Horse dumping

[stormy]

Third person in the last 4 months came by my house this weekend saying how they had 2 horses dropped on there property. These with registration papers and a note to please give them a good home they could no longer afford to feed and care for them. With the major drought and hay shortages, job losses and huge plunge in auction prices in our area many have no options left. I expect to see a huge number of hungry horses around us this winter. We are a large group, diverse, caring...what are we going to do?

 

[Jill]

If we had a mini dropped off here like that, with papers, I would be stunned but I think I would be able to find him/her a home. If it arrived w/o papers, I'd be pretty concerned about its future and worried about finding it a good home. I really do not know what I'd do... probably try and get a horse rescue or the SPCA take one w/o papers because I cannot keep ones that are not what I want (I know that sounds mean, but there are space constraints and the ones I have have to be the ones I want).

When there are minis being sold for less (WAY less) than I've paid for my dogs, it's no wonder this kind of thing happens more often now. A lot of the people who were willing to purchase pet quality are now more aware of quality, so those "cheap" horses probably have a harder time finding a home. Quality show horses, I think, will always be sought out.

 

[stormy]

Don't want to get into a quality/price discussion here, of the three drop off cases one was minis, the other two were saddle horses. Good animals, and I have to think good people as they hoped for a better outcome than they could offer in their homes. The fact is there are going to be a lot of horses of all sizes needing help/homes this winter and the rescues are full. What can we do to help these owners support their horses or give them another reasonable option? This is OUR responsibility as a horse community, no one else is going to fix it.

WHAT ARE YOU WILLING TO DO?

 

[Jill]

If you're not willing to consider the quality / price issue, in my opinion, you are not willing to consider a major contributor to the problem.

I'm willing to do what I said above. Additionally, I do not have anything other than show quality horses in my breeding program.

 

[ChrystalPaths]

Ok, here in NY there is hay aplenty but I see all this hay sitting here while other places in the country are hay poor. Yes this means many folks are going to rethink their ownership. Some may do as you say, leave them at a doorstep, which I hate but their intentions are good, if misguided. I get dogs like this all the time! Not horses yet tho.

What to do....I would have to think of the animal fisrt. Papers be dammed, it's an animal in need. I wish the equine community big and small could form a co-operative that included some truckers who could move hay around the country. I wish the govt would allow a nice tax deduction for anyone who donates excess hay to help the needy. I can't tell you how many round bales sit here and rot! Makes me nuts. Why can't some org centrally located in the US warehouse hay and then have it available for a reasonable amt of $$. (I know dream on Deb)

Hearing folks pay up to $25 for a square bale is ridiculous. I couldn't do it, I don't know how they can or will thus the poor equines who need to be sold, be it sales pages, auctions, newspapers. Heck reading our sales page give me pause. SO many for sale.... what's to happen? I have taken in 2 who are old and needed a place. Owners definitely cared but needed the space and rduced costs and most definitely didn't want them to go to an auction.

IF I awakened to a horse in my paddock I'd first be totally shocked, 2nd check it out, 3rd feed it, vet it and try to find it a god home for "free". Yes free. There are good folk out there who would LOVE a horse but the $$ prohibits it and please don't jump and say if they can't afford the horse they can't afford the care. Yes there are some out there who can't and shouldn't have a horse so it would be my job to assure myself and the horse the person adopting is up for it. I don't breed, I don't show any more..my minis are pasture ornaments but it doesn't decrease their worth or any horses worth. If they're loved they're priceless.

I sold my Thera, I loved her so much but she wasn't happy since losing Treasure. She sold for a song but she is so happy now reunited with a mare she knew before and has a loving responsible owner. Yes, I'd try to move mountains to help any animal in need because it "needs help" first and formost. Ok off my soapbox. I feel these poor creatures and they deserve the care and love God gave us the responsibility to provide.

 

[Minimor]

What am I willing to do? What am I able to do? "Not much" would have to be my answer to both questions. If I were to find a horse (of any size) tied to a gate post here and it was obvious that the horse was being given to me I would have to pass it on to another home. Papers or no, it doesn't matter.

If it were a Mini with papers & was a super nice horse with a fantastic pedigree, well, I might try to fit it in with us. But truthfully, that just isn't going to happen! A horse like that....someone isn't going to be just dumping, or at least it is very highly unlikely that they would. Not around here. If it were a Mini, I know someone that would be happy to take it in. She wants a mini in the worst way but can't afford to buy one--she does, however, have hay & would be able to take good care of a Mini once she had one.

A full size horse? I would have to scramble to find a place to send it, because I simply do not have room for an extra big horse now. Nor do I want an extra big horse.

As for what I can do to help someone keep their horses...the best I can do is direct them to someone that has hay for sale. If they don't have the money to buy that hay then there is nothing at all I can do. I surely don't have extra money to be giving to anyone else to buy feed for their animals.

If there is someone that is keeping horses and not feeding them--regardless if they can't find hay to buy, don't have money to buy hay or simply can't be bothered to buy hay--I will report them to the Animal Care people. An animal care officer will visit them, assess the situation and either take the horses or work with the owner to make sure that the animals are looked after. Nice thing about our Animal Care Act--we call into the hotline, give all the info and they send out an officer. The officer is not given the name of the person that reported, therefore he cannot under any circumstances give that name to the animal owner--he cannot give a name that he doesn't know.

 

[Leeana]

Have you guys seen my post on the pony forum?

Last week we had a pony given to use free (the man practically threw him in our horse trailer) bc he couldnt afford hay and his pasture was getting low, but for some odd reason we buy hay for $1.75 less then 6 miles from his house .

Go check out my topic on the pony forum about him if your interested.

I knew that if i hadnt taken him, he would end up some place he didnt need to be ..such as sugarcreek or some out auction. Now, im not sure if we're keeping him of course, its so easy to fall in love but at the same time i have to keep in mind i dont need a pony like him and someone else would get much more use out of him.

 

[minis3]

I think Dinimores reply is absolutely beautiful. I too would put the animals needs first and I could give a hoot less if it is a registered and fine example of a horse or just a pet quality horse. All 3 of mine are pet quality and I really don't care if mine aren't cream of the crop.

I would try to locate the owner and help them out with feed etc. I don't have a lot of extra funds but I would try and help them find answers to their problem and give them help for the short term with feed and whatever else was needed. I could give a mini a home buy do not have the facilities for large horses.

I would get all the horse people in my area to try and help these folks or help find new homes for their horses. I know I could depend on my farrier and vet should this ever happen to me and I find horses tied to my property.

It is so sad to hear of things like this. Especially if the horses were very much loved and well taken of. If they were neglected and no longer wanted, then taking these horses or finding them good new homes would definitely be the first thing I'd do.

 

[Jill]

My point about being more concerned about whether or not the drop off horse had papers, is because a lot of homes (including myself) will not consider taking in an unpapered mini. Because I already have "a lot" of minis and love each of them, I am not personally in a position to give a permanent home to a horse who does not "work" with my goals.

I'm thinking some of you figure that I wouldn't want a dump off horse w/o papers because no one would "buy" it??? No. I don't want any dump off horse, but if one were dumped w/o papers, I would personally be concerned about being able to find it a long term home because most mini people want papers. I was not thinking to "sell" a dumped off horse (papered or not). I'd be looking to move the horse asap to a good, long term home and hadn't thought of charging.

Hopefully I am not setting myself up for a dump off (please, don't!), but with all the auctions around, I don't think that suddenly finding a strange horse dropped off on your property is very likely. Being sold by the pound by the current owner, though, unfortunately is happening frequently.

 

[Warpony]

I'm in the process in the next year of setting up some small paddocks with shelters where I can take in a few drop offs if they happen. They are not real common around here but I've heard of one this fall and if the economy here keeps tanking it will only get worse. I'm stretched right now with the mouths I have to feed and I am physically incapable of caring for a full sized horse but I think with careful planning I could handle 2 or 3 ponies/miniatures. Not right now, but next year. I already have the drop offs of kittens and cats, and now that people know I have mini's it is only a matter of time. Realistically I have to think of this now and decide how I will handle it, whether it happens or not. I have already talked to my vet and farrier and they have said they would be willing to network to help find homes for any should it happen. I hope it doesn't happen but if it does hopefully I will be prepared.

 

[ctgponies]

I'm going to chime in here. We have had horses for a number of years but just started our own barn this summer. I have always wanted to take home the older horses that people have sadly outgrown or the ones that really needed help but wasn't able to. No I am able to so I am doing what I can.

I have a full size QH gelding who is in his mid-20s. I have a Quarter pony who was dead lame when I bought him last November due to his former drunk owner riding him on pavement until he was lame. I lost sleep over the condition of his feet. I have a pony that came through 2 auctions and was a basket case. He had had a major wreck in the last year that traumatized him but he is coming along with kindness and care.

I have 2 minis now - both what I would consider rescues as well as 2 horses and a pony. The first guy is double registered AMHA/AMHR and had been a stud. He was run through 2 auctions in less than a month so people with well bred minis do "offload" them. The 2nd is unregistered but was in dire need of help so we took him in. We are planning on taking in his pasture mate this week - also unregistered - a mare who may be bred and is very underweight. You can see pics on my website: http://www.ctgponies.4t.com/Minis.html

I do what I can, when I can because I don't think that any animal deserves cruel treatment - registered or otherwise. We are not wealthy by an means but if I can make a difference, I will.

 

[Chamomile]

Jill, they don't allow slaughter any longer in the US. So there is no "price per pound". I was at the "Big" Billings sale a couple of weeks ago and it was a real heartbreaking and eye opening experience. It was awful! I got $500 for a wonderfully well bred, show mare, National quality, BRED mare. I got $125 for a very well bred, well trained, show quality gelding. There were people there from Missouri, Nebraska, Oregon because the horse sales both private and auction are non existent. The prices are so bad that you are practically giving away your horses. The people from Missouri and Nebraska were in a real fix as they were having a very hard time finding hay. This is a serious problem nationwide!! Something that is adding to the problem are the big breeders continuing to breed for 100's of foals a year with the market falling down all around them. People that live in the "bubble" that says if only people would charge better prices for the papered horse, then the market would come back up, aren't looking at the facts. They are actually adding to the problem by staying ignorant of the facts. This is not something that can be ignored. It is not going to go away. Without the slaughter the horse market will crash. It's a fact of life.

Jill, I also noticed that if you had an unpapered horse show up at your place, you would take it to a rescue. HOW can you expect the rescue to care for the horse when they are filled up with horses that no one wants?? The fact is that rescues across the nation are being inundated with horses, starving, sick and uncared for animals that have no where to go. Here in Eastern Montana some of the ranchers are opening their gates to let the horses fend for themselves because they can't feed or sell them. This is information coming straight from "the horses mouth" so to speak.

Here in our area there were 30 horses taken from an elderly gentleman. On a scale from 1-10 (10 being good and 1 being the worst) they were a 2. They were putting foals down as the trailers were rolling into the fairgrounds. My vet was there, helping with the horses and talked to the elderly man. He said he just "forgot" to feed them. He also said, what can they do to me? I don't have anything to take, they can have the horses. These horses are PAPERED, show horses. At one time he was a very well thought of breeder in the area. People are shocked. But he also said, if I can't even sell them at the action yards, what am I supposed to do with them? There are thousands of uncared for, forgotten horses across the nation at this time big and mini and if we, the people that claim to love and care for these animals don't step up and do something about it, then no one will. What is needed is donation of time and money to the rescues such as Chance's Miniature Horse Rescue, your local Humane Society, and other Rescue and Sanctuaries around the nation. Without our support they will be in the same boat as some of these other people out there that can't afford to feed and properly care for these animals.

I think the bigger issue is not what to do with the one or two horses that are dropped off, papered or not (geesh I can't even believe that comment!) but what can we do as a community to make it better for these wonderful beautiful animals.

And of course Debs, I do love your response!! I would hope that anyone faced with this situation would look at the animal for who it is and not worry about whether or not it had paperwork, and just care for it while it was in their corral. We all hope to find good homes for our horses, but there are only so many of those. That is why I am OUT of the breeding business. It's too heartbreaking for me...

 

[Margot]

It is a sad fact that since there is no meat market for horses now, more and more will be dumped or starved. I hate the thought of horse slaughter but without it there are going to more and more starving horses. I do breed for show quality minis but they don't all turn out that way and even the homely ones deserve the best home you can give them. We have a retired standardbred that does nothing but stand around and eat but he is 27 and who would want him, I gave away a mare that had founder problems to a loving home and was lucky to find it. Here in PA there is plenty of hay, we make our own and we left some just mowed and rotting in the field. As a former dairy farmer I know that in the past farmers organized some type of hay shipments to drought stricken areas. There is hay available it is just expensive to get it shipped around and people that are on the borderline financially just can't afford it.

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

The answer to me is pretty simple.. BREED LESS HORSES.. i dont care if the horses are papered, show quality, National winners, halter horses , riding horses, kid horses.. the drought, or to much rain and hay being unavailable or not as readily had has nothing to do wtih how much you paid for your horses or the quality of your horses.. it happens all around to top quality, pet quality and everything in between.

I am not sure at what point people will get that right now the bottom line is that every new baby makes a difference.. if every breeder big and small horses didnt breed just ONE HORSE they had planned on think of how many less horses that would be in the market!

There is only so large of a market for show quality horses only so many people show, same with any discipline bottom line is there is to many horses for the market to handle of all breeds.

Now all of that said of course I would take in a horse and re home it I wouldnt keep it.. I keep what I can at this moment safely afford.

 

[Marty]

My former stable in Florida was the local dumping zone for especially geriatric horses. People assumed that since I had gobs of kids out there riding, I must have needed their old, starving, lame horses, and yes, we have been given a few big horses to us throughout the years. I surely did not need these extra animals and certainly did not need the vet bills or extra feed bills they incurred, but no one was turned away. It was a hardship on me adding extra stalls not to mention the extra daily labor involved, and I don't remember asking them at the gate for their credentials to enter. Those were just the big horses.

We took in quite a few ponies from Homestead when Hurricane Andrew hit us too. Nope, no credentials there either. But now I am full up and on a budget to take care of what I do have here before me. I'd have to put another horse on the roof if one showed up. I hope that doesn't happen but if it does, he would not be turned away because he lacked "quality".

This year due to the drought, there are hardly no more cows around, and mostly everyone has sold their horses too. I don't even hear a "hee haw" up here anymore. However, I didn't have trouble taking the time and driving far out of my area for my winter hay though, and by the way, last time I checked, no animal needs a fancy pedigree to be loved.

 

[Jill]

Jill, I also noticed that if you had an unpapered horse show up at your place, you would take it to a rescue. HOW can you expect the rescue to care for the horse when they are filled up with horses that no one wants??

How can "you" expect ME to take on the responsibility of someone else's animal, when I have plenty of my own to take care of? Having an open door policy for other people's unwanted (or unable to be cared for) horses, dogs, cats, is not an option at my place. I wish it was, but it's not. If you can't beleive my comment that a papered horse will be easier to find a home for than an unpapered one, then I am just floored. You may be reading things I did not mean into my comments. What I mean is that a papered horse will most likely have an easier time finding a home than an unpapered one. Nothing at all wrong with saying it because it's what I think to be true.

 

[PaintNminis]

If it was a Mini with or without Papers

I think I would care for it intel I could find a Permament Home

Maybe even Cart train it (Then it would be hard for me to sale)

 

[Chamomile]

I'm thinking that you may have not been out and about, to the different sales, maybe you haven't been selling horses for very long. Yes, in a normal season a papered horse would be easier to sell. In this selling year that is not the case. It doesn't seem to matter whether the horse has papers or not, they all cost the same to feed, therefor the prices are all dropping. If there is too much of a good thing unfortunately the value will drop, papered or not. And it's just the way it is, at the sale the unregistered animals were bringing more money. Not a lot more, but more than the registered minis. It really was eye opening.

I don't expect "you" to have to care for someone elses unwanted animals any more than I am able to at this point in my life (although I have done so many many times in the past with both the big and the little horses) what I am saying is that instead of complaining about the market and the problems, instead of adding to the problem by breeding more foals, instead of taking someones unwanted horse and dumping it at a rescue, we all need to step up and help! As I stated donate time or money to rescues, sanctuaries and such. We all should be educated about the market we are in. It's time to educate people...

 

[mininik]

Humane euthanasia is ALWAYS an option, if nothing else. Bullets are cheap or call your vet. There is no excuse for starving or otherwise unproperly cared for horses, or sending horses through a kill auction, or dumping them on someone to do who knows what with them.

I think it's crazy that so many are blaming rain, no rain, price of feed, the market, no price per pound, big breeders, etc. on their inability to care for their horses properly. I don't understand the thought of providing a "Welfare" service of sorts for those who can't afford to provide the basics for animals in their care at the expense of who, responsible owners and taxpayers? If you can't afford to feed them, don't breed, buy or own them! Last time I checked, horses are a total luxury for most to own these days.

:

 

[stormy]

Chamomile, thanks for hitting the target, this is a problem here and now. No breeding will reduce the numbers in the future but what are we willing to do for the ones here NOW?

Mininik humane euthanasia is not so easy, here it would be around $125, than hire someone to pick the body up or if you are fortunate hire someone to bury it. Nobody can plan for everything. Literally hundreds of thousands of people have lost their jobs in this area in the last few years, many completely blindsided. These folks own good, decent, registered, unregistered, old, young, large and small horses...what are they to do when it comes down to feeding the kids, keeping the mortgage paid or feed the horse?! They want to do what is best for their animals.

Get real, we have a problem, it is here now..what can we do? Government is not going to help, we don't generate enough tax $$ to make them interested. Not all can take on an extra horse...but what CAN WE DO?