Question On Appys

[Nickermaker]

Ok I have been looking for an appaloosa. I have a couple of questions and they probably are pretty dumb ones. Even so hopefully they are easy ones to answer as I would like to know. Here they are -

How do you tell if a horse is a true Snowcap or a Few Spot?

What do you look for to know that it is one of these?

Or do you just take the breeder's word and hope they know what they have and are talking about?

Also they are supposed to be the best color producers, right or wrong?

Do leopards produce much color - if bred to solid mares?

Thanks - really would like to know.

 

[Kim~Crayonboxminiatures]

-A true Fewspot or Snowcap MUST have 2 appaloosa parents

-They most often will have solid light hooves, with minimal striping (with no leg markings)

- Foal photos are a must because they can roan and look more like something they are not.

-And no, I wouldn't trust all breeders to know, as some consider a horse that has just a small number of spots, or "a few spots" to be a few spot, not true.

Yes at this point fewspots and snowcaps (as long as they are true) are thought to be homozygous and 100% appaloosa producers. A Fewspots is equivilant to a leopard, and must have at least one leopard parent, a snowcap is equivalant to a blanket.

A leopard bred to solid mares has average color production, I have bred my leopard stallion to solid colored mares, and got mostly solid colored foals, a few roans with characteritics, and two spotted foals from an appy bred mare. This is because you only have a 50% chance of the appaloosa gene being passed on. If you are really wanting the appy color, try to find a snowcap or fewspot with lots of appaloosa spots behind it.

Here is my snowcap stallion:

As a foal:

Last fall:

 

[MiniHoofBeats]

Very nice explaination =) I love hearing from people who know what they are talking about, and are right!

Yes, a TRUE few spot and snowcap appy must have 2 appy parents...even better if both parents, have 2 appy parents! (but not required) The more loud appies you have in the pedigree, the better the chances are that you will in turn produce loud appies. (loud being leopard, snowcap, few spot...roans, blankets, snowflakes, etc. are the more recessive patterns).

Homozygous characteristics:

- solid white/pink hooves or minimal striping

- pink skin on nose, around eyes, and on genitals or lots of large mottles

- 2 appy parents

** you can have all, or even one, of the above characteristics on a solid colored appy and still produce loud foals **

Heterozygous (recessive) characteristics:

- large striping on hooves or solid colored

- small mottles or dark colored skin on nose, eyes and genitals

- 1 appy parent

In both cases you can end up with a LOUD colored appy...but if you look for the characteristics, you can find your true gem in the dust! If you see a LOUD leopard, but he has dark skin on his nose, solid black hooves, and minimal to no mottling...chances are it has one appy parent and inherited the loud color gene, but not the pattern gene to pass along to most of its foals (only a few).

I don't have any personal experience, so I am glad Kim posted the outcome from her stallion!

No, I wouldn't take a breeders word...study, study and study! Ask all sorts of questions, request photo's of under the tail, up close of the head, the feet cleaned up and standing on a hard surface so you can see their color...ask about the parents, request photo's, and as Kim said, request a baby photo! Though there has been much discussion over baby coat color vs. adult color and whether the horse is true or false...I still say, look at the facts...not the outer color and how it changes (unless it's varnish roan...stay away from varnish roan!)...

Leopards can produce a large amount of colored foals, but maybe 40-60% of the time instead of 80-100% like snowcaps or few spots. Sure, few spots aren't colorful, but they produce more color than snowcaps! More color than leopards, more color than blankets, more color than frosts, snowflakes, etc...

And also like Kim said, a few spot is NOT a colored horse with "a few white spots"...it is opposite...mostly white with "a few colored spots showing through" =)

Good luck!

p.s. I would suggest joining The Appaloosa Project, their "photo's" section is full of photo's of what to look for as far as homozygous characteristics vs. homozygous...awesome details!

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theappaloosaproject/

 

[MagicTheMini]

I don't want to hijack this thread but more questions means more learning right...What color whould you say these horses are? They are half-brother and sister (same Appy sire). here is the mare:

She is pure appy. The little bay next door is her half-sister (she has color too you just cant see it...again same sire).

Here is the brother:

He is half QH. I always thought he was a snowcap but now I guess he isn't. I have seen baby pics of him and he looks the same. Thanks! L (sorry if the pics are big)

 

[MiniHoofBeats]

You said the mare is all appy, I assume you mean both parents are appies...here's the difference, if one of her parents is a leopard, she is a near few spot, if she didn't have a leopard parent, she is a snowcap that covers a large percentage of her body.

Same with the colt, does he have 2 appy parents? You said they are 1/2 siblings so they have the same...sire or dam? It would help to know what pattern the parents were...

a few spot is a leopard, to the extreme with lots of white and just a handful of spots, they can retain color on the armpits, along the neck and head, and down the legs, or they can turn all white.

A snowcap can cover up to 80-90% of the body, appearing like a near few spot but if neither parent is a leopard, the horse can only be a snowcap.

Does this make sense?

This'll be a bit large but it helps a LOT when trying to determine what pattern you have...keep in mind the parents, ONE parent HAS to be leopard to produce a few spot...

These charts came from The Appaloosa Project yahoo group...

Characteristic - lacing over hips:

Blanket - Snowcap:

Leopard - Few Spot:

 

[Nickermaker]

Thanks Kim & MiniHoofBeats - I do appreciate your answers.

MiniHoofBeats - you say stay away from varnish roan - why? Is it because it's not true appy? Since I'm looking and knew this would be the place to come for answers since I've never owned an appy - I am wondering why you say this - also how do you tell a varnish roan?

Thanks