Standard Driving proceedures...

[Boinky]

I did not post this to scare anyone away from driving, however it COULD happen and runaways DO happen! and it should be something everyone keeps in mind. I think this particular instance snowballed from bad to worse due to several circumstances but my point of posting this was because I had a runaway at nationals and the whole class was immediately asked to STOP. In this video they did the same thing "all walk" and that horse almost ran over the first cart it came to. the woman was just lucky there was some space between the fence and her cart. You could tell by her expression she didn't know what was happening until that horse was beside her. she did a good job of pulling her horse inside to avoid hooking a wheel or such. Now imagine a large class of people just stopping dead not knowing WHY they are stopping. I'm sure you can imagine many of those people are stopping infront of this horse. not only that but in a large class..you then have 10-30 objects just STOPPED that maybe blocking a safe route to guide the horse.

anyhow I'm really not posting this to cause trouble or get people riled or scare people but I've said right from the time i left "my" run away class that i felt perhaps it should have been handled differently ... I posted it to get people to THINK on idea's of ways to lesson the chance of a chance similar to this even if it's only one or two horses involved. All's well that ends well I suppose but I will tell you a few people and myself were very lucky that the mare still had that last little ounce of sanity.

What has been your experience, after a runaway situation, with the horse? I quit driving my guy - actually tried a few times and he was so rattled even ground driving that I just gave up. Do they ever get over it?

In my experience the best thing you can do with a runaway is to once you get it under control to KEEP DRIVING IT. bring it down to a walk and try to keep the horse and yourself calm. If you just give up and put the horse away THAT will be the experience it will remember for the rest of it's life as being a bad experience or at very least an experience where he was the dominant party controlling the "game". Quite frankly people might call me mean..but both of those horses that were so out of control if it were me i'd have at LEAST ground driven them out of the ring (or as soon as i got out of the ring) and hitch them ASAP. If that last horse that was down was fine once they got him untangled i'd have gotten him back up put the harness on him RIGHT THERE and ground drove him out. Yes he's tired and huffing but in reality that is the time his adrenalin rush has probably worn off and he's going to be the EASIEST to control because he's tired plus it leaves him with the mentality "ok that was scarey but i have to get back to my job and i'm OK".....

fear is an illogical thing. One thing i've found about fear is the longer you let something fester before trying to conquer you fear..the bigger and scarier the problem becomes (for me anyhow). Every situation weather it was a take off or something bad went wrong unless the horse or the driver is hurt (or in riding too) i immedately start the horse doing what it was doing before the accident and perhaps try to do it a slower steadier gait if possible to keep things "calm and relaxed" before asking for more challenging situation again.

My ASPR (Hackney X shetland) had an oopsie last fall. I told the story on here and i wont go into it again. The cart got busted and I had nothing else to use on him but i IMMEDATELY caught him as soon as he calmed down enough to catch him. I pulled my harness off to check it but then went to puti t back on. He wanted nothing to do with the harness so I spent another 2 hours working with him until i was able to get it back on and long lining him. If i had had a cart he would have been hitched back up at the end of those 2 hours and driven. However since I didn't have one I did the next best thing and got him ground driving. I hadn't had time or a cart to hitch him since until a few weeks ago but he had been ground driven a few times here and there and put through some "scarey" situations for him. He did great and it was like he'd forgotten it every happend. I truly believe it was because I took the time to do the work with him after that he needed to help sooth his mind to some extent.

I had another horse that I decided to start on a race track (just a nice place to hitch..no one there and good groomed surface and you can run forever on it..lol anyhow he decided to take off. He probably went about 1/2 mile not wanting to stop. Once i got him under control i jumped out..checked my harness to make sure everything was ok and still hitched since .. then jumped back in and continued to drive him for a good hour after that. Part of his problem was he was throwing a temper tantrum... he was kicking like crazy and hit me once in the leg over the dash so i was ducking blows while trying to control him. By keeping him driving after he learned that that didn't get him anywhere but tired and worked more. By working more it was also a "good" ending. He went on to show at nationals last year and did ok getting one top ten. he's always been a hot horse with a temper.

I would guess that at least a large part of your horses problem is he is reading your fear and your tenseness. TRY to take a deep breath and relax when you feel him getting excited. Speak to him in a deep calm soothing voice. I"ve often found saying in a deep voice "eaaaaaasssssyyyy" really seems to sooth them. In your situation I would recommend finding a trainer or someone very confident to drive your horse at least a few times. The horse will not have to contend with HIS fear and YOURS at the same time. Many often can and will be good driving horses again in the future if dealt with correctly.

 

[Magic]

I think that this is a very good idea to be thinking about and discussing this issue (safety in show driving). As Boinky said, if people are aware of the best way to deal with either their own runaway or someone else's runaway, then we all should end up being the safer for it.

I've driven in many shows for eight years or so, with new-to-driving horses and been-there-done-that horses, and I've never seen anything like the situation shown in that video. I've seen some accidents and runaways, but everyone, horses and people alike, came through just fine in the end.

I agree with those that have said "don't let this scare you away from driving". Just work with your horse so that you know each other well, and build up trust between you, and pay attention when you are driving. Driving horses is way too fun to pass up!

Let me also add, that when training a horse to drive, it would be an excellent idea to let them gallop while hitched to the cart, at some point. It's bound to happen sooner or later, and it can really scare a horse if they've never experienced it. When you go to try it, make sure you have people there to help you if needed, and have a nice big space so you won't have to make tight turns. If you are expecting your horse to gallop, you won't panic like you would possibly in a run-away situation, and you can just let your horse gallop and get used to it. If you aren't experienced enough to try this, get help from someone who is.

 

[Reble]

Great topic and yes, we never know what a run away horse can do.

If at all possible have an out gate that has a dead end stall.

I realize might not be possible, but either is expecting a scared run away horse to do as we have planned out

 

[Boinky]

Ashley I agree! an open rail or at least a open place in general. My mare was a bit to the inside but if it was announced something to the effect of "heads up run away" everyone could have looked back and made space depending on where i was in the ring before the run away ever got to them. sounds like your ride was pretty terrifying! mine only lasted half of the ring and i just happend to be in an "opening" where there weren't many horses for most of it.. UNTIL they called a halt..then of course everyone stopped and my horse was running right into the stopped horses. If they had kept going i'd probaby have had a clear spot around the ring for a full lap...lol

I have also never seen anything happen such as on that video to that extent as well. I think part of the problem was that the drivers were thrown from their vehicles so the horses no longer had ANY guidance. This can also happen... i was chucked from my Vehicle when the ASPR pony tweaked on me. it can happen and once you have a completely loose horse especially one without a bridle or reins to grab makes life more difficult. I'm sure this is probably a VERY VERY rare once in a few thousand chance but it's a good reminder of what CAN happen!

I do think they could have mobilized all of the horses not involved in a more tighter group and all of those people in that ring could have surrounded them and drove those horses out onto the rail. I watched that video many times and in most of the instances when that horse came to the center there was SOMEONE on the rail trying to catch the horse that the horse was avoiding by going inward....to me it didn't even look like it was nessarily trying to get to the other horses but trying to AVOID the people on the rail. If everyone were in the center pushing the horse out he probably wouldn't be as likely to come in. In most instances the harness will break and the cart will fall off at some point or the horse is just going to run itself out.

 

[tagalong]

Calling for a walk or halt can put the immediate persons in danger.

Not necessarily - and unless you are the one up there with the mic in your hand it is easy to simply say - they should say this or that. As I said earlier, you try to diffuse the situation - a warning and then as quickly and CALMLY as possible bring everyone down to the same gait and off the rail... if everyone is simply doing as they please there will only be more confusion. The announcer can see the entire ring at a glance - you can't when you have a horse to focus on..

If you are in the ring and the announcer call HEADS UP and a gait change - you know to be aware that something is wrong - it may not be a runaway but just some misbehaviour that needs to be contained or a tack issue that needs to be attended to - and there is often not enough time to give the exhibitors a blow by blow account of what is going on. It all depends on that individual situation... and yes, I would calmly advise of a runaway if there was one...

That Arabian class was handled very poorly with the way everyone kept chasing that horse - and that announcer did NOT help. JMO.

I realize might not be possible, but either is expecting a scared run away horse to do as we have planned out

Exactly right. You can plan as much as you like - and in the end, everything will depend on that particular situation, the horses and exhibitors involved, the arena, the ring crew and a host of variables - including people coming into the ring from the stands who think they can help...

 

[Sandee]

I'm not saying it would work but those that have been around "old show horses" can tell you if the announcer had tried to stay calm and in her regular voice announced "WALK" several horses would slow just on her announcement.

So it's not just one person or horse that causes the chaos in a runaway. It takes the combined efforts of the announcer, the participants, and the crowd to remain calm and wait until the drivers have their horses under control.

That's so much easier to say than to do as your addrenilin spikes just like the horse's does.

It would be best for every driver to be trained in controling a runaway horse. Stay calm, ask for half halts (do NOT pull back as hard as you can), and try to go into smaller cirlces (NOT TIGHT ones) until the horse is under control.

This has worked for me in an open pasture with other horses running amok.

In the arena, the only time my horse spooked was because a carless driver cut us off nearly hitting him with her cart. He was very nervous after that when someone approached from the back.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

There is a term for driving horses stopped on the rail during a runaway: "Speed bump."

I agree with Boinky 100%- asking the rest of the class to come down to a slower gait without warning them of the reason why is putting every single entrant (including the driver of the runaway) in great danger and is absolutely inexcusable. I've been in the ring during runaways, I've had my own horse run away in the warmup arena and out in the open and I can tell you that steering around scattered stationary objects at that speed is darn near impossible.

The announcer is putting an enormous burden on an already overwhelmed driver and complicating a difficult situation for all involved. On the other hand I don't agree that shouting "Heads up!! We have a runaway!!!" is the appropriate answer, mostly because of all those exclamation marks.

IMO the announcer should calmly state "Time out, we have a runaway horse. Would all competitors please make your way carefully to the center and stop your horses. Let the loose horse have the rail please." It is a good idea, as Tagalong said, to try and deescalate the situation so you don't get the runaway more fired up but the best way to do that is to use a calm tone of voice and give everyone clear, simple, safe directions. Ask the people in the stands to be quiet, get the horses in the center and have the gate crew ready to assist if necessary.

Let the horse run himself out.

If you are driving in a class where someone bolts, you need to know your responsibilities. Any time the announcer suddenly asks for an unusual gait change or announces a time out, look around or at least peer over your shoulder before slowing down. If the runaway is approaching you at speed and you're already on the rail, hug the wall as tight as you can and steady your own horse until he bolts by then head immediately for the center. If there's a gap between you and the rail and he seems to be heading for it, pull to the inside and get the heck out of his way...make sure you are not pulling into the path of another horse in the process.

I would not personally slow to a walk because it takes away my horse's ability to rapidly pick up speed and get out of the way if he needs to. (Be aware I have an experienced and calm Western Country Pleasure horse though, not a hot green Single Pleasure entry. My answer might be different for a fired-up wild man.) Once I have calmly trotted to the center of the arena I would stop my horse, preferably next to the gazebo or other large object, and make sure I have an open escape route ahead of me so my horse has somewhere to go if the runaway comes bolting through. Don't let yourself get boxed in and be aware that your horse may whirl blindly sideways if he hears something coming up fast from behind him so keep him clear of entanglements to the side. I personally would not unhitch in that situation but that's because I feel it's too dangerous to be out of the cart, trying to hold a scared horse and unhitching by myself at the same time in the middle of chaos. What if the horse next to me whirled into us or the runaway came through while I was half hitched?

Nope, I want to be in the cart and in control. At least that way I have a chance to get out of the way and if I do get hit maybe I'm still in the cart and able to try and regain control of my own horse. If you feel safer unhitching that's fine, but each person needs to make that determination for themselves just like what gait to use in getting out the way.

The most important thing is that all drivers promptly be given the information they need, namely that there is a runaway. What they do after that is ultimately their responsibility.

Leia

 

[wildoak]

In my experience the best thing you can do with a runaway is to once you get it under control to KEEP DRIVING IT. bring it down to a walk and try to keep the horse and yourself calm. If you just give up and put the horse away THAT will be the experience it will remember for the rest of it's life as being a bad experience or at very least an experience where he was the dominant party controlling the "game".

While I agree with that in theory, there are times the horse cannot be calmed & brought back under control at the moment. My gelding was so shook up and muscles so tight he jumped at being touched, and I would have been putting myself and others at risk again to continue driving him. I did ground drive him out and in the warmup until he settled somewhat (and actually drove him later that day in versatility). We made it through the last class, although I put no pressure on him at all other than to get through the class quietly. I am still driving other horses, but I have to admit he has me buffaloed. I still feel safer in the saddle than in the cart.

Jan

 

[MiLo Minis]

I think that this is a very good idea to be thinking about and discussing this issue (safety in show driving). As Boinky said, if people are aware of the best way to deal with either their own runaway or someone else's runaway, then we all should end up being the safer for it.

I've driven in many shows for eight years or so, with new-to-driving horses and been-there-done-that horses, and I've never seen anything like the situation shown in that video. I've seen some accidents and runaways, but everyone, horses and people alike, came through just fine in the end.

I agree with those that have said "don't let this scare you away from driving". Just work with your horse so that you know each other well, and build up trust between you, and pay attention when you are driving. Driving horses is way too fun to pass up!

Let me also add, that when training a horse to drive, it would be an excellent idea to let them gallop while hitched to the cart, at some point. It's bound to happen sooner or later, and it can really scare a horse if they've never experienced it. When you go to try it, make sure you have people there to help you if needed, and have a nice big space so you won't have to make tight turns. If you are expecting your horse to gallop, you won't panic like you would possibly in a run-away situation, and you can just let your horse gallop and get used to it. If you aren't experienced enough to try this, get help from someone who is.

I agree with this 100%! You must canter or gallop your horse during training at least once. It is a completely different feel to the horse than trotting or walking and that alone can spook him and cause him to bolt. I am lucky enough to have a nice long, wide dirt tractor path near me and that is where I take them for their first canter. Be aware that they may scoot the first time the cart rocks back on them and don't grab at them or jerk them back or you will send them off!!! Talk to them - say easy, relax, in a nice slow drawn out voice and they will settle - most really enjoy it. Its also a good way to get the kinks out of their back.

 

[Boinky]

On the other hand I don't agree that shouting "Heads up!! We have a runaway!!!" is the appropriate answer, mostly because of all those exclamation marks. rolleyes.gif IMO the announcer should calmly state "Time out, we have a runaway horse. Would all competitors please make your way carefully to the center and stop your horses.

Absolutely agree with that..LOL I could just see the panic and mayhem that would cause. I figure how they calmly say "time out" if they just said "we have a run away horse." first would make a HUGE difference.....at least from my perspective as a driver.. i know exactly what is happening and what to be looking for to be able to take counter measures. I also agree with whoever said that the gait people and the ring people should have some basic knowlege and structure on what to do in a driving class should a horse bolt. that would help make things a whole lot less chaotic. I know even in stressful situations if i have learned something one way or was instructed i tend to panic less and fall back on that knowlege and work from it.

 

[Boinky]

While I agree with that in theory, there are times the horse cannot be calmed & brought back under control at the moment. My gelding was so shook up and muscles so tight he jumped at being touched, and I would have been putting myself and others at risk again to continue driving him. I did ground drive him out and in the warmup until he settled somewhat (and actually drove him later that day in versatility). We made it through the last class, although I put no pressure on him at all other than to get through the class quietly.

Jan i can absolutely see that as being a problem too, but you delt with it soon after the accident and had him back between the shafts before the end of the day. Of course common sense is going to rule but my theory is the sooner you can get the quieted down and back int he shafts the better! I think fear in horses tends to be the same/similar as in people..their fear of something grows more and more the longer it takes from them to be reintroduced. The one horse i mentioned that i continued driving as soon as i got him back in control wasn't real freaked out after wards..it was more a temper tantrum so in his case it was a "lets get on with this and stop your crap" kind of deal. the ASPR WAS absolutely freaked out and just like yours you couldn't touch him without him quivering and jumping around.. it took 2 hours of handling him and working with him to get the harness back on him and long lining. again common sense will rule but my theory is the sooner the better!

 

[valshingle]

I have a happy ending runaway story. Many of you know my stallion, Little Kings Brumby Buck. Well, the first year we had him I drove him at the 'A' World Championship show in Amateur Single Level 1. He'd had a bit too much Red Cell (in retrospect), heard some noise, and took off down the long side at all full gallop as the class was still entering the arena. I've dealt with runaway big horses and wasn't scared, but I couldn't stop him. I was also wearing elbow length evening gloves (don't ever do that!). Horses were still entering the arena as I was headed down towards the in-gate. I thought about turning him into the wall, but didn't want to smash up the cart. I caught the ring stewards eye and headed towards him in the center of the arena. He was able to catch him on the fly (another very risky move) and we got him to stop. My trainer told me to leave the ring, but I had worked hard to qualify and really didn't want to. A judge was right nearby and I asked her if I needed to leave. She told me that since the class hadn't started yet (wasn't being judged), I could stay in if I wanted to. I pulled off the evening gloves and continued with the class. I did drive conservatively during the extended gait, though. Happy ending - I placed 4th!!

Now, Brumby was an experienced driving horse and I was not at all frightened. He also was never a "blind" runaway - just too much energy.

 

[Boinky]

LOL!

I asked to be excused from my class because i felt at that point it was better to get her out of there. I have no idea who it was but getting to the gate someone kept saying "get out of the cart .... get out of the cart"..... my question i was asking in my head was "WHY?" lol the ring master helped lead the mare out of the ring and passed her off to the mares owner all with me in the cart still holding the reins (better for "just incase" deal..LOL). Once we got out of the crowd i drove her around and ALLLLL the way back up to barn E with no problems..she was still a little jittery but that was OK. It was what this mare needed at that moment and i saw no point in ending our session by getting out of the cart with the way she was at that moment.

 

[SaddleTrail]

My husband and I both were shocked at how bad this ended up. Neither of us have any experience in driving so I don't feel as though I can speak as to the hows and whys.

So I will ask questions instead.

Do all drivers use a snaffle and if so, is there another bit that may have stopped the horses sooner?

Is there a "quick release" for the cart to come off or does it simply get broken off?

Is there a certain length behind or ahead that the horses must stay to help them stay out of the way?

I realize these are probably stupid questions but really would like to know.

Also I think this would be a great training tool the videos.

 

[susanne]

While nobody should be scared away from driving after watching this, it does reinforce the fact that there are dangers involved and that all should plan ahead for such possibilities.

As I read this, I think of the stand advice for skidding on ice while driving a car -- turn into the skid. I had heard this for so many years, visualizing how I would do this, that when it finally happened to me I did it without thinking. It was automatic and all turned out well.

True, we can't plan for every situation, but by having a standard protocol and having a plan for a worst case scenario, every driver -- youth, amateur or pro -- will be better able to react safely in a frightening situation.

The story of the gate steward opening the gate and letting the runaway out is especially frightening, and demonstrates the need to instruct all show personnel on what to do.

I love Leia's description of individual horses along the rail -- road bumps!

 

[Sandee]

My husband and I both were shocked at how bad this ended up. Neither of us have any experience in driving so I don't feel as though I can speak as to the hows and whys.
So I will ask questions instead.

Do all drivers use a snaffle and if so, is there another bit that may have stopped the horses sooner?

Yes, most use snaffles. When a horse is truly running away there is no Super bit that will stop them. A calm in-control driver is the best tool for that.

Is there a "quick release" for the cart to come off or does it simply get broken off?

No, there is no quick release. In fact many carts are attached with straps that are wrapped several times around the shafts.

Is there a certain length behind or ahead that the horses must stay to help them stay out of the way?

There is no rule or printed directions for distance between horses. Again if the drivers are responsible they will maintain a safe distance and keep an eye on what's happening around them.

I realize these are probably stupid questions but really would like to know.

The only stupid question is one that is never asked and results in trouble.

Also I think this would be a great training tool the videos.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

AMHR and AMHA both require that driving horses be in a snaffle bit- curbs are not allowed. As Sandee said, using a Liverpool or other heavy bit may help keep a headstrong horse in hand in the normal course of driving but will not stop a true runaway.

Leia