harnessing question

Miniature Horse Talk Forums

Help Support Miniature Horse Talk Forums:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

RobinRTrueJoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
2,441
Reaction score
1
My husband questioned the way I hooked up my harness. He really doesn't know anymore than I do, so I thought I would ask people that really know.

I have a basic metal black essy entry cart with bicycle wheels.

My question: When I attach the traces to the cart..... (I do not have any loops on the shafts) Do the traces simply attach to the cart, OR do I run the traces through the harness part that the shafts go through? I know, I need to bone the name of the parts.

Thanks for your help.
 
Let's hope Leia will jump in here...

I am not sure what you mean by the "harness part that the shafts go through"? Do you mean the tug loops? If your cart doesn't have the loops on the shafts that are obviously for the traces to go through, and you are not using breeching, then the traces most likely don't go through anything.
 
No, the traces never go through the "tug loops" or those round parts that the shafts go through. The traces go behind those, in between the tug loops and the part that goes around the horse down to the bellyband.

I personally HATE people who wrap traces around the shafts, but some people do!!!

Andrea
 
You may find this thread useful in

Best of lil Beginnings Forum - how to harness a horse

Also this Regency weblink is great - see Regency -- see Mini Driving 101 link on this page

The traces go between the tugs and the belly band/saddle and attach back on the cart's single tree. You do not wrap them in the wrap straps for the tugs - they should slide freely behind the tugs. Also do not wrap the traces around the shaft.

The cart and trace length should be adjusted so the end of the shafts should be no further forward than the point of the horse's shoulder. If the traces are too long, the shafts will look like they are about to come out of the tugs. If the traces are too short then the shafts will be at or beyond the horse's chest.

Good Luck -- posting pictures of your harnessed horse can help others help you as well.
 
I personally HATE people who wrap traces around the shafts, but some people do!!!
Andrea
Hello Andrea,

Would you mind to elaborate on what you mean by "wrap(ping) traces around the shafts"? My biggest hole at this point is proper harnessing and I am trying to learn as much as I can without standing in front of a trainer. I do not object to trainers, but there are no longer any driving trainers in or near my area and one can only learn so much from reading a book. I ordered a couple Miniature Horse driving DVDs that I have not had time to watch yet and I am not harnessing or driving anyone improperly at this time as I am not going to harness or drive anyone until I learn to do it properly (and I am on a mission to do so!). Back in 1998, when I first began driving my Quarter Horse mare, I did not know anyone that I could ask for help that was either experienced with or interested in driving. I am embarrassed to admit that I did not know until recently that the traces hooked over the ends of the singletree. I still cannot put my mind around that and, to back up my reasoning, I attended an AMHA show as a spectator recently (July of this year) and the horses were all hitched this way and all of their breastcollars constantly slid back and forth across their chests with every step they took. Does that not wear out the hide/skin/hair and/or irritate or sore the horse? I used to wrap the traces around the shafts and there was no sliding back and forth or wear to the hide/skin/hair and the cart was pulled forward by the breastcollar and stopped by the breeching. My mare did not seem restricted in her movement nor did she ever seem to experience soreness or wear to her hide/skin/hair and we always did remarkably well at shows against professionally trained and hitched Saddlebreds and Morgans (on the county fair circuit).

default_wacko.png
 
Last edited by a moderator:
When your traces are properly hitched to the singletree they allow for the back and forth motion of the horses shoulders, as he moves the breast collar moves with him. If you wrap your traces around the shafts this prevents the action of the singletree from taking up the wear and tear - your horse is moving back and forth inside a stationary breast collar. In a breed show class this isn't a horribly big deal because you are only out there for a few minutes at a time but if you were to drive like this all the time your horse would develop sore shoulders and begin to resent the harness. There is no great advantage to doing this so I don't know why you would. The whole reason singletrees were invented to replace roller bolts and other stationary means of hitching the traces was to prevent this - why would you want to take a step backward at your horse's expense?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Great answer to the original question, JJay! I have nothing to add as you've covered it all.
default_smile.png


As for wrapping the traces around the shafts-

MiLo Minis said:
There is no great advantage to doing this so I don't know why you would. The whole reason singletrees were invented to replace roller bolts and other stationary means of hitching the traces was to prevent this - why would you want to take a step backward at your horse's expense?
People do this because their traces are too long. Instead of ordering shorter buckle-in traces or replacing a breastcollar with sewn-in traces, they just wrap them to take up the extra length. Understandable in the short-term, but not correct!

I've always had mixed feelings about the whole "you'll sore your horse" thing. I drove a roadster-type cart with only stationary hooks for quite a while and never did my gelding seem sore or restricted. I had the same experience that Annabellarose did- no rubbing, no ouchies, no hairless patches, no sores. So on the one hand, with the right type of vehicle and in certain applications it really isn't the end of the world. Heck, most the show carts I've seen have the singletree lashed down so tight it can barely move anyway!
default_new_shocked.gif
(I had to cut the beta straps holding mine and lengthen them.) On the other hand, that wisdom was passed down from an era where you were talking big horses pulling heavy loads over long distances and when people switched from neck collars appropriate to the heavy draft work to breastcollars which were easier to fit, the horses suffered. Neck collars sit against the stationary plane of the upper shoulder and the leg can move forward freely under it, unaffected by the load. A breastcollar sits across the chest and the horse must force their mobile lower shoulder forward against the load with each step. This means they run into the end of the traces with each and every stride, and the heavier the load the harder that impact is. Eventually that IS going to sore a horse in agricultural or transportation work and probably rub him uncomfortably if the harness is dirty or rough. It also effects the horse during turns, restricting his outside shoulder and preventing him from bending his body properly. That's a no-no in carriage driving!

As MiLo said, singletrees replaced stationary rollerbolts so that the breastcollar could move with the horse's shoulders and leave the horse working almost as well as he did when the load was up above his shoulders on a neck collar. After several years of driving with that roadster cart I decided to retrofit it with a singletree because of all the cross-country use I gave it. On rough ground the ride improved tremendously as it no longer jerked the horse (and consequently me) every time it hit a bump. The singletree absorbed part of that impact and smoothed the whole ride. So were we fine with stationary hooks? Yes. But it was better with a singletree. Why not do what is better for your horse?
default_smile.png


The show ring is a very special world, well-isolated from the days when horses were draft animals and their long-term comfort and soundness was paramount. For five minutes a horse can do just about anything! (I can take high heels for a few hours too, and lord knows those aren't exactly ergonomic!
default_rolleyes.gif
default_laugh.png
) And there are many older-style minis who don't move their shoulders very much even when loose in the paddock (think the short, choppy movers) who are going to experience no hardship at all from a stationary breastcollar. But the bigger the mover or the heavier the load, the more he's going to feel that restriction and benefit from a good line of draft with a working singletree.

Leia
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Well, I was going to respond but there you go!

I also want to mention that in many Roadster style classes, the horse doesn't even pull with the breastcollar for the most part they pull with the saddle (!) so it doesn't matter that there are stationary hooks for the traces to connect to. I always prefer a singletree though if I have a choice!

Lots of people believe that a breastcollar will "interfere with the horses' front end action" so they leave it flapping in the wind. Perhaps that's why you saw the breastcollars "rubbing back and forth over the shoulders" because they weren't engaged!

Because the horse in the showring is pulling on level ground for just a few laps, it generally doesn't matter.

The breed ring is definitely its own "thing"!

Andrea
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thank you Leia and Andrea!

Lots of people believe that a breastcollar will "interfere with the horses' front end action" so they leave it flapping in the wind. Perhaps that's why you saw the breastcollars "rubbing back and forth over the shoulders" because they weren't engaged!
Thank you for taking the time to address that part of my question as I just could not understand how that back and forth, slipping and sliding strap benefited the horse. I understand what you mean, but, for some reason, it wasn't something I was able to figure out on my own. So, if properly engaged, the breastcollar does not do that sloppy slipping and sliding?

The breed ring is definitely its own "thing"!
Amen! I am finding that out! I should not be surprised as I come from the Arabian world and they certainly have their own "ideas" about a lot of stuff.
default_biggrin.png


No offense to any breed ring people, but CDE and the like are looking more and more attractive the more I learn/see.
 
Nope, when the horse pulls from the breastcollar (provided the singletree can move properly) it should not really be "rubbing" against the horses' chest. It may rub fractionally when the traces are wrapped around the shafts, because the horses' shoulders are then moving but the breastcollar strap is not.

I just think it looks "improper" to have the shafts wrapped up in the traces. I guess it "looks" a little less sloppy than having the traces hanging/flopping if the breastcollar isn't engaged, but to each his own I guess.

Andrea
 
Annabellarose said:
Lots of people believe that a breastcollar will "interfere with the horses' front end action" so they leave it flapping in the wind. Perhaps that's why you saw the breastcollars "rubbing back and forth over the shoulders" because they weren't engaged!
Thank you for taking the time to address that part of my question as I just could not understand how that back and forth, slipping and sliding strap benefited the horse. I understand what you mean, but, for some reason, it wasn't something I was able to figure out on my own. So, if properly engaged, the breastcollar does not do that sloppy slipping and sliding?
Sorry, I'll admit I was a bit confused by your two references to breastcollars slipping and sliding and soring horses. I didn't realize you meant when they are so loose in the show ring! Glad Andrea caught that.
default_yes.gif
Yes, the breastcollar is basically there only for show in that particular circumstance- sadly, it isn't doing a thing. There's a WHOLE different method of harnessing for fine harness versus working carriage harness or draft harness. There's a logic to it, it's just very different and meant for short-term use and showing off the horse.

I had to laugh at a clinic this spring though- one gentleman stood up to address the audience during my harnessing seminar and said "Some people will tell you that you have to leave the breastcollar loose so it doesn't interfer with your horse's shoulder...that's what the SINGLETREE is for!"
default_new_rofl.gif
I thought he had a great point.
default_biggrin.png


disneyhorse said:
I just think it looks "improper" to have the shafts wrapped up in the traces. I guess it "looks" a little less sloppy than having the traces hanging/flopping if the breastcollar isn't engaged, but to each his own I guess.
And at least it's not as dangerous as having the traces dangling for the horse to get a hind leg caught over.
default_new_shocked.gif
The right answer is to get a properly fitting harness, but if you must drive temporarily with excessively long traces then wrapping is better than having them draped. Using carrier loops on the shafts is even better though if you don't have breeching.
default_smile.png


Leia
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Latest posts

Back
Top