Mouse Poision

[Jim Guerin]

Hi Again All,

Just thought I would give an Update on my two boys. They are doing very well.

Last Thursday, I called Dells where I bought the mouse / rat bait, and asked them if there was any web site or phone # on the pkg. Mary went and looked, and said that there wasn't, but it was Mfg for Farnam Co. Inc. I did a search and found the MSDS for the bait. Farnam has a BUNCH of MSDS listed, I looked down and found the stuff I had.

At the top of each sheet is a 24 / 7 emergency phone # to call with questions. I called and the person that answered the phone couldn't answer my questions, but put me thru to the voice mail of a technical person. She called me back in about half hour or so, and I told her what happened. She asked about how much was eaten, I gave a WAG of 3/4 lb. between the two of them. She asked how much Red weighted, and I told her 77 lbs. She done some cypherin

and said he would have had to eat about 7 lbs of it to really do any damage. I said that then Macho would have had to eat about 20 lbs. She asked what he weighed, I gave her a WAG of about 400 lbs. she said he would have had to eat about 40 lbs. She said that symptoms would be evident in 72 hours.

The size diff between a rat or mouse, and Red and Macho, it might not hurt them. While I was talking to the gal at Dells, she mentioned that her dog got into the same stuff a few months ago. Evidently she didn't think enough of him to take him to the vet, but did dump a couple bottles of Hydrogen peroxide down him. She said he never did heave it up, but did pass it pretty much in whole chunks.

So, Size does matter!!!!!!!!!!!!

I will still keep an eye on them, but do feel a bit better.

Jim Guerin

Hi All,

Below is what happened this past Sunday. I need thoughts as to what the possiblilies are that Macho ate the stuff. Yes, I know always the possibility...

About 6:20 Sunday evening, I decided it was time to feed the kids. I was heading back to the house to wash my hands, when I seen something on the ground outside my pumphouse. It looked like something had torn up and eaten a bag of bred or something. I couldn't remember leaving any thing like that out so Red could get to it... I went and looked at it. It was a package of the rat / mouse bait, in the bar form!!!!!!!!! It had been in the PH for five weeks, I had taken one piece out and folded the wrapper, then stuck it inside another plastic bag, and folded the top down. Red got it out and ate it!!!!!!!!!!!!! Off to the emergency vets. While I was there, I asked if they thought my mini stallion would eat what was still on the ground ( I had him out in the yard for the day ) they didn't know as they were not large animal vets, but thought he wouldn't. While at the vet, I tried to call a friend that I knew Macho liked, he let her walk up to him and even brush him. Got a busy sig several times. Then the vet came out to talk to me, tell me what was going on, Red hadn't vomited yet, and he said I could take him home if he didn't. I said I would wait for a bit longer. He said he would write up everything and give me a cy. I tried the friends again, got their machine. Told them that I had a huge favor, but since they weren't home, thanks anyway. While I was paying the bill, the phone rang, and it was them. Jimmy had tracked me down!! I hadn't left a number. I told him what had happened, and that I had wanted them to put Macho back in his yard. Now, at this time, he had access to the bait for nearly an hour and a half. He said that he and Bobbie would come her to the farm and put Macho up.

I get home ( dark out ) and parked so I could use the lites, found a sheet of plywood and lugged it over to the spot. Couldn't find any thing... Got my flash lite and on the way to feed, checked the ground. Only found one large piece, and a few crumbs. Got to the barn, and called Jimmie and Bobbie. B answered, and I asked if they had picked up the stuff. Bobbie said they couldn't find any.......... I called my horse vet and told him what was going on. He said that he thought Macho would be ok till tomorrow, and I could save the emergency call, he or Terry could come out tomorrow and give Macho a vit K shot. I told him I wanted him to come out. I will make an app in the morning...

--

I did make the appointment for the vet to come out. I asked him if he thought blood should be drawn, he said no. He gave him a Vit K shot, and said he would be ok, and left. I did ask about giving him activated charcoal. I think he said it was to late, and said it was by body weight, and if a dog got a cup, how much would a horse get, a gallon? ( a retorical question ) My next thought, how would I get it in him...

Now if Red has to take 100 mg of K a day, my thinking is shouldnt Macho...

I took Red to my reg vet, and asked him what he thought. ( he was a race track vet for many years, so knows horses ) He said he had no idea, as he had never heard of a horse eating mouse poision.

Red is still at the vets. I had Doc look at his ear and he found a couple hairs and a little deeper, seen a grass seed. So he has to knock him out to get them out. I will go and get him in a few hours.

With every thing that has happened over the past six months, almost two months to the day between, I dont know if I could take another loss. On 11 May, I had to send my Rottie girl, Jackie to the bridge. 12 July, I had to send one of my donk girls, Roseta, to the bridge. 14 Sept, my brother Mike, 53, died of a massive heart attack. Then what happened this past Sunday, I am not sure I have a nerve left that isnt streatched to the max.

I dont know if Macho would eat the stuff. If he didnt eat it, I have no idea who or what got it. What I do know, the area where it was, was very clean, save for one larger piece, and a few crumbs. I got the shop vac out and got them.

Thanks.

Jim Guerin

 

[ClickMini]

Jim, so sorry to hear of all of your troubles, I have had a year myself, sometimes it seems when it rains it pours!!! Sounds like your little Macho got lucky, but I can sure understand your worry!!!

Here's hoping that Red and the rest of your gang come through just fine, get some kitties to take care of mice so you can skip the poison.

(((((HUGS)))))

 

[Loess Hills]

So sorry about your experiences, and hope everyone will be all right.

It just is not safe to use any kind of mice or rat poison around animals. The mice can distribute the poison where it was never intended to go......like a bale of hay or in an area where the horses can get at it. This actually happened to some friends and their filly ended up bleeding internally and eventually died. Have also heard of a poisoned mouse falling in a water bucket that a horse drank from......the poison in the water killed the horse.

Cats are a great alternative to poison! We also will set some mice traps baited with peanut butter at night in the section of the barn where we keep feed. Horses are in their stalls so they can't bother the trap. We"ll get a mouse each time because they cannot resist peanut butter. Pretty soon no more mice! At least, for awhile!

 

[liltnt]

Yes I would say they would eat it and there are two types of poison in it one is arsnic I believe and the other is a blood tinner of a sort and can cause them to bleed to death internally. I had my dogs get some about a year ago and is very scarey. They do but grain in it as the rats are attracted to the grain.

3

Dont mean to scare you but.... you should take the package to the vet and he can tell you what type you are dealing with. My dogs got the kind that makes them bleed and had to take vitimin K I think it was for 14 days. you have to watch their eyes and stomachs for bleeding. just in case. They also were made to throw up which I know is not possible with a horse but would imagine charcoal would be something to use with a horse. To absorb it.

sorry didnt real all of your post but it scared me immediately

 

[Jim Guerin]

Thank you for your thoughts and kind words.

A little clarification:

I didnt put out the bait. I had bought it for a rental, used about a half stick. I prefer to put out a few grains of feed, and hold a hammer over them and drop it on em instead. ( I have gotten three or four that way! ) The rest was still in the package. I had that package inside another plastic bag, folded over. It was in my pumphouse, the door was open, like it has been off and on for the past five weeks since I finished the rental. I have squirels and chipmonks around here, which I like, so would not put any thing out that would harm them.

As for cats, there are close to half dozen running wild around here, doesnt seem to faze the mice any. Red has gotten two mice in the last couple weeks. He is better at it than the cats!!

And, he *loves* cats too, just like my Rotten Furkid, Jackie loved them. All the cats can do is pee in the barn!!

When I took Red to the Emergency vet Sunday, I did take the pkg in with me. It is the Cumidin (sp) blood thinner stuff that is in it.

Jim Guerin

 

[MountainViewMiniatures]

Keeping Red and you in my thoughts and prayers! Must have been an awful experience especially in light of the year you have been having.

I had a friend that had mice and then got rats when the dump he lived near closed . He got rid of them out by taking the 5 gal white pails (that taping compound comes in), filling them 1/2 with water, then put oats in. The oats floated on top of the water. He placed these in the feed room and barn alleyway. The rodents would jump in for the oats and drown. He had tried traps and peanut butter but they just kept snapping the traps and eating the pb!

 

[justaboutgeese]

We put out poison in a weighted dish , actually a pie plate with a flat stone in it. The rodents cannot dump it or carry it off. It only takes one day. Put more down the second day and if its not touched the job is done. Repeat a week later. The bottom line is that if its touched repeat it. Then we just repeat once every four or six weeks. Poison is not placed where the other animals can get at it. I lock the building and pickup the poison in the morning when its reopened. We store it in the house so there is no chance of it getting found in the outbuildings when its not in use.

 

[wildoak]

Sorry for your troubles, hope your guys are all okay.

justaboutgeese, my only concern with using poison even in a safe place would be the possibility of cats or dogs biting into a poisoned mouse/rat. We have a neighbor who leaves poison out in his shed (no livestock) where anything can get in, and I think we have lost a cat or two that way. No proof, but they were hanging out on his side of the fence frequently before they vanished.

Jan