Anybody here use an AV

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hhpminis

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I have been searching the web for a site about miniature AI. My vet and I were talking and we would really like to be able to collect semen. I cannot find anyting on a miniature AV unit. Anyone have one? Where did you get it, did you make it, or do you have a picture?
 
You can PM me- it is all a little "risqué" for a public Forum- I made mine, you see!!
 
My repro vet suggested using an exam glove like a condom on the stallion. You need to be close by though to grab it as soon as he dismounts the mare. And no....we haven't tried that.
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Got mine about 10 yrs ago. Have used it quite a bit as I used to stand to outside mares and I collected each stallion for semen testing beginning of season and so on. You order the "pony" size and I got everything that was needed to even collect and ship semen (didn't do that). Plus a wonderful book which tells you more than you want to know about it :lol: but, very good!

It's been easy to use, very effective. I used a ready mare and when he mounted, I diverted stallion to the device. He was fine, mare was somewhat frustrated
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: And, I have AI'd a couple mares who seemed to not catch with natural cover due to some odd cervical structure, etc.

Animal Reproduction Systems

14395 Ramona Ave

Chino, CA 91710 (909) 597-4889

www.ARSSales.com

Don't have the invoice close but, seems it was in the range of $450. There is a picture of the "kit" you receive and of course, you can purchase all the separate parts as needed.
 
When I was taking Equine Science years ago - in the Reproductive Physiology (as in - everything to do with breeding) class we conducted a study with minis - and collected the stallions to chart semen quality. They used the type of AV that is used to collect bulls... smaller and easier to handle... and once the mini boys got used to it they continued to approach their job with great enthusiasm.
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There are several brands avalible. We use the CSU model (duh, since we ARE CSU), I own a Missouri modle. We have an even smaller one (both the CSU and the Missouri are the same diameter of the full sized AV's) which we use for all of the minis we get in to collect (one in the past year, hehe). I have no idea where they bought it...
 
At the clinic we've used the Missouri AV (both for the very small and very large stallions!) and also an old broken Colorado AV that's been sawed off so that it's not as long and will fit underneath.
 
I got a catalog from my veterinarian called Har-Vet. They sell all kinds of equine veterinary things, including a miniature A/V. Item # 17026, Mini A/V complete for ponies and miniature stallions. $156.45.

Har-Vet.com or 1-800-872-7741.

Never collected a horse but saw it done on TV a few times. I think it was on Filthy Rich Cattle Drive. Lou Ferrigno's (The Hulk) daughter had to do it and wasn't very happy about it. :risa8:

I have collected a Saint Bernard before for ICSB sperm banking, but that is another story.
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Daryl
 
i dont' remember where i saw it on what web page..but there is a new MEDICATION you can give them and you hang a cup or baggie off them and they will masterbate themselves... No AV or collection equiptment needed!! it all sounded quite intresting andi thin when i broke it down pricewise it was quite cheap for mini.

Let me look around and see if i still have the link. it was very intresting to me and i thought it would be worth looking into more!

AHH HA..i found it! i knew i saved it on my links somewhere! lol

guess it's called "chemical ejaculation technique"

http://www.atlantaequine.com/pages/client_lib_ChemEjac.html
 
ok according to my math (admittedly not very good at math) it could be wrong but i think i figured for a 200lbs mini you'd need 4-8 of the tablets at $0.35 each (oryou can buy in bulk ) which would make those tablets only $2.80 per ejaculation and i'm not sure how to breakdown the CC but we all know that a CC isnt' very much and it was only $5.00 for a CC. so that would make the total ejaculatation once less than $7.80.. pretty cheap and probably alot cheaper than buying a phantom ect! lol though it does say it doesn't always work on every stallion but that you can adjust levels on some to make it work.... heck..for that price..might be worth giving it a try! lol

facinating isn't it?!?!
 
Chemical ejaculation doesn't involve masterbation, or even an erection. Its also 30% reliable. What you do is dose them with a drug called Imipramine, a human anti-depressant (also an anti-bedwetting drug). That lowers their ejaculation threshhold, allowing less internal stimulization to cause an ejaculation. This is in pill form, the injectable doesn't work. Then you wait an hour or two. In a QUIET and peaceful place, you then give them an IV dose of Detomadine (Xylazine will do the same, but its even less reliable). As they cross into sedation (as the head drops) or as they come out of sedation (as they wake up) they MAY drop a few inches and release a few spurts of concentrated spermatozoa.

Generally this is a last ditch effort for a stallion that is otherwise unable to breed, either through lack of interest, injury preventing him from live covering, mounting a phantom, or ground collecting. It requires a perscription for imipramine (which ain't cheap) and a vet willing to sell you detomadine (at $24/ml) and also requires that the handler know how to give an IV shot. Its VERY unreliable, about 33%.

Sue McDonnald our of the Penn State New Boulton Center is the one that pioneered this technique. Her journal articles detailing this process (as well as some very interesting stallion behavioral papers) are avalible from their website.

Boinky, its three hours of your time, 30 minutes on your hands and knees holding a cup under their sheath (because if you bump them they loose concentration), the perscription drug (which isn't very cheap, 0.35 a pill sounds too low) plus an IV injection of one of the most expensive sedatives avalible... it adds up and is very inconvienent. I've spent hours under stallions trying to get a collection from chemical ejaculation, its not easy and uses a LOT of patience. Stick to the AV, you'll find your time and money far better spent.
 
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Wooooweeee, Nathan -- thanks for that input
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: Ain't gonna try that one! :bgrin I can assure you that the AV I have is a far better deal for everyone . Well, except the mare, maybe. But I really do appreciate the details of the procedure. It's nice to know exactly what's involved & correctly done. Thanks.

Honestly the AV's been easy to use and the stallions co-operate nicely with using a mare -- hey, enthusiastically! If you follow directions and take the necessary precautions, easy job.

By the way, the paperback magazine/book that is in the kit I got is from CSU !! "Bulletin#3" Procedures for collection, evaluation and utilization of stallion semen for artificial insemination.....dedicated to Robert C Norris. So you have probably seen that around "the shop" :bgrin

The $156. price sounds pretty affordable for most -- especially if the have a couple stallions to keep checked.
 
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This is a very timely topic for me and I have a few questions of my own if the original poster will please forgive me for butting in. A neighbor down the road asked me if I AI'd. I said I didn't think the registry allowed it (which that is my first question -do they? I looked in the rule book and couldn't find that info) He wants to breed his Clydesdale mare and I don't think we could dig a deep enough ditch to put her in for my guy to reach and I wouldn't want to chance him falling of and into the ditch anyway :new_shocked: So he just wondered if I would give AI a try. I told him I'd check into it at least. I guess a friend of his is crossing minis to clydes and the offspring back to Hackney I think he said. She is getting what look like miniature Clydes. Anyway, I would love to hear any advice on AI and it's difficulties etc. You can pm me if you don't want to get of this posters topic. Would love to hear from those of you with lots of experience as I have a friend who has Arabs and I'd love to AI my Arab mare with him and it would be great if we could collect ourselves as none of the local vets collect - they only inseminate. Thanks in advance. Great topic!!!!
 
I also have a stallion repro question. When collecting a stallion for a fertility testing, does the collection sample need to maintain a specific temp? What steps are taken in having a stalliong tested for fertility(sperm/motility) count?

I am not even sure if my vet does such a thing, but would the sample ne4ed to be shipped away to a lab for such a thing?
 
Both of you would benifit greatly from a reproductive short course... many state universities offer them including CSU (where I work...
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so I there is some self-interest in there as well).

As far as the actual AI on the mare's side, its very easy with the proper restraint (you want to insert your arm into an uninterested mare?). Wash her with Ivory, put on a sterile glove with a little sterile lube, insert your hand, guide a sterile pipette through her cervix, deposit semen, come out, all done
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As far as the collection, that requires a little more effort, training, and equipment. Worst case you can bring your stallion to a breeding facility and they can handle it for you. There is a lot of very pricy equipment needed, starting with a good microscope, warmplate/incubator, and hemocytometer. Together that's $500-2000. Add in all the mechanized fancy equipment and that price shoots up to $5000. That equipment is needed to keep the semen and everything that touches the semen warm, count the concentration, and look at the motility. If you only do one or two artificial breedings, its far simpler to go to a local breeding facility to handle it for you. Just pass the fees on to the mare owner; they should expect it.

As far as fertility testing, there is only one way to do that: breed mares. We can ESTIMATE fertility, but there is no other way to test it other than test breeding. As far as evaluating semen, I will try to give you a basic overview of what we do for every stallion we collect.

1) Bring the av into the wash room, take off the protective cover, and remove the gel fraction from the ejaculate. Pour the semen into a warmed graduated cylinder and measure the gel-free volume. Any live sample of semen needs to be kept at body temperature until its extended with a semen extender (they don't just ship semen, it MUST be "extended" in a medium that protects the cells, feeds them, buffers waste, and protects from temperature changes.)

2) Measure concentration of the sperm. You can use a hemacytometer to physically count it on a microscope (hemacytometer = $100 or so, reusable, takes upwards of 10 minutes of work) or use a densimeter to use light to measure the concentration ($1500-2500, takes about 30 seconds).

3) Dilute the sample to about 50 million cells per ml, and estimate total and progressive motility on a microscope.

There are also other things we can do in a research setting for stallions that present with symptoms of infertility.

4) Flow cytometer: uses florescent stains and a laser to measure a variety of parameters, including live/dead (are they dead, or just not moving?), mitochondira (is their energy souce any good?), membrane fluidity, etc.

5) Morphology: we do this for every breeding soundness exam; stains the sperm cells and then look under a high power microscope to examine the cells for defects like broken tails, cytoplasmic droplets, etc. There are also even better microscopes that can see pitting on the sperm heads, and even more powerful electron microscopes that can examine DNA, organelles, etc.

There are a lot of other things as well, I just don't do them often enough to know
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Yes, you can send a sample to a lab for some of those things, morphology especially. If you aren't very close then some of the other things aren't really possible, but most are
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If you can get your stallion to a reproduction clinic where they can ship the semen to a lab that'd work too. What exactly are you looking to measure/test/evaluate?
 
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