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Cranky, I'm happy I don't share your perspective. I'm going to be happy to cast my right wing vote in November. Ron Paul is clearly not a viable option and as an American, an employer, and business owner -- there's no way I'd vote for obama and no chance I would waste my vote on any third ticket run.
 
Fear, of letting go is what makes it difficult for many.
Miniwhinny, does that include letting go of options that are not viable? Ron Paul...

And at the risk of being flamed, you've got a long track record under your prior name of ridiculing those who have religious faith. It seems you work it into so many differernt discussions in an antagonistic way.

I think faith is more often than not a personal asset, not a reflection of weakness.
 
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At least life is easy for those of us on the West coast. Ballots are being sent out this week and we only have two choices left to vote for! Now that shouldn't be hard should it lol!

Oregon is pretty much split politically down the line that splits it geographically. West of the Cascade's is very democratic/liberal. East of the mountain range is pretty much Republican. Unfortunately our large areas of population are all on the West side - Eugene, Salem and the greater Portland area.
 
Cranky, I'm happy I don't share your perspective. I'm going to be happy to cast my right wing vote in November. Ron Paul is clearly not a viable option and as an American, an employer, and business owner -- there's no way I'd vote for obama and no chance I would waste my vote on any third ticket run.
Oh, I'm back to cranky. Bummer. Personally I don't see how you could be "happy" with the state of affairs at all. What could possibly be wrong with my perspective? I am a true remnant Christian, I am an American, I am fairly well studied, I swore and abide by an oath I took to uphold and defend our Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic. I refuse to do the wrong thing. My "perspective" emanates from this core. You do NOT share this perspective? Hmmm this might be the problem. (warning Yoda impersonation ahead) The dark side force strong with this one be.....

Well, I have certainly provided ample proof for my points so lets just cut to the core. Its really just this simple. When folk make the claim that they disagree with Ron Paul and especially with venom dripping from their words (This is a VERY important "tell" people), I merely ask them "what part of the Constitution do YOU disagree with?" This logical question elicits NO logical answer and all the aforementioned attack and avoidance behaviors are modeled. Engagement with reason is requested but rarely provided.

Would you be willing to tell me why R.P. is not a viable option, please? While I understand that one of the sticking issue's is foreign policy, nobody provides specificity about that sticking point or really any of the others that they might have.

You should probably know, well at least if you have been paying attention, that I already, most likely, know your answers,

Did you ever notice,.... That when the neocon mouthpieces and paid parrot-change-agents get vociferous and passionate about maintaining and leading us further into slavery as they do everyday on the "public" air-waves, they are WORSHIPED and parroted and "ditto"ed from here to election day. And then AFTER election day, the neocon-caster must spend a majority off their time doing damage control in support the liar they just helped get elected and justifying all those broken promises?....

Whereas the polite but insistent voice for Liberty and Freedom is reviled and called "cranky" by those who refuse to come out of their self imposed tunnel and into the light? OMGoodness, I think I just channeled Andy Rooney..... Sure miss that guy.
 
Crank, just calling you as you've taking to calling yourself. You're Cranky, miniwhinny morphed into another name, and is now calling herself Ozy. I'm sticking with Jill.

You have provided ample proof to me that you fully feel what you say. I sincerely do not feel RP is a viable option, and while I like much about him him, I do not see him through your eyes.

I am not at all happy with the political situation now, but I look forward to seeing Romney as our president. I think he will do a good job.
 
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Miniwhinny, does that include letting go of options that are not viable? Ron Paul...

And at the risk of being flamed, you've got a long track record under your prior name of ridiculing those who have religious faith. It seems you work it into so many differernt discussions in an antagonistic way.

I think faith is more often than not a personal asset, not a reflection of weakness.
I'll respond to this, if I may Mini,

I think that I have made it abundantly clear that I am first and foremost a person of "religious faith" what ever that is, according to you..... So has R.P. However, unlike the Christian "right" we have no right to jam this "religious faith" down anybodies throat! God does not need your help in killing the "heathen". Rather we are called to model, (and in my case as far away from mirrors as possible.....
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If he calls who he will (and he does), this simplifies the marching orders. And there is only one standing order. Love.

Will Mini and I agree on everything? Nope. (wouldn't you have to say this about everybody you know?) BUT and this is the CRITICAL but,

We CAN and MUST agree to Love one another. And so I shall and without reservation. And that kiddo's brings about Unity leading to Liberty and Justice for ALL.
 
Cranky, I'm confused as to why you'd be responding to what I said about miniwhinny's history because I am specifically speaking about her posts (as miniwhinny) over the past four or five years. I am not a member of the "religious right". I'm a person who has faith but no affiliation with organized religion. I think it's a true reflection of character when someone repeatedly ridicules another over their faith. Since I see that having flared up again in this thread, I felt like speaking up.
 
Crank, just calling you as you've taking to calling yourself. "
Not true. YOU called me cranky. I accepted the attack and adopted the name happily.

"You're Cranky, "

Also not true. Those that have taken the time to get to know me ALSO know that this is not true.

" miniwhinny morphed into another name, and is now calling herself Ozy.

I'm sticking with Jill. "

Ah yes this goes to the heart of the problem

'You have provided ample proof to me that you fully feel what you say."

Also not entirely true. I have provided ample proof PERIOD. The addition of "you fully feel what you say" is a Hegelian construct (sophistry or word game) meant to deflect from undeniable truth and your requested response, also a "soft" attack".

"I sincerely do not feel RP is a viable option, and while I like much about him him, I do not see him through your eyes."

This one statement says much (I told you that I've worn an analyst hat for a good many years.)

We'll dissect only two pertinent points.

1) The statement reveals the truth I've asserted in that when queried for specifics, NONE of any rational value will be forthcoming. there are two basic reasons a) There are no rational disagreements and b) They know it. Also, to reveal their "disagreement" opens them up to a dose of rationality, in the counter, that will clearly reveal the tenaciously clung to and vacuous position that they hold. This is why when you are lucky enough to slip through the "screening process" of an on air "media" change agent, they RUN away from you. The light of truth is just too revealing. They simply cannot have undeniable truth messing up their "operation".

"I am not at all happy with the political situation now,"

You should be. You had a chance to pick the same truthful statesman last time and (I'm just guessing here) you refused him. McPain too, was an enemy of Liberty and was put up by the "party" to loose. Ergo you did "split the vote" and voted for Obama BY voting for McPain.

Again the greatest danger of "splitting the vote" is the put up of two who are most alike. This time around, the same scenario is being repeated, primarily because reason has not just left the building but the country as well. Those of us (and the group is getting MUCH bigger by the day) who refuse to compromise on truth will again sadly watch the sham go the same way again, irregardless of which liar "wins". You point at us as the reason why every-time, but in fact it is because of you, every-time. We are NOT the problem here.

"but I look forward to seeing Romney as our president. I think he will do a good job.
"
Ok lets try this from a different angle, WHY do you look forward to him "becoming" President"

Why do you "think" that he will do a good job? What is it that you can point to historically that would cause you to think he would "do a good job"

Warning, Logic is roaming to and fro seeking those he may devour....
 
Cranky, I did call you cranky (and you were) and since then, you've embraced and adopted the handle as your own.

Some reasons I like Romney: I think Romney did very well in the debates and I agreed with much of what he said, I think he can defeat Obama, and I really like that he's a successful business man.

Whether or not that partial list is good enough for you isn't any more up to me than it is of concern to me. I think Romney will be the GOP nominee. I will vote the GOP ticket. This is because the Republican Party matches my feelings about important matters (the economy, National security, personal responsibility) much more closely than the Democratic Party does. Plain and simple.

You may have made some brilliant points in your epic long LB posts, but you're not on my list of the political talking heads. I just don't have the desire to fully explore your own long justifications of your own point of view (your "logic"?). Many others enjoy doing so, and it's never bad news when people think about politics.

And, I have to say this from you:

Jill:
miniwhinny morphed into another name, and is now calling herself Ozy. I'm sticking with Jill.
 
Cranky:
Ah yes this goes to the heart of the problem
Is pretty darn funny
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So sorry if me being me, me and really just me is a problem for you but it's a lot easier than hiding behind changing screen names or playing someone else on the internet. I'm pretty darn consistently myself -- like it or not. It's gotten me to a good spot so far.
 
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Cranky, I'm confused as to why you'd be responding to what I said about miniwhinny's history because I am specifically speaking about her posts (as miniwhinny) over the past four or five years. I am not a member of the "religious right". I'm a person who has faith but no affiliation with organized religion. I think it's a true reflection of character when someone repeatedly ridicules another over their faith. Since I see that having flared up again in this thread, I felt like speaking up.
I understand your confusion.... Yet, I believe that Ozy is fully aware of my stand and it being far more defined (actually my very core) than "a person of faith" and yet I've had no such attack. Now bein a student and all, I gotta think that there is a reason fer that.

Building walls is not "attractive" I am called to be "attractive". That is best done with Love. Trust me, thats ALL I gots goin for me.... If I don't show the Love of Christ in all that I do, how am I any different than the world. Just as I don't want my Liberty infringed, neither will I infringe on Ozy's or anybody Else's by insisting that things be done only my way.

Rather, and this is an admitted weakness but ALSO in the finest of our founding traditions, I will at ALL times defend those whose Liberty is being taken from them and wake them to their plight. For you see the men who stood FAST at the bridge so long ago were Pastors and their congregants. And here is the best thing about that. They did not even share the same belief and were from different orthodoxies! Yet they ALL came together, stood fast and died TOGETHER to defeat the tyrant. The SAME tyrant we face today.

ONLY love can do that. I don't like bullies and I don't like tyrants. Seems like I have always had to stay my hand and mouth from my first instinct when dealing with them. I have chosen to stand fast on TRUTH that IS logical and CLEARLY defined. I embrace anybody who chooses same.
 
Cranky, I did call you cranky (and you were) and since then, you've embraced and adopted the handle as your own.
Oiy already rather than again engage in the 5 yr old circular logic argument, we'll just set your untruth aside.

Some reasons I like Romney:

GOOD finally some meat even if no specifics,

I think Romney did very well in the debates and I agreed with much of what he said

I kept wondering specifically what he was saying as being a polished Politician, he had a good volume of rather empty words that could mean a wide range of things. Lots of wiggle room for breaking promises later in other words. Remember, he is is on record stating that he will move to the left and therefore break promises. I guess this shallow rhetoric appeals to some, but not me. Kinda like agreeing with air.

, I think he can defeat Obama,

In fact he may, it depends on whom the masters choose. As I've stated his ties to the banking houses, their agenda and his strong and long ties to their organs like the Mossad make it difficult to know at this point.

and I really like that he's a successful business man.

Ah yes, the now typical neocon theme of government run like a business and the President as the CEO. In reading the Constitution this is an abhorrent thought process and the document is void of ANY sense of this mind set altogether. Our founders, FULLY understanding the nature of corporations made manifestly clear that unlike England, America would operate devoid those trappings. The two thought process' are antithetical to each other. The one is based on Admiralty Process also known as the law of the sea, mercantile law or today, UCC. The other and noble system of Law is Common Law. Our Constitution was written in Common law. Again the two systems are antithetical!

Whether or not that partial list is good enough for you isn't any more up to me than it is of concern to me. I think Romney will be the GOP nominee. I will vote the GOP ticket. This is because the Republican Party matches my feelings about important matters (the economy,

Um the rep "party" also drove the economy into the ground for decades.

National security,

Really? I would suggest that you upgrade your intel sources pretty dramatically. They have led to wars what didn't need fought and did so with provable lies masquerading as "intelligence". The phsy-op campaign for weeks on T.V. prior to the "first" gulf war was quite successful. In the end the reasons "claimed" were proven false. So much so that the official reason has had to change several times since then and even today. How do we know this? Because the mythical wmd's can be detected from orbiting satellites, just like those airliners that went "missing" all at the same instant, I might add. Ritter, Kay and the Austrian (can't recall his name at the moment) all emphatically stated No wmd's Can't recall if it was Kay who asked "If you know where they are tell us and we will go get them" I believe Rummy's response was a very precise, north, east, west and south of Baghdad ...... Ritter was destroyed by the neo's for having the temerity to tell the truth as he witnessed it. This horrible and singular event was used by your party for all froward motion since and is a significant "way-point" as to why we are where we are in the world today and why we are so much more unsafe.

personal responsibility)

We must define personal responsibility for "they" refuse to take responsibility for their actions. We the People bear the full brunt and responsibility for their actions. They and they alone have created ALL of these messes and problems in BOTH parties yes, but right now were talking about yours and mine. Economically we are being destroyed, Bot parties are responsible but it was the rep party that started the unConstitutional tarps

much more closely than the Democratic Party does. Plain and simple. You may have made some brilliant points in your epic long LB posts, but you're not on my list of the political talking heads.

Wait a minute how can I be "epic" and not on the list? Ah perhaps because I don't speak "politics" preferring to speak Liberty instead.

I just don't have the desire to fully explore your own long justifications of your own point of view (your "logic"?)

Yes this has also been the point all along. But then all of this hasn't been for you........... While I try to never give up hope, I've been reading tea-leaves for a long time now. My read on you thus far has been correct. Hopefully others have taken note of my epic (HA) long posts and have had their eyes opened to things as they are.

.

Many others enjoy doing so, and it's never bad news when people think about politics.
Yes but hopefully what has shined throughout this "epic" is the shunning of "politics" in favor of embracing Liberty.

Thanks for your time everybody,
 
Well, maybe I should be flattered that you found me interesting enough to read and follow
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Again, it wasn't for for really about you. The interest was clinical and served a very good purpose.
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I dunno, Carriage. I don't see a massive conspiracy here as much as a massive, convoluted attempt to create one. I have always doubted that RP had any chance to win - it is far "safer" fpr the GOP to stick to the usual approach and not try anything new.

And RP is just another politician. They all lie their asses off at times. Or at the very least, forget to check their "facts".
 
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Well, I can't believe it. I actually agree with Tag on something that is not horse related
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And, *pout* the LB autobot let her say a**es. It never lets me fully express certain emotions. Maybe it only likes cursing in the plural from
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"Asses" is cursing? Not that I have ever known or seen... huh.

If I said "lie their butts/bottoms/rear ends/buttocks off" it just does not have the same "ring" to it...
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