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zoey829

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We have an awesome stallion. But we decided to lease a stallion to get new lines, Holy Molly!! He is as sweet as the come. But he is young and has not bred much. When we put him in with the mare he was trying to kill her. He freaked. He broke my husbands thumb and frac his wrist. What should I do. All my mare have foals by thier side. What is the best way to do this?? Or should I ust return him and cut my loss????
 

Matt73

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We have an awesome stallion. But we decided to lease a stallion to get new lines, Holy Molly!! He is as sweet as the come. But he is young and has not bred much. When we put him in with the mare he was trying to kill her. He freaked. He broke my husbands thumb and frac his wrist. What should I do. All my mare have foals by thier side. What is the best way to do this?? Or should I ust return him and cut my loss????
I'm assuming you're just turning him out with the mares. Hand breed him! A young stallion, IMHO, shouldn't just be turned out with mares; he's lucky it wasn't the other way around and HE wasn't attacked. If he becomes agressive with the mare, circle him -don't discipline by hitting...you may make things worse-. Keep circling him until he understands that he must "treat her like a lady" before he can mount. Once he sniffs and snorts, and she responds, then let him mount. Don't let him ravage the mares...you...or your husband or you are in for a battle.
 
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Boinky

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Two words for you "Stud chain" (hence the name of them). Get a decent stud chain and put it over his nose. If he gets too strong or going at the mares too fast/out of control. Shank him until you get his attention. circle him around a couple times to get him focused on you then proceed to try again. Every time he overreacts and is ruff towards the mare or you get tuff on him and use that shank! Establish boundary's NOW before he gets worse. It's not acceptable to be nasty to the mares or hard to handle. stallions CAN be well behaved and mannerly when breeding (depsite what some people seem to think).
 

zoey829

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Our attempt was hand bred. He was nuts!!! What do you mean by circling him? Before he actualy breeds if he looks unruley? What do I do with the foals???

My stallion knows better. He kisses gently breeds and then sleeps.
 

Lucky-C-Acres-Minis

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Agree with what they said above, get a stud chain on him and let him know what it means.. You gotta get him respecting your space and the mare's space or someone will end up hurt.. If he acts up do not let him mount/breed as he'll be "rewarded" and you don't want to reward the bad behavior..
 

bluerogue

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Hand breed! Safer for your mares, babies, him, and not to mention you. I would see if someone else can't come out and help you and your hubby. Someone will be needed to hold all three horses, including foal (baby should be held near mares head, so she can see baby. I would recommend hubby right now, due to his injuries- this should be the easiest until he's healed enough to handle more).

I would also contact his owners and ask if you can use a chain when you hand breed him. Let them know your concerns, and the problems you have had so far.

My stallion has only been hand bred. I chose to do it that way, as I did not want anyone hurt, and I prefer to know my breeding dates for sure (just in case he wanted to be sneaky about it).

I use a chain on him ONLY when he is going to be breeding. He also has a special halter that is only used when he is teasing/covering a mare. We also only tease/cover in one place. He KNOWS when he's gonna get a mare... and when he's coming out to work. He's not hard to handle at any other time. He's very sweet, and gentle. But he's a stallion, and he does know it.

He can be very "studdy" when he's breeding, and since I am not physically strong enough (due to permanent injuries) to make sure he cannot hurt me, the mare, or himself while breeding. I spoke to a very experienced trainer. She recommended using a chain, and showed me the right way to do it. Since he's boarded on her property, I am instantly corrected should I do anything wrong to "our" baby boy!

So far it's worked very well. No one's been injured (badly, I've had my chronically dislocating knee pop out a few times, and been stepped on by both mares and him, but no lasting damamge done), the mares are bred, he's easier to handle, and he's not so concerned about breeding all the time. The chain is what really made it safe for me. If need be, I can pull him off a mare, where before I couldn't, as I just was not strong enough on my knee (it would pop and collapse... and yes, I did fall. Once on him while he was trying to service the mare. Shocked the heck out of both of us, but since he wasn't aiming right, I did get my wish to get him off so he could try again. I'm lucky my boy is smart enough to realize I needed help getting back up, and stood still for me).

And please, don't flame me for doing the best I can with my horse. I know I need to get my knee fixed. However, until I can get it fixed, I just have to muddle along the best I can. This is one of the reasons the two mares we are breeding this year got sent out.
 

Lucky-C-Acres-Minis

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She said he breeds either way. Boy was she wrong. Ugh!!
He may, for her.. You're new to each other and he's going to test you etc, and you may handle him different than she does which he can tell.. I've found that a consistent routine works great for our guys when it comes to breeding and they are much better behaved when we stick to that routine compared to other times where we may leave a step out, might talk to her and see if there's a 'routine' she follows, how she corrects him etc..
 

kaykay

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I do not believe in chains over the nose ever. I have only had to use a chain under the chin a couple times. Over the nose can cause some real damage. Im kinda confused why anyone would lease a young stallion that hasnt bred much?? You would be so much better off with a mature stallion that has been taught manners!
 

Marty

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Gee whiz I am sorry your husband got hurt! That's bad.

No disrespect intended, but I think you are over your head. Be sure your mares tail is wrapped, that helps.

I would never attempt to turn this bad boy loose to pasture breed. Hand breed him only or forget it. I'm with Kay as I don't do chains but sounds like you might need one under the chin. If you still can't control him, quit before he does more damage.

Why not call the person who leased you this awesome stallion and tell them you are having

troubles and ask them to come and show you how they go about hand breeding safely? If they

won't come, send him packing. It's not worth anymore broken bones

to your family or injuries to your mares and their babies. Be careful and good luck.
 

Minimor

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I agree with Kay & Marty. If you don't know what you're doing with the chain over the nose, it can cause some serious damage. Since this isn't your stallion, you are just leasing him, I'm not sure that you want to risk doing permanent damage to his face? My stallion is 37" and when he was younger & breeding his first mares he was overenthusiastic to say the least. I managed to teach him some manners and self-restraint without resorting to a chain, but then I've had some experience in handling & training young stallions to breed.

I would second the suggestion about calling the owner & asking her to come & show you how she handles this young fellow so that he will breed safely. If she won't or cannot do that (I don't know how far away from you she lives) then I'd be inclined to agree that you should send the stallion home.

Our attempt was hand bred. He was nuts!!! What do you mean by circling him? Before he actualy breeds if he looks unruley? What do I do with the foals???
It sounds like you don't have the experience to deal with him on your own and since he's already hurt your husband I just don't think he's the horse for you.
 

KAYO

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When we breed our mares that have foals at their side we leave the babies in a stall by themselves. There's too big of a chance that they could get hurt or killed. If the stallion should decided to strike at the foal while all this commotion is going on the foal could get hurt seriously or worse. Usually the mares cry a bit but are interested in whats going on with them.

Our older stallion gets pretty aggressive, we let him know from the time we halter him that he has to behave or we will really slow things down. He wants to be too fast and doesn't give the mare a chance to show him shes ready, we will back him off, walk him a bit and bring him back slowly. This seems to be working here.

Good luck, and don't get hurt.
 

Margaret

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Many years ago I owned a stallion that was much the same way that you described..

and I too chose to hand breed him as well.

I remember feeling my adrenalin climbing, even before I ever went out to hand breed him.

I spent half of my time trying to get him to calm or slow down, when we were appoaching the mare with him, but once we got within 10 feet it was useless, as he was out of control, and determined to breed..

The mares always ended up always standing for this stallion, without incident, but I did not like breeding this way, and tried many different methods to slow him down, including the circling, and restraints but it always ended up the same.

Once we got with in 10 feet, it was just too hard to control him, and he was going to breed..

One thing that helped is that we always checked the mares receptivity first thru a fence line to make sure They were definatly intrested, and this helped, as they always stood like the rock of Gibraltar with this stallion.

They would usually look back at us,- struggling with controling him, wondering why all the formalities.. lol

We did breed him quite a few times, but in the end, I ended up selling this well pedigreed, beautiful stallion to some one that understood, and was willing to deal with- his anxious breeding behavior.

He was just too much for my adrenalin.

I now own a much more controlable stallion, that is way easier to breed.
 
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bevann

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Before you get the stallion in with a mare let him sniff her through the fence to make sure she is ready.Then take the mare out and in to the stallion.Put the foal on 1 side of a fence where mom can see it and smell it .Use a chain under the stallion's chin and make him behave.If not get rid of him.I have a very nice gelding here who was so bad to the mares in spite of repeated training that he lost those boy parts. No Mini rapes on this property.Those young guys have to learn manners or they don't remain stallions.If you are not very experienced with breeding stallions you need to get a gentleman of a stallion.
 

RockRiverTiff

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It's rare that we breed mares with foals, but when we do, I use a makeshift chute. We have a ramp leading into the first barn, and I open the gate at the top of the ramp, back the mare to the edge, and lead the stallion up behind. This way we can keep her foal in front of her (in the barn), so she does not panic, and the stallion has no access to the foal. It also gives me greater control of the stallion--if he starts acting up I just take him off the ramp, but really this doesn't give him room to do much beyond sniff and breed. (We let them flirt through the fence prior to breeding just like Margaret mentioned.)

Unfortunately, if you stick with your guy I think you're going to be doing a lot of manner work before you even start with the breeding. As others have mentioned, it might be better just to look for a different stallion. I definitely feel for you in this situation--those young stallions can be a handful. Good luck!
 
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Magic

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I feel badly for you, I've started my share of young, excitable stallions to breeding, and it is no picnic!
The stallion I've leased for this year is the opposite of yours though; he's a sweet talker, every mare here is in love with him and doesn't want to have anything to do with any other stallion, lol! This stallion is young too but was started hand-breeding to learn manners and then went to pasture breeding and he is very smart, and very careful. I've actually realized how much more work my other mature (but young) stallion needs to be a "gentleman" breeder like this leased one.

When breeding a mare with a foal at her side, I always put the foal in a stall, with the mare tied to that stall front so she can see her baby, but baby is safe.

I don't know what to tell you about this stallion you've leased, except that if you've only just begun and your husband has already been so badly injured, you may want to cut your losses before you get hurt or your husband gets hurt even more.
I've never been injured while working with breeding stallions (knock on wood) and I've used some very strong, excited young inexperienced stallions, so IMO it just isn't worth the risk.
 

zoey829

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Thanks everyone for all the help. I am so upset. I was so excited, too!!! I am just glad I didnt buy a stallion ahd have this problem.

I did call the lady. SHe is very nice and offer to pick him up tonight. I asked tons of questions and this isnt what I expected. Thanks and I will keep everyone posted.
 

Nathan Luszcz

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We have an awesome stallion. But we decided to lease a stallion to get new lines, Holy Molly!! He is as sweet as the come. But he is young and has not bred much. When we put him in with the mare he was trying to kill her. He freaked. He broke my husbands thumb and frac his wrist. What should I do. All my mare have foals by thier side. What is the best way to do this?? Or should I ust return him and cut my loss????
I'm assuming you're just turning him out with the mares. Hand breed him! A young stallion, IMHO, shouldn't just be turned out with mares; he's lucky it wasn't the other way around and HE wasn't attacked. If he becomes agressive with the mare, circle him -don't discipline by hitting...you may make things worse-. Keep circling him until he understands that he must "treat her like a lady" before he can mount. Once he sniffs and snorts, and she responds, then let him mount. Don't let him ravage the mares...you...or your husband or you are in for a battle.
No! Circling is a HORRIBLE habit for stallions to learn. NEVER circle a stallion, and if you HAVE to, do it in a very wide arc or to the RIGHT (aka with you on the outside). Never, ever, allow a stallion to circle you with you in the middle. Always circle to the right.

I will discipline with a chain or whip if they get aggressive or dangerous. He's allowed to be a stallion, to talk, nicker, jump around a little bit, nibble, strike, etc, but in no circumstances is he EVER allowed to savage (bite in an aggressive manner), kick, strike at a human or directly at the mare, circle, or EVER get butt-to-butt. If he's too aggressive, and if he's truely worth breeding, he needs to go to a professional.

As far as chains, EVERY stallion I handle gets a chain in his mouth, regardless of behavior. That's a signal to him that he's allowed to be a stallion. Its not a punishment, its a que. When the chain goes in, he gets to breed. Stud chains aren't a last resort, they are SOP.
 
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Charlotte

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Whoa here! Chains should ONLY be used by someone very experienced with horse training. I have known WAY too many stallions who were poor breeders because of excessive correction by handlers who were unskilled at horse training.

Can you imagine the frustration and disappointment of leasing or buying an awesome stallion only to find he won't breed your mares? It happens!

It is such a shame that someone got hurt by this process of breeding horses. It sounds to me as if this young horse is VERY lacking in ground training. How are his ground manners? Will he walk quietly beside you no matter where you are going at whatever speed you are going? Will he 'whoa' on command and stand until given the siginal to walk out? Will he back on verbal command? If a stallion hasn't been trained in basic ground manners then I don't care how small or how tall he is a person shouldn't consider exposing him to mares. Period. Untill he is trained.

You know, even little Cowboy, all 25 1/2" and 110 pounds of him can be a handfull at the start of breeding season so he always gets a little refresher course in walk, whoa, back before he is exposed to mares each season. Makes the whole process safer for him, and for his handler.

Honestly, I would send that horse back and suggest he get more training before being used for breeding. There are too many quality, trained stallions out there to risk more injury to anyone.

Charlotte
 

kaykay

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Im glad you sent him back. I think in your circumstance you maybe need to find someone where you can drop your mare off and pick her up after shes bred. More expensive but worth it.

For sure never lease a breeding stallion that is young and/or does not have many foals on the ground. I know people that have bought breedings from stallions with no foals on the ground and it just shocks me. If I buy a breeding I want to see quite a few foals out of different mares to see what the stallion prouduces and if hes consistent etc.
 
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