Newbies-Dystocia 101

[wcr]

Did you ever play the kids game where you stick your hand in a box and feel around and try to identify what you are feeling? Sometimes it was hard and sometimes it was kind of squishy? Welcome to dystocia 101.

We are hearing on a daily basis "we had a dystocia" and until you have one yourself it is kind of a nebulous term. Hopefully you don't find out in the middle of the night, no vet available, no help in sight and a mare in distress. Even for experienced breeders it is the worst feeling in the world to realize it is up to you to do something and for a beginner a terrifying experience. I know many on this forum live where it is difficult to even get a vet to come out or the vets available are less the optimal. I am not an expert or a vet but have been there done that and invite anyone to chime in with their experiences. This year we have many newbies that really want to learn and are asking reasonable questions and I don't ever remember this topic coming up.

Okay, we got a problem and I have to stick my hand where? What the heck am I supposed to be feeling? First is the pelvic ring, hard and doesn't move. If you have a foal body part in it getting one hand in is difficult. Add to this the mare is having contractions and your hand is getting bruised and the blood supply is getting cut off and your fingers are getting numb.

No body part in there so you get your hand in there and with the tip of your finger can feel something. What is it? Is it the top of the head, the crook of the knee bent back, a tiny rear end or just something you can't identify? Take the time to teach yourself anatomy by braile as this is the starting point to resolving any dystocia.

I am not taking this any farther since the scenario branches out in too many directions and I just want to give you something to think about. Dystocias are a medical emergency and best to have the vet on the way. I just want to point out that if you HAVE to go in, you are going in blind and can't see what is going on, and are basically working with one hand tied behind your back.

We see the losses every year and say breeding minis is not for the faint of heart. We feel bad when someone posts their lost foal, and heaven forbid, the loss of the mare. We have been there and know how it feels. All I can say is be prepared and educate yourself and don't go into breeding with rose-colored glasses on.

 

[TPs flat rock acres]

Very good information.... but I want to hear more

I am one of those people, Vet at least 45 mins away and thats if they are available. I have to be prepared so that I am not standing there should the vet take 1 -2 hours before he/she gets to me. One question I have does it happen more with mares that are under a certin height? or any? Also when should you think that there is a problem. I plan to call the vet as soon as I know for sure they are in labor. Just in case. Rather be safe than sorry. but in the mean time if the vets not here yet I can' t just stand by and not do anything. Any other information you can give would greatly be appricated or to hear from those who have had them and the foals were ok. Hearing peoples experiences is great education for us newbies. Thanks again

 

[Holly at WhiteTailsMinis]

Wow this will help alot of the newbies, when the experts share their experiences. Last year I went to Little King Farm for the foaling seminar, and all I can say about that experience was WOW! They had a box there and "foal" inside the box. It was a dystocia. You had to stick your hand in there and repostion the foal. That was a very good learning experience for me in case I ever have to " repostion" a foal. The only thing the box didnt have was the contractions.

I cant wait to see all the experts responses and experiences. I would also say if you could attend the foaling seminar at Little King Farm this year, you would not be disappointed. You will learn a lot. I know I did.

 

[MindyLee]

What is the term of dystocia?

I looked it up in the dictionary and there is no such word...

 

[RockRiverTiff]

What is the term of dystocia?

I looked it up in the dictionary and there is no such word...

Here is the first definition offered by Dictionary.com:

Dystocia - abnormal, slow, or difficult childbirth, usually because of disordered or ineffective contractions of the uterus

In horses I most often see it used in reference to malpositioned foals, but I think it's correct to call any difficult birth a dystocia. It's kind of like "colic" in that it explains the effect but not the cause.

Scott Creek has a really thorough article about dystocia on their site that includes some advice on how to recognize different problems and the best way to resolve them:

Preparing For Dystocia

 

[Reble]

Great topic, myth is not enough room to move foal around. You might be surprised once in how much room you have.

You might have to go in to your elbow.

Hip lock you need to turn head upward, this helps unlock.

Love to hear other experiences.

Now read in another post they go in and break the sack inside? I am wondering if that is such a good ideal?

 

[targetsmom]

We had one where the head and one foot presented normally and the other foot/leg was not visible at all. That is probably fairly common, but what made this one weird (and why you need to think of ALL the possibilities) is that the foot I could feel was NOT the obvious one - it was the "wrong foot" hooked over the head! So when I went to look for the second foot, I was looking on the wrong side of the body. Took only seconds to figure that out, but be aware that things like this can easily happen.

Some other points: This mare had already had several foals with no issues at all, so past history is not a good guide. When Max was born (different mare, 5 days later), we called our vet (who lives on the next street) when the alarm went off and we saw the mare was in labor. By the time he got here, she was already in trouble (a lot like the one above). He was having so much trouble getting the foal out that he had me on the phone calling a SECOND vet when a miracle happened and Max popped out. We had unplugged the camera earlier and then ran to plug it back in. We have had cameras on for 5 births and have only been able to leave it plugged in ONCE. All the other occasions were bad enough to pull the plug, although this one (Max) did result in a live birth.

 

[vickie gee]

Excellent thread. Thanks for starting this one up.

 

[TPs flat rock acres]

Yes I agree thank you!!!

I dont know if its been done before and don't know why it couldn't be done but have they ever had a live training seminar on this? For those who are far away and can't get to one. I would pay... just a thought. I will have to ask Robin

 

[Lucky-C-Acres-Minis]

We've only had one severe dystocia here on the farm (well with the horses, if I go back to when we had dairy cattle I could write a book!) *knock on wood* So thought I'd share!

It was 2009, last foal of the season.. Mare is an aged mare, never had any problems foaling before, was bred to my appy stallion for a repeat foal to her 2008 colt. Had gone out and checked her after work, gave all the classic signs: dropped, sunk in at the hips, relaxed vulva, huge udder, white milk and was sweating.. I knew it would be only a matter of time, I left her quickly, shut up the barn and headed to the house to watch from the camera (house isn't that far away).. Not long after I started watching on cam she began pacing, biting sides, lay down, get up etc. She finally laid down and went flat, but of course her rear end in the only blind spot on the cam! So I quickly headed back out leaving my sister and brother watching the cam. When I got out to the barn she was flat with heavy contractions, of course when she heard me she sat up on her sternum and gave me 'the look', laid flat and pushed again.. Nothing was presenting, I waved my bro/sis to come to the barn, and after another push and nothing I decided to go in.

I got to about my wrist when I felt a hoof/leg, could tell that the hoof was presenting right, but knew immediately I need to find the other.. Went in a little further and still no second leg, nor nose and I knew we had a problem.. My bro/sis made it to the barn and told them to get my parents, my sister ran to get them while my brother entered the stall with me.. I told him to help me get the mare up as I was hoping with her standing it would allow the foal to slide back and give me a little more room to work. We got her up and I went back in, still only one hoof/leg, was able to reach in further and to my surprise (and horror) felt the knee to the second leg (leg bent down like when the foal lays), no nose, but felt ears and a forehead (head was tucked down). Right then my heart sank and adrenaline kicked in and knew time was running short, told my brother what I had found and said to keep her up and standing as I needed to push the foal back, by then my parents and sister had arrived.. I was able to push the foal back far enough to get the second leg up and presenting correct, but by then her contractions were getting much stronger, my arm was tiring out and I didn't have the arm strength to pop the foals head up.. My dad tried but his arm was too big and didn't give him enough room to maneuver. That's when my brother stepped in, he reached in and tried for what seemed like forever, at this point I was worried we had lost the foal as time seemed to stand still and felt like we'd been trying for hours.. Finally my brother took all the strength he had and pushed the foal back as hard as he could, and by pure miracle was able to pop her head up and she slid out.. We all held our breath as I grabbed towels and began drying and rubbing her as hard as I could, and didn't breathe until she took her first and lifted her head..

All in all, it took us 45 minutes from when I first went in til she slipped out, but I'll tell you it seemed like FOREVER!

Thankfully both mom and baby checked a-ok by the vet, mare had no tears etc. and the little girl is now a gorgeous 2 year old who will be heading to Canada in the spring. The mare rebred on her first heat (not foal heat, the one after) and gave us our little Max last year.

 

[minie812]

I have a video on my website of my maiden mare last year having a difficult delivery. It started out as a sitting dog and was able to get her to lay down and worked with her for about 10 min pushing in and adjusting the foal. Only one leg was present and the head was stuck under. I did not rush her as I was concerned as to saving the mare. I worked with the contractions and as she tired gave a final push IN and a twist and we saved them both. The video is a tad fuzzy but maybe it will help someone save a mare or foal. It is heartbreaking to deal with for sure.

 

[HGFarm]

When you are in there feeling around... ok so you find a foot. You then better know WHAT foot. Is the foot facing up or down? Then feel up the leg to the joints.... if it's a front leg you will find the knee and the foot bends one way, if a back leg, you will find the hock and the leg bends the other way. You have to determine which leg or legs you have to know what you are up against. Where is the head in relation to those legs?

Our vet recommends if you have mares due, make SURE you always have PLENTY of gas in your vehicle and your trailer is either hooked up, or easily accessable to hook up and use. Make sure it's not packed full of trash that was supposed to go to the dump last week or other stuff is not stored in it. If your vet can't make it out there- they may be able to meet you somewhere.

There have been times our vet has had to meet people part way... babies have been foaled out in Burger King parking lots, at 2 a.m. in the grocery store parking lot, in her front yard, etc... It doesnt matter where you meet up, just that your horse has access to a veterinarian as soon as possible!! Time is everything.

 

[Eagle]

Great topic. Thank you to all you experienced Breeders who find the time to help teach us newbies. I will never tire of reading and learning from you.

THANK YOU

 

[TPs flat rock acres]

I have a video on my website of my maiden mare last year having a difficult delivery. It started out as a sitting dog and was able to get her to lay down and worked with her for about 10 min pushing in and adjusting the foal. Only one leg was present and the head was stuck under. I did not rush her as I was concerned as to saving the mare. I worked with the contractions and as she tired gave a final push IN and a twist and we saved them both. The video is a tad fuzzy but maybe it will help someone save a mare or foal. It is heartbreaking to deal with for sure.

can you post a link so I can view it? thanks for the information very valuable!! so much appricated.

 

[supaspot]

http://www.willowrocminiaturehorsefarm.com/2011marestare.htm

 

[Magic]

Our vet recommends if you have mares due, make SURE you always have PLENTY of gas in your vehicle and your trailer is either hooked up, or easily accessable to hook up and use. Make sure it's not packed full of trash that was supposed to go to the dump last week or other stuff is not stored in it. If your vet can't make it out there- they may be able to meet you somewhere.

This is SO important!! Even if a vet can make it to your place, a mare may need an emergency C section and you're going to have to drive her to a vet clinic to have that done.

One dystocia I dealt with was in a 30" mare and one leg was back. Luckily a friend was visiting me when the mare went into labor because I needed her to lead the mare around the stall to keep her from contracting too strongly. When she was just standing she'd go down. Here I was, bent over at the waist with my arm all the way inside a little mare, walking behind her as I tried to grab that elusive second foot and praying that the vet would get there soon. Got the foal out before the vet got there and both mare and foal were fine, thank goodness.

This is a great thread, the more information one can get, the better.

 

[Miniv]

Great thread.......and some great posts.

I've also written a couple of descriptions on our health pages in our website, about how to correct some simple dystocias. Some vets may not agree, but I totally believe in not being shy about going inside the mare to check the foal's position when the mare has been pushing for about 5 minutes with nothing happening......or if the white bubble happens without anything behind it. I'm usually the one to go in because Larry's hand and forearm are rather large. (Our vet actually taught us some things to do.)

I feel for a hoof and nose first.....then another hoof. Feeling for ears is good too. The ears tell you if the head is in the right position. I've also had a situation when I felt feet (pointed the wrong way) and a TAIL! This is yet ANOTHER case when it's good to NOT BE SHY about pushing the foal back into the mare as much as you can.

A breach birth can work out okay if you are proactive. The foal needs to be pushed back inside the mare so you can take hold of the rear feet/legs and not allow them to curl up and under. Remember to work with the mare's contractions and pull as much as possible as she pushes. With a Breach, the blood/oxygen to the umbilical cord is being cut off when the foal goes through the birth canal.....so you don't have that much time. We've had one breach and she came out just fine.

Probably should have mentioned at the beginning.....when you think you have a problem birth, call your vet. But we've learned NOT to wait for him/her to arrive before going "in" because many times it's been a simple correction (something as simple is the nose hooked up or a leg curled under the chest) and waiting for 30 minutes (or whatever) would have resulted in a dead foal and/or injury to the mare. If the dystocia is beyond your ability to correct, at least you know the vet is on the way and can help your mare.....By then the foal is probably gone and your primary concern is obviously the momma.

This has gotten longer than I expected....but there is one other thing I thought I'd mention. So often people are upset because the dystocia was of a foal whose head was flipped back against its shoulder or up over its neck/back and they or their vet couldn't get it out fast enough. I'd just like to tell people that when the foal's head is in weird positions like that, it probably means the baby was already dead when their mare went into labor.

There would have been nothing the midwives or vet could have done.

 

[TPs flat rock acres]

Love this information thank you so much. Watched the video. So excited it ended happy. keep the information coming it really does help.

 

[Eagle]

Sorry to keep picking your brains but as my mares get nearer all sorts of things are going through my head so I have a few questions.

I have seen several foals and a few mares lost in the last few weeks due to the foal not being in the correct position. In all these mares I noticed that their bellies were still very barrel like. It is so much easier to see on cam as you are watching from above. Is the fact that their babies didn't drop a sign? These mares were also all uncomfortable for some time before birthing.

Is it possible to give medication to stop contractions like they do in humans to give the foal time to turn?

Also, is keeping them in for many days a possible cause for problem? Do they need to walk about? I ask this cos 1 of my mares won't roll in the stall and the first thing she does when I put her out is go down and have a good roll, sometimes she does it in the hall as she just can't wait.

Thank you in advance.

Renee

 

[vickie gee]

Eagle,

Although I stalled my mare at day 300 I tried to give her some time out of the stall everyday. If it was pretty enough I would take her on a lead out to the pasture and let her graze for a while. Spring comes early in Texas. If weather was not so good I let her have some time in the corral to roll, walk around, and at least see all her buddies. Helps alleviate "cabin fever." Also would give me time to clean out her stall while she was out of my way but within close proximity.