Was I out of line

[Voodoo]

I've been told that I take too much offense if someone badmouths one of my horses, but I can't help it I just love them so much. Say anything you want about me, but don't talk bad about my horses. Any way I was over at a friends house the other day practicing roping. I was talking to him about buying and selling horses, the market for rodeo horses, good colts, training etc....... It started out as just good talk, but then he told me that I had so much ability with colts that I should start buying quality horses so I could sell them for a higher price when I was finished training them. I took offense to that right off because I buy really nice horses, but I look until I find a deal on one as I don't have alot of extra cash around. I usually buy in the $1,000 range and sell for about $15,000 2-3 years later. He told me if I'd start with quality I could sell for $20,000 plus. I was riding my good palomino gelding at the time and said "well shoot Greg I can't even sell this horse for $20,000 I just don't know the people with that amount of money to spend". To that he replied "Well, he's not a $20,000 horse". I was really hurt considering that I have won well over $30,000 on this horse heading for his son, not to mention what I have won with other people!!!!! I asked why he wasn't a $20,000 horse and he said that he is too high strung and an amateur roper (which are the ones who spend the big dollars on an awesome horse) couldn't ride him. This horse will head or heel with no bridle, run barrels, cut cattle, has been to every big roping in the world, is only 11 years old, etc...... I could go on forever about his accomplishments. My brother told me to chill out and not let it bother me since Greg is a friend, but hey I didn't think friends would say something that hurtful. Any way there was a very amateur roper at Gregs place that day looking for horses to buy. He wasn't finding anything in Gregs pen that fit him very well. None of them were finished enough for him and he wasn't roping good at all. When Greg walked outside the arena to saddle another horse (still within sight though) I asked Norm if he'd like to run a few on my horse. He said sure and roped 8 in a row on him, never missed a steer. He came back and got off and said "that's the nicest horse I have ever been on, do you want to sell him". I told him no I didn't want to sell him, but thanks for the compliments. Greg was very mad since Norm didn't buy a horse from him and all he could talk about the rest of the afternoon was how well he liked my horse and how easy he was to ride. He tried to say some bad things, but Norm just wouldn't listen and told him that my horse was the nicest thing he'd ever been on, bar none. Greg and I both just kind of left the subject there and no more was said, but was it wrong of me to "put it in his face" so to speak? Greg has always kind of talked bad about my horses, but that was the last straw, I don't think I was wrong to show him that my horse wasn't worthless just because I didn't pay alot of money for him. I guess maybe this was more of a rant, but either way what do you all think.

BTW here's some pictures of the horse in question

this picture is of me and Gregs son winning about $5,000 each

 

[rabbitsfizz]

In this instance I think you handled it BRILLIANTLY!!!

Tell Greg straight, you put your money where your mouth was, and the horse fit!!

How much was this man willing to spend??

So, basically, what Greg did not like was being proven wrong??

That's OK, no-one does, BUT I do not think you should have taken offence at what he told you in the first place, what I think you should have done was what you did but openly.You should have said to Greg, OK let's let Norm make the decision for us. And then let Norm ride the horse openly.

After all, at the end of the day, whatever your opinion is.

Whatever Greg's opinion is.

It is the CUSTOMER that counts!!!

Be less sensitive , and STILL make your point!!

:

 

[shane]

:aktion033: :aktion033: :aktion033: :aktion033: GOOD JOB,!!!!!voodoo :aktion033: I HATE PEOPLE LIKE THAT, ITS JEALOUSY,THATS ALL, ITS A CASE OF THEY'D LOVE AHORSE LIKE YOURS AND CANT HAVE HIM SO THEY'LL RUN HIM DOWN, I GET THAT SOMETIMES ABOUT MY HORSE, PEOPLE TRY TO FIND FAULTS WITH HIM THAT THERE ISN'T JUST BECAUSE HES A BETTER HORSE THAN THERES LOL

: ID LOVE TO SEE HIM ON PERSON, GOSH ID EVEN JUMP ON HIM MYSELF :bgrin HE LOOKS VERY PROFESSIONAL, I THINK YOUR SUCH AN EXCELLENT HORSEWOMAN, MAYBE BEING A GIRL MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT LOL

 

[NMMack]

:aktion033: [SIZE=14pt]YOU GO GIRL!!!!!!! [/SIZE] :aktion033:

You disproved his statement without having to argue or fight about it, and let someone totally unbiased make the point very succinctly for you!! GOOD GIRL!!! :aktion033:

Nancy & Mike

(P.S. - I REALLY like your gelding - he is not only versatile as all get-out, but VERY good looking too!!!)

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I would not have said Greg's words were born of jealousy- he obviously has a lot of really good horses and he obviously can judge a really good horse.

I would not want this to spoil your friendship with him, he seems like a good guy and a good judge of a horse, and I do not see him attempting to be disrespectful to your horse ,either- it was probably more a bit of a "throwaway" remark on his part than a criticism, but, as luck would have it, the chance to prove him wrong arose and you very neatly took it.

Just because someone criticises a horse does not in any way mean they are jealous- I am afraid I would consider that a bit childish, although I am sure it does happen.

He may well consider his horses are better, he may just not have seriously sat back and considered your horse properly at all. Now he has had to, and no-one's feelings are hurt.

I do think you should sit down and talk to him about it, though, as he obviously feels a bit sore about what you did (which was a wee bitty ill mannered- the not asking bit, anyway

) If you just explained that you had been upset, and were proving a point he would see it, I am sure.

It is very rare these situations pop up like this, so I still feel you were right to take the chance when it arose.

:

 

[Voodoo]

Thanks for the replies everyone and Rabbit I think you were pretty close to right. I don't really think that what he said was out of jealousy, but more from the fact that he rides so many nice horses that he doesn't stop to evaluate others horses, or for that matter the effect his words may have. I do know that I am far too sensitive, but I try to control it. Norm contacted me after I left Gregs and asked again if I'd sell. I told him if he wanted he could come to my place and try the horse again. I felt that it would have been too much to sell the horse on Gregs place that day. The only reason I did it without asking Greg is because I knew I wasn't going to sell the horse that day, and because I knew that he'd find all kinds of reasons why I shouldn't let Norm ride him. I don't like to argue, but rather make a point that speaks for itself. I am going to see him at a roping soon so I'll try to talk to him about it. I really don't want it to come between us because he is a great guy most of the time and has some great ideas, horses, and training tactics. Thanks again everyone.

 

[tuffsmom]

I don't know anything about rope horses, so I drug my husband in the house to look at your pictures. He said "She already knows why that guy was running his mouth....'Yeller' is a heck of a nice horse"

I've always been jealous of your talents!!

: I can't even ride a horse...I'll fall off!!!

 

[Miniv]

I agree with the others.......That "friend", Greg, is JEALOUS. I also think you handled it very well -- with the helpful assistance of Norm.

MA

 

[sdmini]

First I need to commend you. Fewer and fewer people can or want to put the time in on a "green" horse and there is a shortage of good broke, honest horses. :aktion033:

Second no you really don't have to worry about being out of line, as a matter of fact you handled it with much more tack than most. You know what they say talk is cheap, someone there with there check book out isn't. :lol:

The best of us get barn blind sometimes and if Greg is a good judge of horse flesh and talent this may be the thing makes him open his eyes and shed a few preconceived notions he had.

Your the type of trainer most of us small breeders hope to find. If your ever tired of UT there is a house in SD begging for a trainer.

:

 

[Marty]

You know what? I didn't even finish reading your thread. I stopped about half way down and thought to myself what a load of nonsense.

It started out as just good talk, but then he told me that I had so much ability with colts that I should start buying quality horses so I could sell them for a higher price when I was finished training them.

But you can find quality horses all over the place for dirt cheap if you hunt them down. My gosh. There are far more customers for a horse in the $1200. to $2,000 range that you can imagine. Just look at the nice BTU horses out there just as a ruff example. Goodness. And don't get me started about rejects off the track. You hit the frazzled owner on a bad day and he'll practically give that slow horse away.

I know you have talent and know how and it's up to you what price range of buyer you want to peddle to. But if the truth be known, the market for good well broke beginners horses is a gold mine.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I think Greg is just suffering from Masculine Foot in Mouth Syndrome.

I am not one to jump to the defence of a male (I think most can look after themselves) but I have heard Voodoo talk about Greg before and, basically, he seems a good freind and a good, honest sort of guy.

I think he may be feeling a little threatened by you, right now, and feels that if he gives you what he considers to be really good advice he can at least say in the future"Of course I knew her well, back when, and it was me told her to start doing what she's now doing sop well" Does that make sense to you??

He really does think you are not wasting your time, but maybe wasting your talents.

I think what he was trying to say to you was that you should be taking on animals that start out as top quality- colts coming in at maybe $10,000.00 as green youngsters- then taking them to the top, or near it and selling on at a really good price.

I sort of understand what he means, and, as I said I think he is well intentioned, it is just that there is this tension between you caused partly by your sensitivity and partly, I am sure, by the fact that you are female and you are going to be good at your job (I do not mean "good" as you are now, but GOOD on a National scale) and maybe that frightens him a bit.

I can feel your drive and ambition, in your posts, we do not always agree on methods but I really do admire your abilities and the fact that you intend to use them to their limit.

NO COMPROMISE!!

Take no prisoners!! :lol:

I hope when you reach the top, Greg is still there as your friend to say, "I knew her way back when....."

:

 

[sdmini]

colts coming in at maybe $10,000.00 as green youngsters- then taking them to the top, or near it and selling on at a really good price.

Errr, we raised a colt that recently sold for over $45,000 as a finished head horse. We sold him a baby for under $800. Which is why I say proof is rarly in the price. :lol: More and more people can not see past the price tag (this one is $10,000 more it has to be 10X as good then.

: )

Some friends took a horse they bought started for $1,500 at a local monthly horse auction and he finished top ten in Open Cutting. Cutting is a sport dominated by the rich, most promising prospects from the big farms start at $40,000. Just goes to show there are good horses out there you just need to able to see them and the "spit" to make 'em shine.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I know exactly what you are saying- I do understand that price is NO guarantee of quality and that colts, really GOOD colts can be picked up cheap.

Maybe there is a good living in just going round and buying them up- doing virtually nothing except finding them- we do have people over here that do only that for Show Jumpers and Showing yards- just find the horses and charge a good finders fee and sell on, but, if you were seriously running a Cutting Horse business it is unlikely that you would have the time to go all over the country looking- I think that is where the price tag comes in as, if you were buying from someone who was selling horses with at least expectations of their becoming top class, they would obviously be charging a good amount.

I am really only playing "Devils Advocate" here as I have always found my horses in Killing Pens and back yards- and I could not have wished for better animals!!! I also paid meat price for them

:

 

[Sterling]

You did'nt have to say much....your horse proved it. :aktion033: What a beautiful horse!!!

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[Voodoo]

You know Rabbit I agree once again on what you said, the problem is that I haven't got the money to buy a $10,000 colt and take him to the top. It takes money to make money, but I'm still in a lower bracket because of the initial amount of money I have to spend. I do still feel that I buy quality horses, they just usually have a few "holes" that need filling before they are seasoned, safe, finished horses.

Marty I totally agree and that is exactly what I do with alot of these horses, most of the horses that I buy are rescues of a sort as their owner is headed to the killer ring with them. I buy them cheap, spend enough time that I am sure they are solid, safe, and exactly what I tell the buyer they are, then sell for a profit. I have turned down huge offers on some horses though because I have seen how the individual treats his horses and I would never knowingly put one of my horses into such hands. That all being said though, I might get into some of the higher dollar horses if I only had the money behind me, but hey you do with what you have. I was at least fortunate enough to have a father with the ability, and the time to teach me all he knew about horses

:

I do think Greg and I are still going to be friends, but we are going to have to be more careful with our words and our actions in the future

:

Thanks for all the compliments everyone and maybe I do have a brain in my head after all :lol:

 

[Marty]

Isn't Fizzy funny today? She is cracking me up totally.

You do have a brain child, and riding colts is not for everyone. Most people do not have the patience for it and I do admire you to keep on them until they are solid enough to sell. That is your gift. Don't let anyone take you down. You just do your thing the best way you know how and let your horses speak for themselves.

I learned a long time ago just to sit up here on my mountain on my little modest place and let the whole world revolve while I do my thing happily and honestly to the best of my capibilites with what I have. If that isn't good enough for anyone then I am sorry about that and they can move along because life is way too short to live it feeling inadequate. Take pride in what you have and what you do and don't try to compare yourself to anyone or their opertation. Just be you.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Oh Marty it's just the medication talking, I'm afraid.

Once I've had my pills I'm not only everybodies friend but absolutely ready to take on the world- I never have had any sense!!!

:

No sense + morphine based pain killers = a catastrophe waiting to happen

:

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[shane]

learned a long time ago just to sit up here on my mountain on my little modest place and let the whole world revolve while I do my thing happily and honestly to the best of my capibilites with what I have. If that isn't good enough for anyone then I am sorry about that and they can move along because life is way too short to live it feeling inadequate. Take pride in what you have and what you do and don't try to compare yourself to anyone or their opertation. Just be you oh marty i just love you !!!

: :aktion033: