B.A.+4 years military experience makes them qualified teachers all on it's own.

Since I'm entering into that program and most of my co-workers are working on their degree or their credentials, I know there is a lot involved in becoming a teacher. You have to learn how to teach. You have to learn how to do P.E. with the kids. You have to learn how to navigate the web of state requirements and standards and all the tests. You have to learn how to handle a classroom of unruly children effectively.

I am all for a program that takes our men and women who are finished with their service and TEACHES them how to do those things. I don't think they should get a free pass on all the things we require of our teachers, though. I think that is like sending them into battle unarmed.

 

[Cathy_H]

It is not "for money" but tuition credit. Big difference

......
Ok, so it isn't actual money! ...... No difference IF access to either one will get you that ultimate degree!

Different form = same result!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

I am all for a program that takes our men and women who are finished with their service and TEACHES them how to do those things. I don't think they should get a free pass on all the things we require of our teachers, though. I think that is like sending them into battle unarmed.

Well-said!

Leia

 

[hobbyhorse23]

It is not "for money" but tuition credit. Big difference

......
Ok, so it isn't actual money! ...... No difference IF access to either one will get you that ultimate degree!

Different form = same result!

Cathy, I'm a little confused. What is your objection here? That community service would be compulsory? I don't think that's likely as it was described as a voluntary program and only those who were willing to work for the money/credit/financial help/whatever you want to call it would be applying to a presumably finite amount of positions. But even if it was compulsory, would that be so bad?

Plenty of countries require some sort of service out of their citizens in exchange for all the benefits of citizenship and even here in the U.S., heck, community service was compulsory my senior year of high school. If you didn't do x hours, you didn't graduate. Period. Is that awful? We thought so, but then again what teenager LIKES to be forced to do anything?!

Gosh forbid that some of those self-entitled, technologically focused, me me me BRATS you hear about so often should be forced to work a little for something.

And in a case like this where it's not only not required but those who participate willingly actually get something they badly need in exchange for their time, well, that's a whole different ballgame to me.

It's a win-win!

(Actually implementing this is a whole 'nother kettle of fish, but theoretically at least it sounds like a great idea to me.)

Leia

 

[LowriseMinis]

Gasp! Wait! Don't they require service in SOCIALIST countries?!*

(*sarcasm)

 

[Buckskin gal]

Sounds like a good program.

.
I am all for a program that takes our men and women who are finished with their service and TEACHES them how to do those things. I don't think they should get a free pass on all the things we require of our teachers, though. I think that is like sending them into battle unarmed.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Gasp! Wait! Don't they require service in SOCIALIST countries?!*

(*sarcasm)

Oh geez, don't go there!

We were finally AGREEING on something, Republican and Democrat alike! Being productive! I haven't felt so hopeful in weeks. Seriously.

Leia

 

[AppyLover2]

I do not think that a B.S. or a B.A.+4 years military experience makes them qualified teachers

If I'm not mistaken (I MAY be) McCain said retired military. You don't retire from the military with only 4 years service. IMO he was only using military as an example (not as an exclusion of anyone else) to refer to people who may be induced into teaching. Since you can retire from the military as young as 38 years old a great many retirees seek a second career. Teaching is one of them that I think an incentive to go into is worth considering.

 

[LowriseMinis]

Well, you know me and my issues with bipartisanship. Back on topic!

Compulsory service. I know in a lot of places that means 'military service', and I don't see compulsory military service going over well here in the U.S. In addition we have a lot of people with asthma, physical problems...folks who are willing to serve their country but can't do so through the military. What other service options should we have, in everyone's opinion?

 

[LowriseMinis]

If I'm not mistaken (I MAY be) McCain said retired military. You don't retire from the military with only 4 years service. IMO he was only using military as an example (not as an exclusion of anyone else) to refer to people who may be induced into teaching. Since you can retire from the military as young as 38 years old a great many retirees seek a second career. Teaching is one of them that I think an incentive to go into is worth considering.

Okay, noted. We can substitute 4 for 14, 24, whatever number we need to.

A B.A. or B.S.+x years of military experience does not a qualified teacher make. I love that we have programs in place to help returning veterans further their education and I would be in support of a program that assists veterans and/or retirees in becoming teachers.

I still don't think it's right that we wave credential requirements for those veterans or retirees, if that is what McCain is suggesting. Our military men and women do a great service, and probably have some world experience that few teachers have-but we still need to make sure that they are armed with the proper training and knowledge when they enter into a new career, otherwise we're doing them a disservice and we're doing our kids a disservice.

 

[AppyLover2]

Lowrise I'm sure you'll find something about this to disagree with, argue about or make another sarcastic comment about, but your I don't see compulsory military service going over well here in the U.S just points to your immaturity. It may come as a surprise to you but the U.S. actually did have that at one time. For those of us who remember back then, it was a time of strong patriotism, helping one another out when help was needed and neighbors caring about neighbors. People had a common goal in those days that just doesn't exist any more. In some ways it was part of the good old days.

 

[Cathy_H]

Cathy, I'm a little confused. What is your objection here? That community service would be compulsory

............
I don't object to a program that allows a student to acquire a college education. What I object to is a student being told you have to do this particular thing or you can't participate! There should be a choice of at least - lets say three things.

Compulsory service. I know in a lot of places that means 'military service', and I don't see compulsory military service going over well here in the U.S.

And if this is what Obama means I do not trust him ( or anyone else that might follow after him & abuse it). This could lead to his way of building up the military. I feel there could be ulterior motives behind this if not done properly. Due to the recent national crisis I do not trust ANYONE in office to do anything properly!

Being married to a spouse while serving 21 years in the Air Force I have nothing against the military. I do not want these students being pushed into a corner based on some ones agenda.

 

[Bassett]

It may come as a surprise to you but the U.S. actually did have that at one time. For those of us who remember back then, it was a time of strong patriotism, helping one another out when help was needed and neighbors caring about neighbors. People had a common goal in those days that just doesn't exist any more. In some ways it was part of the good old days.

Remember it well Donna. People cared about one another. Now we all have so much on our plates, we don't have time to think about our neighbors. Too bad I would like to see something like that again.