Would like to make a point here...

[Miniequine]

OMG, those arabians are STUNNING!!!

~Sandy

 

[dali1111]

This might help. Here is a picture of a dwarf I volunteered with until he passed away. You can see the obvious difference between him and the horses posted with lovely dishy faces.

 

[runamuk]

Yes... who are we.... What are we?????

I beleive the miniature horse breeders concept of the "Dished" head is a bulged forhead. How else would a mini get a dish????.. Well we know they are not Arabs.. so is it expressing the recessive traits.??? Is it better off calling them Arabian over Recessive heads? It makes it so hard when there is NO TYPE in the miniature.. everyone is out looking for a prototype.. I think they grabbed on to the Arabian.. No body is using the quarter horse as their role model??? I think the goal of the Arab..has been adopted because the Arabian is the finest, most delicate looking of the big horse breeds.. so we have set our sights on looking like an Arab.. because after all we are only a height registry/association.. what does our standard of perfection say we should resemble.??? I guess it doesnt matter..??? Makes one think how a judge percieves our little equine in the show ring...

Very good discussion and imput....

Angie/buckonranch

You seem to have some of the same thoughts I have had. What is a miniature horse? The standard in AMHA is open to interpretation with no real defined "type". Even in breeds such as morgans or arabians or the welsh sections there are guidelines of type. All these breeds have interpretations but in general they all look like the standard. Miniatures can be so variable as to look like completely seperate breeds. I really feel for the judges as there are so many horses that can look so completely different yet meet the guidelines laid out in the standard.

I do see more miniatures moving toward a distinct american shetland style, and others that look almost section A welsh but much more refined. The tiny tippy ears are definately a pony feature rather than a horse feature. I think it will be interesting to see if either registry eventually changes the standard to reflect a specific type.

 

[Brandi*]

Ok I see that there are obvious differences between a healthy mini and a dwarf but all the buldgy forheads look the same to me. Healthy or not. Is it just me? I like a "dishy" face but without the buldge. Just because I don't like it doesn't mean that they have dwarf traits though. I would tell your farrier, vet and who ever else to do some research before they start being rude

:

P.S.

I think the horse that RHA has in their icon looks like a little arab. Head, neck and body . Very pretty

: :bgrin JMO though

This might help. Here is a picture of a dwarf I volunteered with until he passed away. You can see the obvious difference between him and the horses posted with lovely dishy faces.

 

[Danielle_E.]

And even though I make my living showing/marketing Arabs I do not see any minis that really have Arabian heads............minis are more PONY headed with a big jowl that is not really looked upon as an attractive Arabian trait. Yes, a resemblance at best but NOT a good Arabian head. I have posted numerous pictures to try to get this point across. Like Erica and others point out a mini needs room for all their teeth. A nice head in proportion to the body with GREAT expression is much more important then a tiny pony head with up turned nostrils.

I totally agree! I have yet to see a true "arabian head" in a mini. I know many use the expression but having arabians as well I am afraid I have never truly seen it in a mini or in any other breed.

 

[Katiean]

kaykay, you are wrong when you say they are saying the jowl as the dish. This is a strong jowl that you are pointing out. I have had both Arabs and Minis. They are both born with a domed head. Of course you don't want that domed head to be too buldged in any case. My mares head looks very much like Jills mares head. Which I consider to be a dished head. If she were a stud you would see much more jowl as studs are the ones with a bigger jaw as in any breed.

 

[Danielle_E.]

Here is a picture of an arabian foal, I don't see a domed head. This foal is sired by the stallion I will be breeding my mare to :bgrin hopefully this coming spring :bgrin

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

LOL Angie Buckon you said it pretty much the way I would (only better of course) I personally do call those types of heads recessive but that is just what works for me.

I am not sure where anyone is getting they should have a domed head if you look at these top arabs meaning quality arabs you will see they have quite the opposite in fact they have wider flatter forheads for lack of a better way to describe it. There should be no dome of any type

 

[Brandi*]

Oh he is a prety one Danielle

:

 

[Danielle_E.]

Oh he is a prety one Danielle

:

Cute as a button

: . I am double lucky because the stallion is only 20 minutes away from me so it won't be complicated and have to get semen shipped in. The sire is a Padron son named Pommerol and I was lucky enough last year, during their "Garden Party" to spend an hour or so with the stallion and he is soooo sweet and gentle

: .

This is a great thread and even though I stated I have never seen an "arabian head" on a mini there are some exceptional minis out there with very nice heads, more refined than some but I have to say I like all the looks in minis. As long as the head fits the body type..... I also find that many have the more refined heads as youngsters but as they mature they sometimes lose that.

 

[Kim~Crayonboxminiatures]

I agree that in the Minis a "dished" head is interpreted in different ways and not always the most correct. Enjoying the discussion though, this is what betters the breed! :lol:

I have no idea what "type" of head this mare has, but she is my favorite! She has big brown eyes that just make me melt, so here is Spring, spoiled and she knows it.

:

 

[Boinky]

Ok maybe it's just me but i'd consider this mare more "bulgy" than dished. from the front on view it looks like she bulges out and the "dish" caused by it is so high up. It's not the type of dish i'd breed for. i like it to be lower on the nasal bone as the arabians posted have. the dish in the nose is part of the nasal formation and has NOTHING to do with developing a bulge on the forehead to make it look a bit dished.

Honestly i'm thinking part of the problem with this issue is that MANY mini people jump into the breed and start breeding. They have very little experience with any other horses or breeds. I grew up learning about all the different breeds ect and showed horses for years before getting into mini's. I think it's truly a lack of education and not getting out there and SEEING other types and how they differ!

Anyone should be able to look at an arabian head and see the differnce between one and another breed. many breeds have very distinctive heads as well. it's about education and learning what there IS out there, how it works and what you like and dislike for your own program.

This might get me flamed by saying this..but i've noticed that a lot of Buckeroo horses have a bulge (almost more like a jibba than big dwarfy bulge) ..not real extreme but it's there!

I too, think of 'dishy' as the dip in the face.

I have a mature mare with a tiny, dishy head. Carl did

work on her teeth in Texas, and I was pleased that she has no issues.

He just popped a bunch of caps.

I won't post her picture.. I'm sure you all are sick of seeing her...

But I have a friend that owns a 5 yr old mare with, what I think is a 'dishy' head.

I think, one of the prettiest I've seen.

This is Darlin', posted with owners permission....She has had no health issues

 

[Katiean]

That arab foal was not a new born. I would expect my minis by that age to not have a domed head either. See my avatar. I think my foal has a nicely dished head. But, it was domed at birth. So were all of the arab foals I delivered.

 

[susanne]

I think a good way to describe a dished face is that the profile between the horse's eyes and nostrils is a concave shape-- it dips in. It is the opposite of a roman nose, or the convex shape seen on a draft horse.

What many seem to miss is that the beauty of an Arab head is so much more than the individual features. It's not just the large eyes, the tippy ears, the delicate throatlatch, the well-defined jaw and teacup muzzle.

The Arab head has classic proportions and balance. The beauty lies in this balance and how each feature plays off of the next. It's about how that jaw complements the throatlatch, how the jaw is then counterbalanced by the dish. It lies in how those hooky ears are the logical extension of the arched of the neck, and how the flaring nostrils echo the large, liquid eyes.

Remember the original Ford Mustang? It was designed to look as if it was moving, even when parked. This car could have been named the Arabian, since you can imagine the wind flowing over the curves of this horse whether it is racing or standing still.

As beautiful as minis can be, thhey do now have the "real estate" to achieve this grace and exquisite proportion. They, too, may have huge, wideset eyes, a delicate muzzle, a dished face and tippy ears, but on the mini these features don't add up to classical, almost unworldly beauty as they do on an Arab.

 

[Danielle_E.]

That arab foal was not a new born. I would expect my minis by that age to not have a domed head either. See my avatar. I think my foal has a nicely dished head. But, it was domed at birth. So were all of the arab foals I delivered.

That foal (filly) in that pic was five days old so I consider that newborn.

This picture she was 1 1/2 days old

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

It's a pet peeve of mine, but I can't stand it when miniature breeders refer to their horses are "araby" or "arabian-type" etc. I have NEVER seen a miniature that looked like an arabian! Have we forgotten what arabians look like? Look at the stunning arabians posted on this thread. Show me a mini that looks like that!

:

 

[Leeana]

I think we're making this harder on ourselves then it really is lol.

I think if you just look at the head, you should tell if the top of the head is buldging out, top of the head meaning between the eyes up to the ears. A nice small slow slope between the eyes to the end of the muzzle is what i personally like. A small SLOPE in the area that Carol pointed out, not a huge 90 degree drop.

When i hear 'dishy' or see a horse and personally determine if the head is dishy and stylish or not, i look at the WHOLE HEAD. I like to see a small/medium head with a slope under the eye and a smaller muzzle with larger nostrils. I also dont like a horse that is flat under the jaw, i like a pretty jaw as well and tiny ears. I like the dish down below the eyes all the way through the muzzle. I do not like a flat head, it does not appeal to me. A sloping head on the other hand, now that i can appreciate. Here is one of my dishiest heads:

I personally dont think we can really define 'dish', i think a 'dish' can be a number of things on the head but a buldging dome is not attractive lol. I was watching the AMHR Nationals dvd today from RFD and there is a black horse on there with the largest buldging dome i have ever seen, just not pretty to me.

Westwind BTU Crown Prince Narko: You can see the gentle sloping and how the muzzle is tiny and refined compared to the top of the head.

Two of my faverite heads is Ima Boones Little Buckeroo Too and Little Kings Buck Echo 's heads, both completely different but so beautiful.

One persons dish is another persons dome lol

 

[shane]

this is my foal at three months old you can see the dome clearly here, i wouldnt like it to stay like this though

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d97/lynda7249/100_1608.jpg]http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d97/lynda7249/100_1608.jpg

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

thanks for clearing that up Danielle I would have thought him to be around a week old so I was close

 

[Marty]

My 2 cents:

I think the use of the word "dish" is just not appropriate and misleading.

It's a slope, a dip, a curve, a slump, a ski slope, a something, but not a dish.

I also think that the modern miniature of today took on a life of their own and they look like themselves and resemble themselves.