16 day old foall with Copper Head Snake bite

[SNDFarms]

Thanks for all the kind comments!

Just to update everyone, we have been with foal all day attending to her, the swelling has already started going down, matter of fact so much that endotracheal tube that was being used for nasal ariway fell out on its own while she was acting her normal self, she is moving air now through both nasal airways and swelling has gone down however we will have someone with her 24/7 over the next few days, She will continue Antibiotics and Anti-inflammatory meds for the next few days..

She still has some clear discharge but upper airway and lungs are good, Vet was back over this afternoon and says she will be fine, matter of fact states that she is actually progressing better than expected, there was no need for IV's and other supportive care as she continued to nurse and drink plenty of water through this whole ordeal..

Copperhead Snake bites are just as dangerous as any venomous snake bite, however, they are not as bad as most Rattle Snake Bites, Most Copperheads usually strike horses to warn them off, they really have no intention on using their venom on something they can't eat, vet thinks that she may not have got a full dose of venom and that is why she is responding so well, our vets down here don't give Anti-Serum if a certain amount of time has passed and no new symptoms are showing, supportive care and airway is the most important and blood work to determine organ function.

Nasal Airway at some farms consist of everything from pieces of garden hose, to other type of tubing, I personally like Endotracheal Tubes because of the blow up cuff that helps secure the tube and it's a softer type of material so you don't induce trauma, however, I usually start off with large ID Tubes and work down to the one that works the best.. You can obtain these through most medical supply stores and they are true life savers when you need them..

I will post some pics of snake and poor babies face after I get them downloaded to computer..

Again thanks for all the kind comments and prayer, looks like she will be fine after a few days..

 

[SNDFarms]

Update: As of 10pm Foal is doing well, discharge has stopped and upper airway and lungs sound clear, she was very loving and acting like her normal self, she is a little sore from being poked on for the last 24 hours but other than that is doing good, still a little swelling to cheek but not near what it was, bite marks on nose doesn't seem to be painful to her at all, and you can barely even see the marks anymore..

 

 

Vitals are normal, and she is still nursing and drinking plenty of water..

 

 

 

Did I mention I HATE snakes?

 

[Marty]

I'm so happy for this update! You really saved her life. Could you please explain how you did the tube up her ??? I want to learn this and probably others do too.

Also, did you kill that dang snake?

 

[SNDFarms]

I'm so happy for this update! You really saved her life. Could you please explain how you did the tube up her ??? I want to learn this and probably others do too.

Also, did you kill that dang snake?

I did kill the snake, and actually went on a rampage looking for others, it's been so dry here that they are really starting to move around looking for food and water, so I sprayed fence lines, moved and lifted everything I could think of trying to find more, I did find a rat snake but no other Copperheads...

A far as the Nasal Tube goes, I'm not a Vet nor do I pretend to be, I was a paramedic for several years and done some tech work while growing up on a dairy farm.

To make this understandable, I use Endotracheal Tube like you would use for intubation, I find that they work very well for miniatures and like them because of the inflatable cuffs and tube end flange which helps secure the tube, I carry different sizes from small adult 5mm ID on up.

The ideal is to get past the soft tissue through the nasal cavity far enough back to where soft tissue swelling won't shutoff the airway.

I usually measure from the back corner of the eye to the opening in the nostril, I use a Endotracheal Lube that comes in little packs, they are steril and water soluble, I try to pick the side that has the less amount of edema and try to secure that side, I slowly insert tube in nostril and through soft tissue area towards the nasopharynx and listen for good airflow, if you are trying to open an airway in a horse that is already compromised you will be able to tell once you've got past the soft tissue area, because the horse breathing pattern will typically change from a short shallow type breathing to a wow I can breath again type respiration. lol..

This is something I learned years ago as I grew up on a dairy farm, I'm sure there might be different information about nasal airways from your vet and I ask that everybody discuss the use of nasal tubes with their vet, I have personally seen water hoses and other type tubing used for this but I prefer the more steril way of doing things..

Understand this is somewhat evasive and your horse will not like you for it, however, have a halter handy and be prepared horse to pull back and fight you while your trying to do this, If I have time I like to give a sedative but sometimes thats not possible, with my foal from last night I was not able to give a sedative but she really didn't fight to much as she wasn't getting much air and I think she was wanting someone to help her.. But not all horses will see it that way..

I usually inflate cuff with about 5 to 10 cc of air and pull on tube to make sure it's firm and then secure with 1" tape..

Hope this helps, but please discuss with your vet, as he may have a preference on what he would do in this case.. But remember, this can truly save the life of your horse if you act before it's to late, I lost a horse prior to this several years ago because of edema to the upper airway, and learned REAL quick it wasn't going to happen again..

 

[mrsj]

Hi, I'm so glad your foal is doing well, you did a great job.

 

[bannerminis]

So glad that your foal is doing well it must be an awful worry for you.

Do you come across snakes in the stables often?

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I have aquarium hose handy as that was the only thing we could think of, but now I think I'll try to get some medical tubing.

Copperheads are usually in pairs, I was told. We saw one, then did not see the other for several months. That was several years ago and no sight of any since. They are not usually agressive; your little girl probably went up to get acquainted. I think that is what happened to my nosey boy when he was bitten. A Game Ranger told me that a horse that has been bitten won't be bitten again because he will smell the snake. That is good news, though I am waiting for my nosey guy to meet his first porcupine...

 

[Songcatcher]

I have watched this thread with great interest but have not commented because I had no information to give. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and information.

Regarding venomous snakes, Copperheads are not as poisonous as Rattlesnakes, but can certainly be deadly. Fortunately, animals are generally not as adversely affected as humans and can often survive a snake bite.

I once heard a man say that the only good snake is a dead snake. I DISAGREE. There are NO good snakes. Of course I'm sure there are people who will argue with me about that.

 

[rubyviewminis]

Julie, you should start a thread and tell step-by-step your treatments, and case results on your horses, ages, presenting conditions etc. I too have only seen rattlesnake bites, not my own, to large horses and they were treated aggressively by the vets. I took more than a few days for each to show sings of improvement.

 

[Georgia]

Great to hear that your foal is doing so well.

 

[SNDFarms]

So glad that your foal is doing well it must be an awful worry for you.

Do you come across snakes in the stables often?

We bought this farm 4 years ago, this is the first Copperhead I have seen here, I have only seen two snakes on this property, one was a Rat Snake, and the other a Water Snake..

Here is the picture of the Copperhead that got my foal, excuse the shotgun shot to the head..

 

[topnotchminis]

Copperheads come in pairs. You may want to keep an eye out for another. I am glad your foal is doing better

 

[SNDFarms]

Copperheads come in pairs. You may want to keep an eye out for another. I am glad your foal is doing better

We have been looking for the other/others every since this happened, One thing we have started doing is closing stalls during the day, we usually leave them open and let our horses come and go has they please unless we put them up at night, I don't think snake could have got in with stall door shut, so I'm hoping this will help..

 

[SNDFarms]

I have watched this thread with great interest but have not commented because I had no information to give. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and information.

Regarding venomous snakes, Copperheads are not as poisonous as Rattlesnakes, but can certainly be deadly. Fortunately, animals are generally not as adversely affected as humans and can often survive a snake bite.

I once heard a man say that the only good snake is a dead snake. I DISAGREE. There are NO good snakes. Of course I'm sure there are people who will argue with me about that.

I agree 100%, I HATE snakes with a passion, I had a next door neighbor get on to me about killing a 4 foot Rat Snake, even though they aren't venomous they still can cause infections and lameness if they strike a horse in the right place, I have 5 cats around my property and don't have a rodent problem because of that so I don't need rat snakes..