Newbies-Dystocia 101

[wcr]

I don't like to keep my mares in a stall all the time just before foaling. I have them in at night and under cameras but it is my opinion that they need to move around and roll to help position the foal. During the day they are where we can keep an eye on them and get them to a stall if need be.

I have learned a ton from talking with Michelle at Wesco Farm since she has delivered a few hundred foals and is a wealth of information for me. A couple of things I have learned has been invaluable.

We had just had a long discussion about having just the head and one leg presenting and she said she had several of those presentations and foaled them out just fine without going in and hunting for the other leg. Sure enough I had one right after that discussion and her voice was in my ear and was successful in my delivery.

Another time a friend was at work when her mare started foaling and I had a hysterical nonhorse husband on the phone with the same situation and talked him through to a successful birth.

 

[kaykay]

Hi Eagle

We also try not to stall pregnant mares any more than necessary.

I do agree that mares that roll and roll for hours before foaling are the ones that seem to come up with a dystocia. I also see a lot of tiny stalls on cam and I really prefer bigger stalls so they have room to roll etc and get that foal in position.

If everything fails get the mare up and walk her.

Gently push the foal back down the birth canal as sometimes this alone will get the foal to line up.

We had 3 mares in foaling season with a foal with one front leg bent back. Crazy to have that many in one year. My hubby is now an expert at fixing those.

For hip locked foals try turning counter clock wise as this will sometimes pop them out.

Always remember to pull only when the mare is contracting and use steady downward pressure

 

[Becky]

We had just had a long discussion about having just the head and one leg presenting and she said she had several of those presentations and foaled them out just fine without going in and hunting for the other leg.

Agree with this. Vets will tell you that a foal cannot be delivered this way, but I know they can. Had one mare presenting that way a few years ago. I tried to go in to find the other leg, but this mare gets violent if there is any problem and with her rolling it wasn't going to be. She gave a good push and out came the foal with one leg still back.

Another one didn't end as well. I was foaling out a mare for a client and the foal presented with the nose and one leg. Went in to find the other leg and I found it back alongside the foal. Called my vet and he wanted me to try to push the foal back and retrieve the leg. Wasn't going to happen as the foal was too far out to be pushed back and there just wasn't enough room for me to manipulate that leg forward. So, got my vet on the way, but he ended up having to do a fetotomy as he couldn't get the leg forward either. In hindsight, I think if I'd gone ahead and lubed that mare well and pulled, I could have gotten that foal out at the beginning.

Last case was a dystocia last year. One front leg presenting, head down and the other front leg back. I couldn't reposition so got a vet on the way. Vet gets here and works and finally brings the head up and no front leg. Decides to sedate the mare. Waiting for that to take effect the mare starts to push. Vet says, 'Girl, you can't deliver that way'. Mare pushes again and foal is coming. Vet says 'Well, I guess you can'. Vet reaches and grabs the one foot and pulls and out comes the foal. Alive.

Every situation will be different, but I've seen it myself, that one front leg back isn't always a death sentence and a foal can be delivered that way.

 

[wwminis]

This is all good advice! We had several foals come out with one leg back or over the head and it fairly easy to get them freed up and out! The biggest thing I can say is don't panic, stay calm and use your head to think about what you are feeling when you go in the mare! Like everyone has said, your going in, in the blind with just one hand to use to reposition the foal! It's hard not to panic, but try to keep your cool and do what you can until the vet arrives!

One of the worst delivery's I've ever done was a foal presenting upside down and backwards! ( Breech) I found the back feet and they were pointing up to the sky! I got a hold of them and when the mare pushed I gently eased the foal upwards towards the mares tail head. As I did the foal curled with me and popped right out, placenta and all! At first I thought she was dead and then she took a deep breath And so did I!!! We tied the cord and cut it and sprayed it with 2% iodine! The foal did great and is now a big part of our herd!

Love this theard

Bill

 

[targetsmom]

Please... can this be added to the "best of the Forum" at the appropriate time??? Excellent information here that could save lives.

 

[ruffian]

"This is SO important!! Even if a vet can make it to your place, a mare may need an emergency C section and you're going to have to drive her to a vet clinic to have that done. "

I had a vet do an emergency C Section in my barnyard. Mare survived and went on to have more foals. Foal unfortunately didn't make it, but she had several others after.

So if worse come to worst - it can be done in the open without having to transport to a clinic.

 

[Michelle@wescofarms]

Good topic Kathi. Don't give me a bad eye, I want an easy year with two maidens - : P. Now that I'm less than a month out, I'm question why did I breed, I always get that way come March. The bad ones stick with you unfortunately.

I am lucky though, as we're only 15 min from UC Davis, but an emergency is an emergency. We've had UCD repro here and some not fun dystocia's over the years. I'm not a pessimistic person, but a bad dystocia, I assume the foal won't survive but want to save the mare with as little damage/trauma as necessary. If we get a live foal, I count that as a bonus. I will go in and check and I generally can tell what I can correct and what they need to deal with.

Learn the body structure:

One thing I learned from Joanne Ross (foaling seminar) if you have a cat/dog - lap size preferably, get use to the bone structure of the legs and how they bend so you know when you're "in" are you feeling a front or back leg. It's important to know by feel. As Kathi mentioned when you're up past your elbow with a mare contracting on you and pushing, trying to figure out what you have can be difficult. You don't want to grab a back leg and pull it forward, etc.

Get a dystocia chart. They have laminated ones for sale online. AMHA use to have a foaling booklet, I'm going to dig one out - it had a one page photo of the different positions. If I can scan it and post it with AMHA's permission I will. It's good to visualize how the foal is sitting before you start manipulating it.

The minute a foaling isn't "right" I call the vet. They can give me an ETA to get to me or do I need to load the mare for the drive to them. Basically depending on what I find and how quickly they can get here vs there is what we do. For our part with most dystocia's we get the mare up and try to keep her up - gravity helps if you need to reposition a foal and can help slow contractions a bit. Heading downhill helps too!

As for the mare presenting with a leg/head out and one leg back. We didn't have much choice in delivering him. He was gasping for air, so we couldn't try to reposition inside. We lubed him up and kept traction on the leg that was out (not pulling). My mare half rolled once and popped him out. Three nights later another mare, same thing but the foal was half out w/unbroken sac, one leg back. Again lubed and kept her upright and caught the foal on the way down. I'm fortunate my kids are good assistants, but I've foaled a number of mares on my own and most of the straightforward deliveries, I'm the only one around.

I've had breach foals, dog sitting upside down, foal with the intestines on the outside of the body, mare with bony small pelvis (remember that one Kathi?) requiring a fetotomy and then dead mare, strangled with head back locked in place by the cord, upside down, shoulder presenting, hiplock, etc. You really appreciate the older roomy mares with a dystocia.

Foaling isn't for the faint of heart. It can be heartbreaking, when a mare loses a foal. But it happens. Fortunately the majority are straightforward and easy. The bad ones though are bad. Being prepared and knowledgeable helps.

 

[Kim~Crayonboxminiatures]

Most imporatant:

1. Stay calm

2. Call the vet at the first sign of trouble, my vet is willing to walk me through possible scenarios over the phone as they are on the way.

3. Have lots and lots of LUBE on hand!

4. It is best to have help, at least one other person, if not two, sometimes you will need the second person to help pull on the foal. The mare will be up and down, sometimes thrashing/rolling, I had to have someone hold a mares hind leg so she would hit me in the face as I was inside manipulating the foal.

5. You will be sore & achey the next day, amazing what you have the strength to do with the added adrenaline and not even know it, but your muscles will let you know the day after! I wasn't prepared for the soreness the first time I had a dystocia, it really affected my mental mood the next day.

6. Remember that no matter what you do or don't do, it was the best in the situation at the time, be gentle on yourself, don't kick yourself, it's part of breeding & raising Miniature Horses.

My experience:

I've had a mare that was rolling and rolling prior to foaling as others have mentioned. The foal was presenting correctly (2 hooves & nose), but upside down. I tried to turn the foal and got the shoulders out, but then it was stuck, no amount of pulling made any headway. I went back in and found a hind foot was caught up on the pelvic brim underneath the foal, as soon as I moved it, the foal came right out. We lost the foal because the cord was pinched prematurely cutting off oxygen before the foal was fully delivered. My vet did tell me I could have delivered the foal upside down, it most likely would have fit without turning it. I have filed that in the back of my mind for future reference.

You can read this years troubles if you search the forum, I just can't rehash that one so soon. I lost mare & foal.

 

[Lucky-C-Acres-Minis]

I've had this site bookmarked for a few seasons now, just LOVE the illustrations of different dystocias.. Thought I'd share the link: Foaling Dystocias

 

[HGFarm]

I agree about the front leg thing.. I had one that had one front leg completely back and he foaled out just fine and I had one that was bent at the knee- no problem having that one either for the mare.

Lost a foal last year who had head and front legs, but also a back foot forward, so it made him into a wedge. Could not get him straightened out in time and he died. Mare is ok.

Oh! Here is something else I learned from my vet. If you have a mess in there and it's going to take some sorting out, we let the mare lay down and then roll her up on her back. You will need a couple of people to help prop her up that way- they dont seem to struggle and it also seems to allow more room in there for the vet, or whoever, to straighten out that foal and get it out. I have seen a few dystocias now (not just mine) delivered from upside down mares.

 

[lil hoofbeats]

Great topic! lots of good information! Love the illustrations on the dystocias! Foaling mares is an intense experience, and i find myself feeling many different emotions during foaling season. The extreme joy of new life, and the sorrow of a life that was not to be. Sadly, i am not sure if there is a way of preparing for a birth that may go wrong. When it is fairly simple, a front leg back, or a hind hoof in the birth canal, i have been able to correct these things(still with a great deal of effort.)When a head is turned back, and laying across the foals back, i have never been able to pull it around, that foal is usually already dead, and the foals head must be cut, and the body delivered, then the head. I am fortunate that i have a great Vet, Dr. Jeff Schutz, who was a cow Vet up in Dairyland Wisconsin before moving to NC. He is proficient with a Fetatome, and can usualy have any type dystocia out with this method in about 5-10 miniutes after preparing the Fetatome for use. It takes longer to thread it than use it. This method is usually easiest on the mare, and saves her reproductive tract for future foals. I have never had a mare that would not breed after this method of correction was used(which has been about 14 times in the past 11 years.) I would advise that if you live near a dairy or a cow farm, ask who the Vet is they use, and get on his list. Cow Vets are good at what they do, Have ALOT of experience with dystocias, and are very reasonable priced.

One last thing that i think is very important to mention, if you have a dystocia that is correctable with a viable baby, start the baby on antibiotics! When a foal in unable to get properly positioned, it is now believed by most reproduction specialists, that foal is too weak be able to position itself. Do not "wait and see" give 5 cc of Pennicillian BID for at least 5 days, and i give 1/2 cc of Baytril once daily in addition. This covers most everything with the exception of some gram negative bacteria. I have never had a problem when i have done this. Good luck to all this foaling season, Julie @ Lil Hoofbeats

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Excellent topic!

If at all possible, attend the Little King Farm foaling seminar. PRICELESS information. Charts, pictures, questions, answers and the "foal in the box" was an amazing experience that only a facility like theirs could put on.

 

[wcr]

Michelle and I had a bonding experience the first time we met as we had emailed several times and out of the blue she offered me a chance to own Val the stallion I trained and promoted to his World Championship. I went down to pick him up and am laying in bed in the trailer when at 6am I hear a lot of yelling and running horses. I figure horses are out so get up to help. She was getting a mare into the yard with a dystocia and was trying to get the baby out. She had recently been in a car accident and physically wasn't in the best of condition herself and has bigger hands than I do so I tried to see what I could do. As soon as I went in knew we weren't getting that baby out. Maiden mare with a pelvic ring the size of a coffee cup. UC Davis got there and after a fetotomy, still couldn't get baby out, the mare was euthanized.

Which brings to mind the economics of dystocias. This mare, even if saved, could never be bred again. The only way to get the baby out was a c-section and do you spend $5-6ooo for a c-section on a mare that reasonably would be worth $500 as a pet? Sometimes it is a very hard decision to make.

 

[Eagle]

WCR I personally would even if it wasn't the best financial decision as I get very attached to my animals and I need to think that I have done everything possible for them. Hubby would definitely agree with you though. I pray to never be in that situation.

 

[tagalong]

have never had a mare that would not breed after this method of correction was used(which has been about 14 times in the past 11 years.)

Maybe I misunderstood this - it sounds as if you have had to have a fetotomy done 14 times in the past 11 years? That seems rather.... high. I have only had 3 in the past 25 years.

 

[Michelle@wescofarms]

The mare in question that Kathi (WCR) was speaking of, wasn't owned by either her or I. The owner made the decision based on the usability of the mare. Personally I've had a mare C-section as it was my decision to breed her. (She was later rehomed free to a no-breed home.)

It's a hard decision to make economically for some. If it had been my mare, I would have likely have done the C-section, even though I know it's a financial major loss.

C-section's can run up to $5,000. The one I had UCD reduced the price (it was still $$$) as they wanted to use the foal (we knew it was dead) for practice resuccitating for the students and it was a Mini C-section that happened to occur during rounds so all the students piled in. It was 20+ med students all the teachers and us.

Kathi didn't tell the whole story, we even had my son (smallest hands of the three of us) go in and see if he could get past her pelvic ring. We all ended up badly bruised. Burying the mare with a guy that had had a horse explode - the people waiting 4 days to call him not an hour - he was freaked the whole time. Then we forgot the foals head. Very black humor after it was all said and done. It really was awful, but we did bond over that!

BTW Kathi - foaling is coming so you better get down here and gone before you're helping deliver maidens!

Wanted to add this - I did find the Dystocia chart (it's black/white out of an AMHA old pamphlet, so not the best, but better than nothing!), but it shows the majority of dystocia positions on one page. Anyone wants a copy, send me an email and I'll email it. [email protected]

Apparently I can't post the pic on this site for some reason from Picasa, so threw it up on our blog - Wesco Farms blog.

 

[vickie gee]

WCR I personally would even if it wasn't the best financial decision as I get very attached to my animals and I need to think that I have done everything possible for them. Hubby would definitely agree with you though. I pray to never be in that situation.

I hear ya sister. Because I have been there. I guess that actually I got out light with the c-section costing $2600. Those fees included midnight arrival and call out for the vet and two assistants, all costs incurred with the emergency c-section, disposal (for lack of a better word) of the little "angel colt", and a week of the best care for my mare. I saved the cost of the return visit to remove the staples in taking them out myself. That was in 2008 when I had only been an owner for a few months. Before I go to rambling too much (sure I will) I want to be sure and stress to anyone new or anyone that has never had the nightmare of a mare in serious trouble with a delivery that you need to have more than Plan A. Oh, and I forgot to mention $100 for a cargo van rental to get her home since I had not put Plan B or C into place. Here are Plans explained:

Plan A: Wear your rose colored glasses. Purchase some mini horse books and horse vet books. Read the forum. Admire the pretty foals. Pray for textbook delivery. Watch your mare. Ask your vet if he will be available for callout. Take vague answer as a "yes, of course." Observe mare begin labor. Call vet. Get answer to "just let nature take it's course and give her her space, horses have been doing this for years." Watch the "bubble". Watch mare thrash and push and thrash and push. Look for any foal part. Find none. Panic. Call vet back. Get no answer. Leave message. And more messages. Watch mare suffer unrealisticly. Grab phone book. Look in yellow pages for other vets skipping the ones that specify small animal only. Pick one 20 miles away. Call him. Breathe a sigh of relief when he shows up in record time with a bucket of lube in hand. Thank God. Watch him glove up and then listen to the bad news that the foal's head is turned all the way onto its own neck, the mare is too tiny inside for even a child's hand to try to reposition without risking serious injury to the mare, the foal in all probability is deceased since labor began more than 2 hours earlier, and if there is any chance to save the mare you will need to get her to the birthing center (closest known one being 2 hours away). Discuss borrowing a trailer. Get told by the vet "She has to go NOW!" Lay a quilt under mare, have vet and husband pick up quilt and mare and put her in the hatchback of a Ford Escort and head out after calling ahead and getting a heads up that staff would be there and waiting for a midnight c-section. Ride in hatchback with mare who is splashing amniotic fluid out continuously, falling down, and suffering. Hug her, comfort her, give her pain meds, witness her protruded rectum, lube up and re-insert it numerous times, kiss her, sing "My Girl" softly in her ear for what seems like forever, give more pain meds, arrive for surgery, watch in amazement and grief, and thank God that your mare is fighting all odds. This is 6 hours after water broke. Bring mare home a week later in a rented cargo van and deal with both your broken heart and her pain and broken heart.

Plan B: Have a proven dedicated vet on call. Have his emergency number and have him keep you updated of anytime he will be out of town. Read about foalings good and bad. Watch foalings on internet both good and bad. Watch your mare like a hawk. Learn the signs. Be there with her if at all possible. Know what to expect. Have everything in your kit that might possibly be needed. Thank God when all goes well. Celebrate when it does. Be glad that the vet did not have to be called and that you did not have load the mare in THE TRAILER WHICH IS READY TO ROLL.

Plan C: This is in the event that there that some difficulty is presented during foaling. Try to correct the situation. If you do not get it corrected by all means get the vet on the phone. Decide if he is coming to the farm or if you are loading the mare and going to him. Know ahead what you will pay for in case the vet cannot get the foal out in a timely manner. It is a personal decision. Fetotomy or c-section. You might even have to have the mare put down depending on the circumstances.

Yes, I rambled. But having gone through both bad and good I wanted to share the bad. Not to scare anyone but to let anyone hoping for the best know that the worst can happen. You hope it does not. But when your mare is in trouble you have to have know what the next step is. I assume this thread will end up with "the best of." I hope my contribution helps someone. My thanks go out to other contributors and I am sending well wishes to all for healthy foals and mares.