How many have switched

[Kathy2m]

I volunteer at our local show and the judge we had is also a miniature breed judge. He had asked me what I was doing with my minis now, I told him I had gotten the bug to drive, CDE type driving and how much I LOVED it. He told me that they had lost a lot of mini people to that type of driving and that the numbers have been down at the shows because of it. I was wondering how many of you have made the switch or are planning to.

Kathy

 

[targetsmom]

I am not sure that you can count me among the ones that "switched" as I was interested in CDE type driving before I got into the minis and don't show much in AMHA or AMHR. I had a big Pinto that I showed in all Pinto classes (including dressage), so when I got into the minis we had to have Pintos so we could continue showing there. Many of the mini drivers at our Pinto shows also show CDE/carriage driving, and word is spreading!! The driving club we just joined is gaining mini owners every month I think. Their Jeff Morse CDE Clinic last month had more minis than big horses. And of course, this type of driving is right in line with my dressage background. By the way, the minis are also hugely popular at our Pinto shows, so much so that we added three new mini divisions for 2009. That includes Amateur, plus Amateur and Open Gymkhana classes (driving).

 

[Reble]

Hubby tried it a few years ago, also went to a couple clinics, but they seem to be very few or only a couple of minis in the club for CDE driving in Ontario. He decided to stay with the fun shows near by instead, lot more minis at these shows, makes it more fun. There has been a few other mini people trying it now in Ontario, but when we where doing it, only a couple of minis.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

I've been in local saddle clubs, 4-H, and breed registry shows since I was a little kid with my big horses so I knew when I got Kody that I'd want to show and would be looking into the breed ring since my local saddle club shows do not offer driving. (Well, one does but it's outrageously expensive and the three classes are back to back to back.) I found that AMHA wasn't my style despite some good programs but the atmosphere at AMHR shows suited us and I do enjoy showing there for the variety of classes available. I love doing liberty, jumping, obstacle, versatility, the works,

and would not give that up.

I would also love to show Pinto but there's this one little problem...my horse doesn't have spots!

Which is really too bad because I think Pinto would be our niche with their awesome award programs and wider style of driving such as optional checks, open bridles allowed (I think

) and a better variety of carts accepted. If I could get that style of show for an unspotted horse, that's probably where I'd be most of the time.

We don't have ADS Pleasure Driving shows in this area or I'd be trying them too since they get me the variety of driving classes I crave with a judging structure I'm more familiar with. Trying to get together a decent turnout would probably be the death of me (clothes!! Eeek!!

) but I'd love the opportunity to enter Reinsmanship and test myself against other dedicated drivers under a knowledgeable carriage driving judge. Alas, no such events in this area.

So! What do you do when you don't have spots, don't fit into AMHA, are too old for 4-H, can't show PD because there aren't any around, aren't suited for halter at the local SC shows, and want fair and accountable judging in a driving venue? As I discovered when I got Kody, that leaves me with one option....combined driving events. Good thing there's bunches in my area!

Seriously, I like the miniature horse shows but the driving classes drive me NUTS! The judging is very inconsistent, there is a lack of education about driving as a discipline and it's all about showing off The Horse (who-happens-to-be-in-harness) rather than the Harness Horse (as in how well they are trained.) There is a place for that, but IMHO there need to be skills classes as well like there are in other disciplines. Horses who are rearing and screaming on the rail and blowing up in line should NOT be placed over well-behaved horses in a so-called "Country Pleasure" class where the rules say manners are important.

It's hard not to become disillusioned when the Big Name Trainers themselves admit it's all about politics and what wins is cranking a horse up into a check regardless of their actual outline.

I think the miniature shows have a blind spot and until it's addressed they will continue to lose exhibitors to other venues. They are a great option for those who are primarily pursuing the American Miniature Horse, but for those who are pursuing driving itself as a sport and challenge with a Miniature Horse, it's more than a bit lacking. EDUCATE our judges, EDUCATE our fellow exhibitors, and start placing the classes according to the rules instead of who's holding the lines.

Then maybe some of those who have left will be interested in coming back, and new drivers who don't currently show might be coaxed to. I know the advent of the Western Country Pleasure classes is the only reason I've continued to drive at AMHR events. Otherwise it was frankly a waste of my money and I was tired of being helpfully told by judges that I should tighten my check.

I don't want the breed shows to change to become ADS, I just want them to play by their own rules and perhaps be open to ideas from the increasing number of big horse people who are downsizing. The registries are already doing this with new awards that can be earned outside the ring, let's take this as an opportunity for growth and broaden the horizons of the Miniature Horse a little.

So will I leave the breed ring completely for ADS? No. Do I prefer ADS competition with their clear score sheets and emphasis on progressive training without gimmicks? You bet.

Took a long time to say two little lines, didn't I?

Leia

 

[sedeh]

I show Pinto and our mini numbers have been growing. I like to do everything with my mini's.....halter, jumping, in-hand trail and driving! Since I "specialize" in pinto miniatures I doubt I'd stop showing Pinto. However, I love the concept of CDE's as I do have a dressage background. Someone posted a thread a while back about competitive trail driving(or something similar) that sounded really interesting.

 

[~Lisa~]

I have to say I am the opposite. I do help out at our local ADS driving clubs shows and ATD events. I like to watch and enjoy the people but have no interest in participating in the ADS or CDE driving events.

 

[Minimor]

While I'd like to try CDE, I won't be switching over. We do have an active driving club (mostly big horses, a few ponies) based in Winnipeg--100 miles from here--, but they do not offer VSE at their events and I'm not going to compete in the pony division where a navigator is required. I've got the horses and the carts, but won't be putting them in CDE. We don't have pleasure driving shows around here, so when we want to compete in driving it will be in the breed ring.

That's okay, I enjoy showing AMHR, and I can do my dressage driving for fun at home!

 

[Kendra]

While I am very excited about entering some carriage driving events this summer, I have been driving in AMHA shows for 20 years, really, really enjoy them, and I certainly won't be giving them up!!

 

[ClickMini]

I do both and love both.

 

[Minxiesmom]

I am currently showing in Pinto shows, doing all the different classes. I have done one Combined Driving training event and enjoyed it so much. I realized, with my horse, I wasn't going to be able to do both at the same time. My plan is after my horse attains his Pinto Championship, he will be retired to CDE events, although there are none close by yet.

The new colt I purchased is a little bigger by plan (35-36?). After his career in the show ring, he will become a CDE horse. I felt a 36" horse would be better suited to the CDE than my 33" guy. I know many people use the smaller horses in CDE, but my preference is to have a little bigger guy.

I love showing in the ring, but I also found that I loved doing the cross country driving while still having it be in competition. Not coming from a dressage background, I have found driven dressage is challanging, but not as mysterious as I thought. It is really just getting your horse trained. My little guy is suprisingly(to me), a good driven dressage horse! And driving cones is just flatout fun!

 

[Sandee]

I see so many references to dressage driving. Some please explain more precisely what you're talking about. I come from a Western background and the only thing "dressage" brings to my mind is fancy stepping horses going from cone A to H etc.

 

[susanne]

I never had any great desire to enter any "halter in motion" (aka breed show driving) classes. If I want to pay to go in circles I can always buy a ticket for a merry-go-round I admit that I would love to see how Mingus would do in Roadster and Versatility, but...

The decision was taken out of my hands when my vision went south. Driving in a crowded and typically very dark arena is not my idea of a safe pursuit. I'm not afraid for myself, but I would never endanger my horse, other horses or other people that way.

I feel a much stronger affinity for CDE and ADS-style driving, as these classes offer a lifelong pursuit with an endless opportunity for improvement.

Fortunately in CDE my vision is not a problem, as all events are held outdoors in bright light. Only one entry is ever in dressage or cones at any given time, and in marathon you are far from any other competitor. If a problem were ever to arise where I thought my horse's safety were at risk, I'd immediately drop out, so only my wallet would be hurt.

Unfortunately, ADT (arena driving trials) are pretty much out unless the arena is unusually well-lit (so far, the ones I've known of are very dark). I'd love to try other ADS-style classes, such as reinsmanship and the like, but again I'd have to evaluate the number of entries and any danger my limited vision might cause.

As for giving up breed shows for ADS, I will always enjoy AMHR halter and liberty, and would love to have a go out jumping. I see no reason to choose between these other than money, but if two events were scheduled at the same time, I'd likely choose ADS.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

I see so many references to dressage driving. Some please explain more precisely what you're talking about. I come from a Western background and the only thing "dressage" brings to my mind is fancy stepping horses going from cone A to H etc.

Sandee, we do perform a test in a lettered ring just like the ridden horses do.

The space is larger of course to allow for the cart, the circles and figures are larger for the same reason and we do not have lateral movements at all or canter movements except at FEI competitions, but otherwise the principles are the same. You're judged on your horse's rhythm, straightness, relaxation, suppleness, submission and impulsion and the accuracy of your figures. They get more complicated as you go up the levels and of course it's very, shall we say...interesting...

to try and do all this without the use of leg or seat. You get scored from 1-10 for each movement then there are cumulative scores for overall impression and driver skill as well.

Driven dressage is the first phase of the three day eventing sport called Combined Driving and in some parts of the country there are entire stand-alone driven dressage shows. Very cool!

Your final score is converted into penalty points so the lower your score, the better. A score in the 70's is "You need to do some homework," 60's is decent, 50's is pretty good, 40's are reason to be proud and 30's get framed and go on the wall. A score that breaks 30 is like winning the lottery.

80's...well...we don't talk about 80's. *LOL* Let's just say it is possible to gallop through most of a dressage test.

Not all American Driving Society (ADS) events involve dressage but it's a big part of it. Whether ridden or driven, dressage is about teaching the horse to use his body in a way that keeps him sound and happy long into his golden years. It simply means "Training."

Leia

 

[Kathy2m]

We don't have ADS Pleasure Driving shows in this area or I'd be trying them too since they get me the variety of driving classes I crave with a judging structure I'm more familiar with. Trying to get together a decent turnout would probably be the death of me (clothes!! Eeek!!

) but I'd love the opportunity to enter Reinsmanship and test myself against other dedicated drivers under a knowledgeable carriage driving judge. Alas, no such events in this area.


Leia

Now Leia, There is a thread over on your site all about turnouts

We have such a mix here. I just love it. ADT's, HDT'S, CDE's and like the show last week end there was a working class, reinsmanship class, cones, and then x-country with a few obstacle's.

I never drove at an AMHA or R show I did the halter obstacle and H/J classes and to spend that much money and be the only one in the class was disappointing. Since I've started ADS driving I never looked back at the breed shows.

Kathy

 

[Kawgirl]

I'm hoping to do some ADS shows when my new horse has enough miles on him. I just wish their shows weren't so darn expensive!

I would enjoy the breed shows more if they didn't have soooo many halter classes to wait through to get a few driving classes. I especially enjoy obstacle driving, but it's usually one of tlhe last classes and some of the obstacles are not very challenging.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Now Leia, There is a thread over on your site all about turnouts

Why do you think I haven't posted on that thread?! *LOL*

I'm hoping to do some ADS shows when my new horse has enough miles on him. I just wish their shows weren't so darn expensive!

I typically spend about $200 for one performance horse at a three day AMHR show plus show photos, and about the same for a three-day CDE. I know some areas are more expensive though! Prices for some of the Californian CDE's make my eyes do this:

Leia

 

[MiniHGal]

Interesting that he thought attendance was down because of transfer to ADS events...I would have blamed it on the economy.

But then maybe there are a lot of people in your area changing over.

I really enjoy CDEs. Its about the process of training and partnership with your horse--to a very high level. Nothing quite like galloping through a hazard with little room to spare making tight corners and smooth exits. But then, I am a bit of a speed demon. Fortunately, for people just getting into the sport, training level is nice and quiet--no cantering allowed. I also enjoy the camaraderie with the 'big horse' people.

Also, you get constructive feedback on your dressage test from the judge. I feel like I really get my money's worth from a test, since 1-5 judges are observing me in the arena for the whole time of the test--5-10min or so.

For everyone who thinks dressage is a bit mysterious and difficult sounding; it really isn't! For training level, which is the entry level, and the level where you should be initially (and even after that too), you just have to walk, trot, stop, back up (except in one test where you don't have to rein back), and walk on a long rein (let the horse stretch his neck out and down and lengthen his stride). Its in a pattern, but pretty basic, all in all. Of course, it gets more difficult up the levels. And there are lots of little things that can go into your dressage to make it look better and attain all those goals Leia mentioned, but really, not too hard.

I started out with the ADS shows several years ago and have been very happy with it; I don't really think breed shows are quite my cup of tea. Really, I don't care for pleasure shows either, but the turnouts are pretty! And of course I will go to support our pleasure shows, as they are somewhat rare, as most people prefer CDEs.

As per cost, the big, 3/4 day CDEs are getting fairly expensive around here, but, well, there's A LOT that they have to pay for, so I don't blame them. However, there are many many small events and 2 day shows that are ridiculously cheap IMO. And they are just as fun! If any one is interested in watching a CDE or other driving event in CA (well, there are some OR and WA on this as well sometimes), here's a calendar to check out: http://carriagedrivingessentials.com/calendar.php