Any "Brown" horses out there

[Miniequine]

Miniequine, I can tell you don't like that mud colored horse so it would be ok if you just shipped her on out here to Oklahoma.

I have room for 'mud'.

Charlotte

Hi Charlotte... hehehe I hate to be this way.. but she is one of those"special" ones.... mudd and all

)

and she just loves me.. follows me around like a puppy dog.

)

Charly is what I was taught to call a seal brown. Love that color.

Izzy looks smokey black ??

and I had a bay Welsh pony... jet black mane and tail and black points .. no black at all on legs!

told that is called Wild Bay

Rabbit.. So, Brown is shown by attaching t to the Agouti indicator, thus At.

So.. if she's brown,, she will test positive for agouti?.

you're right... complicated!

Here is a photo of Panda after first clip last spring and a pic from a couple weeks ago... and FAT!

she never quite looses that mudd color... funny

 

[Miniv]

Your Panda is VERY pretty. I'd take her home too!

We had a "brown" pinto mare (have since sold her). We also owned her full brother, who we gelded. All I can tell you about the mare is that her color proved to be a dilute! Her brother was obviously a buckskin pinto and since they were FULL siblings, she was obviously also carrying the same dilute gene....... We crossed her with our silver bay stallion several years ago (Raider was wrongly registered as a chestnut because of his bright copper color)......and the result was PINK!!!

Yep, the colt was palomino, but at the time we didn't realize that many palomino foals look either pink or peach colored at birth. Anyway, for us -- the brown was hiding the cream gene.

 

[jsites]

Oh Sandy, Your Panda is gorgeous no matter what color she is!

Maybe she would like to come to WV and be Safari's girlfriend...lol

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Yes, if she is Brown she will test positive for Agouti, then if you have her tested for |Brown she will show up as At on the Agouti extension.......

I can find the name of the site that tests for At if you would like?

 

[Miniequine]

Yes, if she is Brown she will test positive for Agouti, then if you have her tested for |Brown she will show up as At on the Agouti extension.......I can find the name of the site that tests for At if you would like?

oh... interesting! sure.. Please let me know.

so.. if she's brown.. does that mean she can produce bay?

 

[Katiean]

My mare that had the mouse brown legs was a very red bay and her mane and tail were jet black. She also had very BLACK lacing on her ears and around her muzzle. I have never seen a silver bay that dark. Not to say she wasn't. When she was bred to a black bay she foaled a chestnut like her sisters.

 

[Sandee]

Brown has always been such a boring color to me but as I have acquired a couple now, I can see that not all "brown" is equal! I have a bay pinto that has 4 white stockings but with the ermine marks on all four feet. She also shows a roaning over her back when clipped between the white spot and the tail and has the mealy look around her muzzle.

My second "brown" is listed as a seal brown on his papers and this is not a good picture (the flash shows him as much redder than he is). He has the typical mealy brown around the muzzle and at the joint area of his hind legs (where the leg and body join). Other than that he is very dark to look almost black.

 

[Miniequine]

The agouti test came back negative.

She is black. No cream, no bay

she is a real funny black I guess

 

[Lewella]

Michal at Pet DNA Services of AZ does Brown testing. Michal developed the test and with the recent expansion of his lab and other commitments has not had time to publish. (A much larger question on publishing must be why has UC Davis not published Pearl after several years of offering the test...but I digress...) The test is very reliable and has been used extensively by the ICHR to determine shades on Champagnes that tested to have an "A" but that were not phenotypical Amber Champagnes. It has also been extremely helpful in diagnosing some of the more unusual shades of silver. The AQHA stallion Champs Guthrie is an excellent example of Brown Silver. (www.silverequine.com)

Brown doesn't "attach" to agouti - it is one of the FOUR options at the Agouti locus.

The standard Agouti test only tests for "a" and all other results are defulted as A even if they are really At (brown) or A+ (wild bay). A is dominant to At which is dominant to a - it is not currently known where A+ fits in the scheme as no test has yet been developed for the A+ gene.

When the standard Agouti test was developed they were trying to determine if Sponenbergs theory that Brown is black + pangare was correct or if the older (and then fallen out of favor theory) that Brown was a separate gene at Agouti was. The horses used to develop the test for "a" were phenotypical Seal Brown horses (Seal Brown and Brown are used interchangably when discussing the Brown agouti gene).

Brown based horses will generally have lighter "soft parts" such as the muzzle, around the eyes, and at the elbows, groin, etc. The phenotype can vary from a dark bay to nearly black though and in some cases the only way to tell is by genetic testing.

If a horse tests "aa" using the standard Agouti test then the horse cannot genetically be a Brown and its color is the result of another genetic combination. Fading blacks and light shades of black (yes, black does have different shades too!) are often mistaken for Brown but will test "aa".

Lewella

 

[Miniv]

THANK YOU LEWELLA!!!!

Your post needs to be PINNED.

Question -- What is Pearl?

Ma---

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Wow, before reading this post I thought brown wasn't possible and they were just varying colors of black or bay horses. Very, very interesting indeed.

 

[Lewella]

THANK YOU LEWELLA!!!!
Your post needs to be PINNED.

Question -- What is Pearl?

Ma---

Pearl is a gene that is believed to be a variation of the Cream gene that when combined with Cream creates a psudo-champagne phenotype (we don't now a 100% sure though that it is a Cream variation since UC Davis has been sitting on the research and not publishing for YEARS - but all the production evidence supports this theory). So far it is known to exist in Andalusians, Lusitanos, APHA Paints (Barlink Macho Man descendants - which is where it was first documented and was intially referred to as Barlink factor or Barlink dilution), Gypsy Cobs, Gypsy Vanners, and Irish Cobs. I expect there are a few I'm missing but since Champagne has been found in miniatures (and it is not native to any of the pony breeds so had to have been bred down) I expect at some point we are going to find Pearl in minis also. The website http://www.newdilutions.com has some good info on and pictures of Pearl dilutes.