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Is Sabino a Pinto Gene???

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Jacquee'

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OK. I am trying hard to learn color genetics, because we all want those really beautiful and colorful babies - right?
So! I am trying to learn about Sabino. (One gene at a time!) Is sabino considered a pinto gene? I have heard Yes and I have heard No. Does anyone here know the real answer?? And THANKS!!!!
 

Songcatcher

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The answer to your question really causes a lot of debate sometimes. In the U.S. Sabino is often considered a pinto gene while in some other contries it is not. Sabino can cause face white, leg white, or roaning throughout the body to different degrees from almost unnoticable to solid white. The way it has been explained to me is that Sabino often enhances other pinto markings.

Here is a link to an article on basic colors and patterns.

Horse Color Genetics 101

It has links to other sites as well that are much more detailed.

Jacquee said:
OK. I am trying hard to learn color genetics, because we all want those really beautiful and colorful babies - right? 
So! I am trying to learn about Sabino. (One gene at a time!) Is sabino considered a pinto gene? I have heard Yes and I have heard No. Does anyone here know the real answer?? And THANKS!!!! 

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lilhorseladie

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Good question...I just got this great book for my birthday on Saturday...Horse Color Explained by Jenette Gower. "Large white sabino markings, sufficient to qualify as a pinto, can occur in any breed. In breets which disallow the registration of such horses, the spontaneous occurrence of full blown pinto markings is known as a crop-out." So...that really doesn't answer the question does it? I think it depends on what is acceptable for the breed.
 

appypintolady

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I have been doing alot of reading on the Sabino gene and they say it is linked to the Overo gene. It has been quite a topic of discussion on the Appaloosa Project Forum because Sheila Arcehr (the moderator) is of the opinion that the Sabino gene is a white patterning "helper" for small white blankets in an appy breeding program. From the reading I have done, I would say that it is indeed a Pinto gene.
 

lyn_j

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[SIZE=14pt]I had a purebred arab mare with enough white and roaning to get pinto papers. Her white on her legs came WAY above hocks and knees and she had a belly spot and white under her jaw and neck. There is not pinto paterns in purebred arabs EXCEPT for the sabino factor. She was marked like a Clidesdale ony chestnut.[/SIZE]

Lyn
 

hhpminis

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I have been involved in converstaions about this and have heard all sides of it. I really think the answer is, no one is sure. LOL

But for what it is worth here is my opinion on the matter. If it is not a gene, then why are Clydesdales all marked that way??????
 

rabbitsfizz

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Over here, most definitely NOT
Sabino is in most horse breeds- TB Arab etc and it is responsible for "normal" white markings on all horses and ponies with a few exceptions (Icelandic do not have Sabino, I believe, Lewella and I disagree on whether or not Native Shetlands have Sabino
) It is definitely a gene- a many faceted gene, that occurs in different ways in different horses and generations of horse. From the same breeding I have had:- TB type Bay with minimal markings, Splashy - flashy Palomino with high white, Full Sabino with belly splash , white over knee, bald face, spots in jowl, the whole nine yards!! This was from two Sabinos. Unless encouraged to express it usually stays fairly minimal, when added to another pattern, especially Splash or Frame, it tends to go potty!
It is no more related to the Overo pattern (ie Frame) than is Tobiano- all three patterns ( Splash, Frame and Sabino) that are lumped together as "Overo" are quite separate genetically and no closer linked to each other than is Tobiano!! I have seen Appaloosa- the breed not the pattern- with white socks not described as Pintaloosa- in fact the person went potty when this was pointed out. Apparently the Appaloosa Society does not "count" leg/face white- this may be the cause of the apparent link with Pinto patterns in some Appy patterns. Over here no white markings or Pinto breeding is allowed.
 

Jacquee'

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OK, thanks guys. I think this clears up the confusion. The people I heard say that sabino WAS a pinto gene were American; and the people who said it was NOT a pinto gene, were from other countries. The American even posted a pic of a horse from (I think) Puerto Rico that sure looked pinto to me, but they all said it was sabino and therefore not "really" pinto. The horse had a spot on it's side the size of a dinner plate, as well as high whites and a blaze. So this got me curious about sabino, and how people thought of it, since I really hope a little mare of mine has sabino. She does not have the typical spot under the chin but DOES have a very broad blaze and 2 blue eyes. If she should have a foal that looked like the horse from PR I would be very happy indeed. Thanks again!
 

Sarah

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Sometimes referring to Sabino as a "pinto" gene causes more confusion than anything else, especially when it expresses very minimally or occurs in breeds which do not have "pintos". I usually try to refer to it as a "white marking gene", don't know if that makes it any less confusing but when you get down to the nuts & bolts of all the "pinto" genes, that's all they really are - genes that make white markings. Sometimes these genes make enough white markings for the horse to be considered "pinto" and sometimes they don't, but the expression of the white doesn't change the on/off presence of the gene.
 

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