Strangles in Miniatures, Blue is very sick

[Triggy&Blue&Daisy Too]

I may have a case of strangles on my hands with my little Blue. He's been running a high temp since Saturday and is off his water. He will eat soupy beet pulp and nibble hay but that's about it. He's pooping and peeing so no problems there at this time.

Vet was out Monday and thought it was just an upper respiratory thing going on. No snotty nose and lungs sounded clear but a lot of gunk in his upper airway. So she treated him with banamine for the fever and put him on SMZs. His breathing was pretty raspy but seemed to be doing pretty well all things considered. I'd made him a vaporizer out of a deep electrolyte container to let him breath in some steam from the hot water which seemed to loosen some of the phlem in his throat and helped him cough some of it out.

This morning I woke with a start at about 3:00 am put my clothes on and went out to him. He was pretty much the same but I guess I was having bad dreams about his illness. Took his temp and it was high again, 104, so I gave him his banamine, SMZs and let him eat his beet pulp concoction. After he'd finished, he started to pant and was getting very distressed so I called the vet and she made it there at 6:00. Before she got there I felt under his jaw and yep, there was an enlarged lymph node about the size of half a golf ball.

She took blood, nasal swab and aspirated the lump and got quite a bit of thick pus for the sample. She also lanced it so it would drain more easily. She confirmed my dread that it is a possible case of strangles. He is fully vaccinated and boostered but I know that isn't 100% effective. She will also have the sample DNA'd to see if it is the strain used for the vaccine and if so the company usually will pay the vet bills but I think it's just the stuff we had on the place last summer and is resurfacing again. One thing really concerns me is that she wants to keep him on the SMZs until she gets the preliminary pathology report. It should be in tomorrow morning. I did as she said tonight but I'm going to hold back on his am dose until I hear from her. She said there are plenty of things that can cause similar issues and doesn't want to stop the antibiotics until she can confirm it's strangles. If any mini vets should read this would you be concerned as well or am I just adding to my worry load?

I have been hot packing it to keep it open and draining, he is still eating and is not dehydrated in the least which really surprised me. Is there anything else you can think of I could do for him to keep him comfortable through this ordeal? Thankfully, my other two are not displaying any symptoms but are starting to hate me as much as Blue for taking their temps so often.

After all that, my question is has anyone got some experience with strangles in minis and are there any idiosyncracies you are aware of to watch out for with them. All my experience with it has been in big equines and I know minis have their own set of problems with things.

Edited for crappy spelling.

 

[Scoopiedoo]

Shirley,

I really don't have any answers, but I just wanted to let you know that I'll be keeping Blue in my thoughts and prayers.

HUGS

Jodi

 

[Vicky Texas]

Oh no, I am so sorry Blue is so sick. Sure hope the med's work fast and get him

over it. We only had one, in a ten year old stallion. He stayed at the Vets for a

week. He ran high fevers and they pulled him through it. He stayed there, so our

other horses would not get it. He had already been to one Vet, who missed diagnosed

it him. Said older horses could not get it. Took him from there to another Vet, and yep

he had it. He did okay, with them, and the med's.

Vicky

 

[Shari]

Oh no Shirley!!! Am so sorry your little Blue is ill. I know he is in good hands and I know he will get better in short order!!

 

[wendymac]

I'm sorry to hear that Blue is sick. Poor fellow!

The one thing we did with a Paint yearling was to keep the jaw covered in Icthammol. It's a great drawing agent, although a bit messy and stinky. I would be worried about the antibiotics, because supposedly if you treat Strangles with antibiotics it can turn to brat strangles (where it enters the bloodstream). Now that information is old, because I haven't had to deal with it in over 15 years, but you might want to question it. But it drained on its own, and he was fine after that.

Another thing...make sure you disinfect EVERY single wood surface that Blue has come into contact with. Strangles can live in wood for years. That's how my boy got it...he was in a barn that had had a case of Strangles years before. Even though the barn had stood empty for a few years after that, the Strangles was still there.

Hope he gets over it quickly. It can sure be a messy thing to deal with, for sure.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Horses of all ages are susceptible, though strangles is most common in animals less than 5 years of age and especially in groups of weanling foals or yearlings. Foals under 4 months of age are usually protected by colostrum-derived passive immunity. (1) S. equi is maintained in the horse population by carrier horses but does not survive for more than 6–8 weeks in the environment. Although the organism is not very robust, the infection is highly contagious. Transmission is either by direct or indirect contact of susceptible animals with a diseased horse. Direct contact includes contact with a horse that is incubating strangles or has just recovered from the infection, or with an apparently clinically unaffected long-term carrier. Indirect contact occurs when an animal comes in contact with a contaminated stable (buckets, feed, walls, doors) or pasture environment (grass, fences, but almost always the water troughs), or through flies. (2)

I have never heard of strangles being carried in anything other than a short lived, live , viral form.

Routine cleaning of people and clothes, Yes, but it is Ringworm that lives for years, not Strangles.

Strangles is carried by birds, animals etc, it is contagious rather than infectious and can come form nowhere, as it were.

Shirley I am sorry Blue is so ill, I am wondering if this is what was wrong with Alfie, in a mild form, and poor Blue has the whole dose.

You know all the drill, treat the symptoms, keep him warm, love him- you can do all that in spades.

It is very likely that Triggy will go s down with it, at least in a mild form, and I do not tend to separate animals that are used to being together.

Although I now you are nervous about the antibiotics, they are supposed to help if they are started early enough, so I would certainly not discontinue them- they used to be contra- indicated but there is slightly different thinking nowadays- do a bit of Internet reading if you get a moment (Ha, Ha!!)

We are all pulling with you, once the fever has broken you will be on the home run, hang in there.

 

[hrselady]

I know that it is very contagious!!! Can transfer through clothing, shoes, horses smelling or getting close to the drainage of the other. Can be transmitted through their drinking from the same water.. eating from the same flake of hay, etc.

If you have other mini's, isolate him to a part of your land that no other horse will be on for at least 8 months.. even though the drainage is cleared/stopped.. and they seem fine, they can be a carrier and pass it on to other horses for up to 8 months.

Starting an antibotic then stopping it after a few days will only cause it to get worse (brat strangles). Once you are commited to treating it.. then you have to remain commited. One vet has said treat for 5 days and the other told me 10.

The mare I rescued a few months ago developed strangles. I have had to isolate her and treat. She was able to pass it onto one of my mini's. Not sure how she got it to him.. or if it was one of us that did, but we did change our habits outside and noone else has been affected.

We bleach EVERYTHING!! We change clothes when going from the well horses to the sick ones. We germX our hands and disinfect our shoes when we leave their "patch" (just to be on the safe side). We feed and deal with the well horses first and then we feed and deal with the sick ones. Its sad, its tiring, and its frustrating knowing that ONE horse can do so much... LET ME REPHRASE.. somewhere someone had a poor little paint mare that had been exposed to strangles.. instead of treating this horse she decided to send her to the sale...There I see her, feel sorry for her and bring her home. Thank GOD I had the forethought to seperate her for the first month.. usually I don't (I'm very trusting).

All in all we have 6 horses and if every one of them get sick.. then so be it.. I'll treat them all, if it takes me all day just to administer med's. I cant imagine someone dumping their horse like that. (sorry, I'll get off my soapbox).

For the next 8 months the two that are sick will not be around another horse.. or off their "patch".. and noone is allowed to go near them unless its me or my family that knows how to properly disinfect to keep it contained.

here is a link to a page that may help with other questions you may have.. I did alot of research and are working with 2 vets on this..

strangles info page

and here is another.. I read and read and read so I would fully understand what I was dealing with.. and I looked for photos and etc.

More on strangles

You and Blue are both in my prayers!! He will pull through because he has a "mom" that loves him very much!! I should have mentioned that my mare is almost fully over it (as far as the abcess) and she is more lively and just acts as though she has a new life in front of her. My mini is doing good too.. his abcess recently ruptured but neither has lost interest in food so no weight loss. We take a warm rag 3x a day with hydrogen peroxide and soak their drain location. Its not pretty, and its gonna look worse before it starts getting better. But I have no doubt that Blue was caught early enough and is going to be fine!! But do not stop the smz's until your vet says, just to be on the safe side!!!

Sorry so long!!

 

[Jill]

Oh no

I hope Blue is better soon! He is surely in good hands

:

 

[ChrystalPaths]

I know several folks here have been thru this and will respond here or by Pm. You are doing all you should be. I am not sure about the anitbiotics. I know many times it is best to let it ride itself out without them. How is his temp this morning? I'm sure he is on a probiotic/yogurt for his tummy because of the banamine. I'll send my best for them all and you my dear friend. Remember to take care of you too so they can have a healthy mom to love em.

 

[kaykay]

im so sorry you are going thru this. we went thru it some years back. After what we went thru I would never give smz's to a horse with strangles again. Once the abcess bursts its all downhill. they start feeling much better and recover fairly quickly once they begin to drain. Because hes had smz's though you may find a 2nd abcess in a few days. Its still a big debate wether to give a horse antibiotics with strangles. The first vet we had had us give it and then the second vet took them off immediately saying it would just come back as soon as the anitbiotics wore off (and he was right)

imo you can bleach and change clothes etc but it will more then likely still spread. We did all that and it still spread to every horse.

Sending good thoughts!

I just want to add that if you are in horses long enough you will see strangles at your farm! Especially if you have horses moving in and out to show etc. its not the huge thing people make it out to be. Not saying its fun to go thru but some people just go ballastic over strangles.

 

[Mona]

Oh no, I am so sorry. I sure hope you boy will be OK! Good Luck!!

 

[minimule]

I just went through this with a herd of 19. It wasn't fun and it did take a while to figure out just what we had.

The ones that showed anything at all started with going off their feed and developing a fever. None of mine stopped drinking. They actually drank more due to the fever and the cold water felt good. Once they developed an abcess and it burst, we cleaned 2x a day with a Betadine solution. I would "milk" as much of the pus out as I could each time. It does transfer from horse to horse easily. Out of the 19 here, only 9 developed abcesses. Out of those 2 had them all over their face the others just had a single abcess under thier jaw and most dried up within 3-5 days.

Bleach doesn't kill it. It is a virus so you need to clean with a viruscide.

My vet would not put any of them on antibiotics. He said that is what causes the brat strangles. We let the virus run it's course. If an animal developed breathing problems then we treated that.

Like any other problem with horses, each vet will tell you something different.

 

[Kendra]

Strangles is nasty to deal with, I hope Blue is feeling better very soon!

Some strains of Strangles do live in the environment for years. We had Strangles almost 20 years ago, brought it home from a show. We had one mare with brat strangles, and we very nearly lost her. We did lose a foal that was premature and just couldn't handle the added stress. Luckily, the strain we got wasn't a longlived variety, as we've never had another horse with Strangles since. A friend of mine that raised big horses had Strangles once, and then every foal would get it when they were weaned every single year. Yuck! A client at the clinic where I work had been in a barn for 3 years, when she moved horses for the first time to the stalls at the far end and they got sick with Strangles. The previous owners had Strangles and had the sick horses in those stalls, years before, and even disinfected, the new horses got sick. She had a bad time too, with brat strangles in one horse and purpurra in another.

Generally a horse that gets the disease from the vaccine tends to be less sick, not as high a fever, but anything is possible!

I would also be concerned about the antibiotics. I hope you get some answers soon!

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I have been thru this and my herd more then once UGh it is awful I had one vet give antibiodics and well lets just say after lots of arguing.. and sending all the records to a 3rd and 4th party who were very knowledgable (meaning other vets) the original vet dropped any charges of my close to 5000 vet bills for mistreating.

hang in there will be a long road and you will go thru tons of bleach but it will end especially if the abscess is open and draining

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Oh goodness Triggy! I don't have any advice for you but I sure hope Mr. Blue feels better soon. He's such a sweet little thing. :no:

Leia

 

[Triggy&Blue&Daisy Too]

Thanks everyone. Vet called this am with the prelim path report and it shows consistent with strangles. Had my regular vet out and he discovered Blue has pleurisy in his lungs on top of it so it's going to be a dicey situation for the next week or so. Keep my little guy in your prayers and thoughts, he's going to really need them.

 

[susanne]

Shirley,

I'm so sorry you and Blue are going through this!

I'll be thinking of and pulling for Blue and all of your crew...and as Deb said, take care of yourself, too!

 

[ChrystalPaths]

Pleuresy! I had that once and it did require antibiotics and drumming. Light but firm pounding on the chest wall. He may very well like those firm pats Shirley, try it. It loosens things up. Is he coughing at all? My prayers continue.

 

[Magic]

Oh yikes, what a mess. Sending prayers for all, especially poor Blue!

:

 

[Triggy&Blue&Daisy Too]

Blue's temp is still high but vet said no more banamine for now. He's been taking it the maximum amount of time before he can get into serious problems with it. Blue was 103.7 this am but is eating well and breathing much better. Vet upped the SMZ dose to keep his lungs clear which is vital at this time and explained my concern about giving antibiotics. He said if they are underdosed and for too short of time that is what brings on the brat strangles not giving the antibiotics themselves. Especially critical to get them when additional complications like the pleurisy manfest. I have to trust he knows best, I've known him for over 20 years and he saved Daisy from a certain death when she ate nightshade.

I guess I just have to wait and hope it all turns out right.