What Gives?

[Ferrah]

After adjusting my harness and cart to where I was satisfied I have finally started driving Spyder.

He has been a good boy just like I knew he would. I have driven him about 10 times now and he has done really great, save for one thing, he has a really annoying habit of trying to transition into a canter.

Spyder doesn't try to do this canter transition when he is in a circle, in a circle he is really quiet and steady with his head. In a larger cricle or an oval he is constantly lifting his shoulders and head/neck like he is going to transition into a canter. I have NEVER cantered him in harness when I practiced on the long lines, so I have no idea where he is getting this idea to lope from.

All I have been doing with him so far is slow trotting and walking with some circles and direction changes.

So what gives? I know he is not tossing his head, because he doesn't toss his head, he just lifts his shoulder and head/neck to go into a canter. Why is he doing this and how can I help him learn to stop?

 

[Katie Iceton]

My horse does the same thing, kinda of a jumpy trot, and I just work him through it, make him realise that he cant canter and just keep him trotting through it. Maybe some half halts as well when he does it..I find this helps my horse..

 

[Ferrah]

I have been doing half halts everytime he does it and I have not yet seen any improvment.

 

[Katie Iceton]

oh ok..aha sorry for trying to help

 

[Ferrah]

I didn't mean that I didn't appreciate your suggestion. I do appreciate your suggestion, I just have also been trying the half halts and I haven't seen an improvement in it. I didn't mean to come off sounding as if I didn't appreciate it. Sorry.

oh ok..aha sorry for trying to help

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I think the trouble maybe that he has not learned to transition into extended trot instead of canter.

In a horses movement vocabulary, very few have an extended trot as the norm after working trot.

Most horses, when in working gaits will naturally go up into a canter after working trot.

You need to go back to basics, put down some trotting poles flat on the ground and teach him a good open extend.

NOW- having worked a lot with show horses- you NEVER break into a canter form a full on extended trot, you ALWAYS come back into working trot and up into canter - breaking form an extend is clumsy as all the weight is in the wrong place.

So get a good full on extend and use it and use the commands- do not be afraid of telling him off- although I tend to use a slightly exasperated NO- that was NOT what I asked for, instead of a reprimand proper.

With Rabbit, when I was teaching the extend I used my voice- I "clucked" along with his pace, and then opened out the spacing in the clucking (does that make sense??) I picked up his pace, got us going in time and then clucked slower and more pronounced and he started to open out in response- to keep in time with me.

I used a lunge rein for this and a round pen- that way I had control of both sides and could put a little light pressure on his nose.

I did not use ground pole with Rabbit as he was so tiny and he kept trying to jump them!!!

You have come so far with this horse- just keep on with your normal patience, you will crack this one too!!

 

[blufftonteaco]

After adjusting my harness and cart to where I was satisfied I have finally started driving Spyder.

He has been a good boy just like I knew he would. I have driven him about 10 times now and he has done really great, save for one thing, he has a really annoying habit of trying to transition into a canter.

Spyder doesn't try to do this canter transition when he is in a circle, in a circle he is really quiet and steady with his head. In a larger cricle or an oval he is constantly lifting his shoulders and head/neck like he is going to transition into a canter. I have NEVER cantered him in harness when I practiced on the long lines, so I have no idea where he is getting this idea to lope from.

All I have been doing with him so far is slow trotting and walking with some circles and direction changes.

So what gives? I know he is not tossing his head, because he doesn't toss his head, he just lifts his shoulder and head/neck to go into a canter. Why is he doing this and how can I help him learn to stop?

Just an idea.....maybe he is transitioning up to make the pull easier? when we do hill work with my boy if it becomes a little hard he will transition up to pull easier. So if we are walking he will want to trot and if we are trotting he will want to canter. Now that he is in much better shape and stronger ,he rarely transitions up if not asked.

When we first started driving he did transition alot and looking back I think he did it because it allowed him to pull easier. Hope this might help.

Kim

 

[Champ]

I agree with the " it's easier for him to pull idea" in the beginning of the season when I start to drive my guy again (after having the winter off) he wants to break into the next gate when we are doing any kind of an incline but after he starts getting into shape he doesn't do it unless it's a big hill. :bgrin

 

[wildoak]

You may have a combination of factors - the training issue is certainly logical, he may just need to learn to transition up into a higher gear. It may also be more difficult for him to pull at an extended trot, and he is wanting to take the easy way out and canter. I have had the same issue with a gelding since last year, but this is a horse who was past that in his training and is reacting to some kind of discomfort. He does it uphill (my driving area is not level) and lifts only on the left side. It's the same thing you are describing, as if he's about to step into a canter but never does, but his is one sided. Ours has been an ongoing issue, nobody can find anything wrong with him...very frustrating. Hope yours is more easily resolved.

Jan

 

[Jetiki]

I would say transitions transitions transitions. You need to help him build the muscles to sustain the trot for the length of time you want. Don't hold him in a frame for long stretches let him walk and stretch his neck down to stretch his back. Ask for a slow walk, a fast walk and a medium walk, you won't use all of those in the show ring but they could be plenty helpful if on a trail drive or something. I also teach a slow trot, a working trot a fast trot and a get the heck out of dodge trot. I have taught my horse to canter in harness but it was only done so that if there was an issue of spooking or something they wouldn't be more spooked by the bouncing cart. I have used the slow walk when the cart broke on the trail, we had to get back to the trailhead, we were in the middle of nowhere. I have also used it to negotiate bad terrain. Using lots of tranistions along with ground poles to trot over can help build the muscles you need to get what you want, as will time in harness. Don't just go in mindless circles kick it up and do patterns or whatever horses start anticipating things if you drive the same way in the same order in the pen all the time.

Karen

 

[shoeboxstables]

Rabbitsfizz- That's a really interesting idea with your clucking pace to extend- very clever! Coming from Saddleseat where we get them all revved up- I've always just used a combo of clucking, trot UP, and 'heh's (not a ton- esp not in the show ring!)- but I really like that idea- I think we'll try it! Thanks for sharing.

Kaitlyn

 

[Chamomile]

I just wanted to add this... your horse hasn't been in cart very long. One thing you do not want to do is stifle his attitude of FORWARD MOVING. At this stage what he needs to be doing is going forward. I don't really worry so much about the cantering in cart. ALL my horses learn to canter in cart, when I ask. I don't have any trouble in the ring with them always wanting to break. Granted when I am in an extended trot and really flying sometimes it will cross their minds, but it is not the end of the world if they break. If you start worrying this too much, he might start to have a short choppy stride and get lazy. I totally agree with the thought of transitions. Keep him thinking all the time. Don't let him guess what you are planning. And also with Rabbit, I use the clucking to get a nice extended trot when I'm training. I also use it to help people who don't know what an extended trot is, to show them that the horses doesn't necessarily go faster, but they have a lengthening of stride.

Anyway! That's my two cents :bgrin

 

[gracemini]

I had a gelding who did something similar to this. He seemed to skip a step while trotting. I agree that it is probably difficult to pull. Especially if he is new to pulling a cart. When I am starting my driving horses now I start with ground driving with a cart then I add a little weight, usually a bag of pellets or grain in the basket of the cart. If you do try that make sure the bag is secure so it doesn't slide around and spook your horse. I normally tie it down with baling twine or bungy cords. I find this transitions my weight better when I finally get into the cart.

I also agree with the other posts about transitions. If he does not do it on circles he is probably having a little trouble finding his balance on the longer sides. I would suggest trying to get him to jog as slow as you can, I use half halts and tell them easy but also use small clucks to keep the momentum up but shorten the stride a bit. Alternate a jog with a regular trot on a circle then when there is an area where he normally "skips" do a transition to a jog. Hopefully this will keep him thinking and he will concentrate on what you're asking him to do rather than skipping.

If my horse were to trot down those sides even a couple of times correctly I would stop for the day and end on a good note.

I hope this helps! Good luck, there are many good suggestions on this thread.

Rachel

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Horses will often take that half-canter stride when they are green or out of condition because it is easier to pull at a canter. Kody knows better than to break gait in the dressage ring but in really deep footing, at the beginning of the year, or when he isn't feeling well he will try it repeatedly and that's when I know he's tired or sore. Don't make a big deal out of it, just gently half-halt and say "Aaahht, trot" and let him rest pretty soon afterwards once he's done it right for a few strides. Spyder is green and like a lot of things he'll grow out of it with more experience! He just needs to learn to balance himself and get the strength to pull well at a steady trot. That takes time.

Focus on what he's doing right and the rest of it will fall into place as he progresses.

Leia

 

[drivin*me*buggy]

Wow a lot of great advice has been exchanged here

: . If you want something that might help is sliding sidereins, they will help keep his frame 'long & low' which will prolly help him pull in the walk + trot. It will stretch his back muscles, sortof similar to the feeling he gets from cantering. I really don't know how to explain sliding sidereins, I will try & find a link tho as you can use them with a cart safely. Well I'm tired & not thinking well so if I think of anything else I'll add it later. :lol:

Well keep us posted & good luck w/ Spyder

:

Ash :saludando:

 

[Ferrah]

I haven't been trying to ask Spyder to extend yet, but your suggestions are all very good and I will start experiementing a bit to try and see what the problem is.

Other than this, he really is a good boy.

 

[Margo_C-T]

The key phrase here is " it takes TIME"...I have found that when the horse simply doesn't yet know what it is that you want, and/or isn't physically fit/ready, this 'skip' is much more likely to happen. You simply don't get true and proper extension by trying to get it before a horse has developed to where it is physically and mentally able to do it.

Margo

 

[drivin*me*buggy]

The key phrase here is " it takes TIME"...I have found that when the horse simply doesn't yet know what it is that you want, and/or isn't physically fit/ready, this 'skip' is much more likely to happen. You simply don't get true and proper extension by trying to get it before a horse has developed to where it is physically and mentally able to do it.

Margo

Right On, TIME is definently the key

: .

Ash :saludando:

 

[evedex]

Remember it takes quite a while for a horse to get into proper condition....especially if the driving muscles have never been used before.

The faster the horse gets the cart rolling, the easier it is to pull so he is only doing what comes naturally. Don't let him get away with it but be gentle in your corrections so as not to stop his desire to be forward moving. Use the circle, since he is not balanced enought there (yet), and just gentle rein and voice to bring him back and then verbally praise him when he comes back to the trot for you. Let him know he is a good boy when doing what you ask....it will take him time to learn.

With your new boy, try to do much more walking than trotting when driving him to help build up his muscles. Break it up to prevent bordom, of course....like walk once around the arena, trot one long side, walk around then trot a circle, etc. It will take him about a month of driving 3-4 times a week to get the new muscles properly activated for driving.

I do think everyone should canter once or twice in harness so the feeling is not strange to a horse if he spooks and runs BUT it is not a good thing to let the horse decide when and where to canter. TROT is the driving gate for the show ring and you don't want him deciding that he can change that at will. Start as you wish to continue. For now, he should just walk and trot and ONLY use the working trot until he is comfortable with it and in condition.

Just have a lot of patience with your guy....he is trying to figure this all out, so help him. I was at a John Lyons clinic some years ago and he stated that it takes something like 1500 repititions for a horse to LEARN a command....and that is only when they do it right <G>.

Good Luck.