Cart/Harness fit question

[MagicTheMini]

For Christmas I got a new harness! Well, I guess it was for Magic. He got the camptown mini harness with the freedom collar and the sliding backband. He really seems to like it. I have found that the shafts of the cart like to float around in the loops. With my old harness I had the wrap straps that held them steady. I had the loops set pretty high and the shafts were floating. Today in my lesson we lowered the loops and they were still floating about the same height. The seat on my cart is not adjustable. Is there a way to fix this? Should I worry about it? I have some pictures of the setup. Feel free to comment on anything...

Here is Magic working on 3/16 (I have raised my breeching since then...)

And here he is today 3/24

 

[Sue_C.]

The cart looks unbalanced to me. The seat is tilting back although the shafts are almost at the level. This is putting a lot of the weight on your horse'sgirth, instead of his back where the tree and padding of the back saddle would help decrease the workload. BTW, I am so very jealous of your harnss. As soon as I can afford the extra, I am getting one myself.

A better sitting position will make a huge difference too. Try rocking yourself forward just a tad, putting more pressure on your pevic bones and feet, rather than the back of your bum. In doing so, that will take your back off the back rest, and sit you up straight, almost the same as if you were "perched" on an english saddle. This will also help your posture, and save you a sore back in the long run, as well as making it a lot easier on the horse.

I really think the only thing that is going to really make THE difference, is a better made, better balanced cart...but I think you can certainly make do with this one if you try what I suggested.

 

[MiLo Minis]

I am going to say that, although this carts 'looks' to be imbalanced, the fact that the shafts are 'floating' (and not rising up and staying up or down) in the loops tells me it is in perfect balance putting very little weight on the horse or harness which is exactly what you want. I like the position of your shafts much better since you lowered the tugs. The seat on your cart is tilted back for some reason (perhaps had to be when it was constructed to achieve the balance you have) If, as Sue suggested, you fix your body position (your back should never be touching the back rest) you will be more comfortable and look nicer but that seat really should be levelled up some or get another cart as I think with the tilt in the seat it will never be a truly comfortable cart for you. I bet you will find that if you do sit properly you won't get that same floating effect with the shafts.

Depending on the type of driving you are doing your breeching is okay in either position. For the flat the higher position, kind of inline with your shafts is fine. For hill work or CDE the slightly lower position (maybe not quite so low as you had it) would be more appropriate as it would prevent the breeching from riding up on the downhill stretches.

Your horse looks more relaxed, confidant and happy in the second photo!!!

 

[MagicTheMini]

Thanks for the replies! The cart is much better balanced then it used to be since I added the larger wheels. It is very horribly uncomfortable. The shafts don't seem to put weight on the horse and Magic seems to like to work (and he loves his harness).

He does look much happier in the second picture. In the first picture he is pulling up a hill. It was our first time outside in a long while, so I wasn't really asking much of him except to move forward and behave.

Thanks again!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Magic looks great! Your harness is fairly well adjusted and he looks super.

Have you tried dropping the tug loops one more notch to see what happens to the balance when the shafts are horizontal? The flatter we can get that seat, the more comfortable you're likely to be. I see that the basket is way too narrow front-to-back for someone of your leg length but you might experiment with putting one foot forward on the angled part of the basket and the other one flat on the floor. Sit up nice and tall and don't lean on the backrest and see what happens. It still won't be comfortable, but hey! *LOL*

Can you have a local welder add some sort of seat extension to raise the seat and set it level?

You've got the bridle and breastcollar PERFECT, I wouldn't mess with them one little bit. The saddle could maybe go a tad further back and somewhere in between the two breeching settings might be best. The lower the shafts are, the easier it will be to get the breeching right too. It would also be easier if you could get a new set of footman's loops welded in the proper position on the shaft instead of having to wrap the holdbacks so far forward. That's a real pain on some of those older carts!

Congratulations on all your new gear and it's nice to see one of my favorite guys again. Keep posting!

Leia

 

[MagicTheMini]

Thanks! I can't drop the loops any more bacause they are on the lowest hole. I also think the saddle shouls be furthur back. That is where it seems to like to sit, should I make it be back more. It does tilt back a bit, but not too much. I need to get a new pad for it, the one I have it very thick and not wide enough. Any reccomedations?

The cart is better since I added the larger wheels. It had 20" but I upgraded to 26"s and it is better. When talking to my trainer, I realized all my stuff is about 8 years old. I think its time to get new stuff. I figured it was better for my horse to be comfortable, so he got his harness first. Next, is the new cart! which will hopefully come soon. I am hoping by the end of summer!

It was suggested that the traces be let out a little longer. I think they look right. Thoughts?

Also, how do I clean my harness? I think its betathane.

Thanks!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Thanks! I can't drop the loops any more bacause they are on the lowest hole. I also think the saddle shouls be furthur back. That is where it seems to like to sit, should I make it be back more. It does tilt back a bit, but not too much. I need to get a new pad for it, the one I have it very thick and not wide enough. Any reccomedations?

These saddles really don't need any padding at all, I only use one to keep the saddle clean. If you use a thin pad like the Camptown Pillow Pad the saddle will sit lower and flatter and you'll be able to put it back a bit easier I think.

It was suggested that the traces be let out a little longer. I think they look right. Thoughts?

They look good to me.

Also, how do I clean my harness? I think its betathane.

You can dunk the whole thing in a bucket of diluted Murphy's Oil Soap and scrub it with a rag, then wipe it dry. Baby wipes also work but are more time consuming and don't get in the cracks as well.

Leia

 

[shorthorsemom]

Could somebody explain the sliding backband to me please, photo would help, but never heard the term, but maybe if I know what it is I can relate to my current harness shopping. I am on a harness hunt. Scared to make the leap yet, but am gathering as much info while I am shopping. I am working toward cross country driving, possibly CDE in future. thanks

 

[MiLo Minis]

Rather than the tugs being fixed to the saddle they are attached to each other with a strap that slides through the backband of the saddle. This allows the tugs to even themselves out when you are on uneven ground such as going across the side of a hill. It takes some of the stress off the saddle and therefore the horses back. It was originally developed for the wide saddled harness of a gig which is a very heavy vehicle.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Rather than the tugs being fixed to the saddle they are attached to each other with a strap that slides through the backband of the saddle.

Or rather, instead of being two separate straps the tug billets are one strap (a "backband") that runs through a channel on the saddle. The backband slides from side to side to match the pull of the shafts and so evens out any pressure on the horse's back. Very good for hillwork! And hence the term "sliding backband."

Do a search on the forum, you'll find a lot more references to it and detailed explanations.

Leia

 

[MiLo Minis]

Gee Leia....I almost thought that was what I said!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Well, almost! The tugs aren't attached by a strap, they ARE one strap in this case and they don't slide through the backband, they ARE the backband! *LOL* Just wanted to clarify!

If you use "tug" to mean "shaft loop," which people sometimes do, then you're correct but then they aren't normally fixed to the saddle either.

Leia

 

[shorthorsemom]

Thanks for your information on sliding backbands. And the clarification on tugs. My trainer does call the loop holes tugs so I was getting confused. Now I need to find some harness and make a decision. thanks again a bunch.

 

[MiLo Minis]

Well, almost! The tugs aren't attached by a strap, they ARE one strap in this case and they don't slide through the backband, they ARE the backband! *LOL* Just wanted to clarify!
If you use "tug" to mean "shaft loop," which people sometimes do, then you're correct but then they aren't normally fixed to the saddle either.

Leia

Or you could say the tugs or shaft loops, as some people refer to them, are normally attached to a tug strap which is fixed to the saddle to be totally clear but in this case is attached to a strap that slides through the saddle and so yes it becomes a backband but then there is the back strap which is what the crouper is attached to and you don't want to get too confusing!

I have always said that harness parts need to be labelled and given out worldwide so we all call them the same thing.