Another leading question

[MyMiniGal]

Yes, it is me again....I told you all I would be asking a lot of questions, due to my trainer is down for awhile. LOL Anyway, I went and bought myself a whip the other day. I guess it is a short driving or dressage whip, 48" long. I plan on practicing on having it in my left hand so I can reach back and give Halo a tap, if she stalls. But I have another issue that has happened too with her. When we get closer to her paddock, on the walk back, she starts going faster and trying to get farther ahead of me. When she has done that, in the past, I usually have said "whoa" and made her stop, so hopefully, she realizes I am in charge on how fast we are going and that she needs to stay with me. Should I continue to stop her in that manner, or should I do something else, like possibly tapping her with the whip on her chest, to slow her down?

 

[targetsmom]

She wants to get back to the barn... If I had a horse do this when trail riding, I would turn them around and walk them back the way they came at least as long as the distance that they were rushing. Turn them back toward the barn and try again and keep doing this until they get the message. The first time you may have to wear a path going back and forth but they should get the message this way.

 

[MyMiniGal]

Ok, so just like I trained my dog, that use to do that when he wanted to go someplace or when he would see our house and start rushing. I would turn and walk the other way, over and over again, until he stopped. This makes sense to me and am use to training that way. Thank you!!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

If you have the time I would definitely do the turn around method- it takes longer but is very gentle on the horse and, IMO, works the best of all. The horse learns, at it's own speed, and it is non-confrontational, which I love. She pulls, she gets nowhere, I love it!!

 

[MyMiniGal]

I love the sounds of it too! We will be heading there today, and I will give all of this a try.

 

[FurstPlaceMiniatures]

My guy learned if he tried to run away with me or go faster, he went backwards a good 30 ftat a trot pace and I was NOT polite about it . That generally works in any resppect kind of situation. Worked wonders on the OTTBs I handled too who thought it was OK to trot sideways to the pasture ( who were the bane of my existence). That behavior should not be tolerated ever. Even if you spook for a legit reason, it better not be on top of me.

 

[Minimor]

Personally I have no use for the running the horse backwards form of 'training' . Sure, I will make one take a couple steps back if he steps over a certain line, but beyond that no. No doubt it does work for some people's purposes, but I dislike the method and it's results.

I have one here that someone in the past has run backwards, obviously using a whip to speed him on his way. I will overcome this in time but at the moment if I am leading him, stop and turn to face him to ask him to set up for halter....or if he is set up and I go to step into place beside him to lead him out....he flies backward. It is worse if I have a whip in my hand but he did do it even with no whip--we have overcome the problem when no whip is present. Every time he flies backward I curse the person who taught him that.

There are so much better ways to train a horse, and running the horse backward is not a method I would ever suggest to a novice handler. (truth be told I don't recommend it to anyone!)

 

[MyMiniGal]

Well, what I found with Halo, a little pressure goes a long way. Usually when I am asking for her to take a step or two back, all I have to do is step in front of her, and wave the lead line a bit, and she goes back until I stop waving it. That was how her breeder taught her and that is what I've been doing. I feel if I would make her run backwards, it would be too harsh for her. May with certain horses, that take a lot of pressure to do what is asked, then maybe it would work, but I think it would literally freak Halo out.

 

[FurstPlaceMiniatures]

As with any method, it needs to be used correctly. The " loser" out in the field while playing, fighting, etc, is whoever gets out of the others space. By making him go backwards for respect/ run me over / in my space without being invited is exactly what his mares do to him when he does it to them. Should it be over used? No. Is it effective when he used to try to run me over? O ya. I've never had a horse do what you have described. I would bet that was from somebody using it inappropriately, not the method itself.

I should also add you shouldn't need a whip, to yell etc. Just walk broskly towards him. If I "run him over" so be it though. Training should never have anger involved.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I'm not sure this would be appropriate to this filly- she has a sweet nature and is not being deliberately "rude" so to over react in this way I think would be overkill. We do have to be careful with our little ones that we do not use too much "brute force" on them. I have used the "run back" method on seriously big, in your face, colts, as I think they need a bit more correction that the wee ones, but I find that, especially with easy going one's like Halo, the more gentle approach is best. It takes a little longer but the lesson islearned, and not forgotten, and the lesson is "walk quietly and behave" not "get out of my way or I will frighten you silly"......

 

[Sandee]

A, only slightly, funny story. My sister was used to doing the backwards thing with her horses. Right up to the time that she got one that LIKED going backwards. In fact he picked up the habit of going backward whenever he Didn't want to do something. And stopping a horse from going backwards is more difficult than stopping one going forward.

I had to laugh at her frustration.

 

[stormy]

I think teaching them to move away from "pressure" is the best way to fix the rushing and many other training issues and by pressure I mean the pressure of personal space. If they learn when you step towards them they step away....no matter where you are you can rate their forward motion by turning towards them a bit...also the lesson of pressure makes side pass, turn on forehand and turn on haunches much easier to train as well as back or step over while grooming...think of yourself in a bubble and when your bubble presses against them they must step back.

 

[MyMiniGal]

Had a horrible time today...well, in my opinion we did. We got there and I knew right off Halo was having some sort of attitude. But we haven't worked on much of anything for a few weeks. Just hanging out together and bonding that way. Well, I put the halter on her, which I wasn't told the rope halter I had given them to use had broke, so it was a bit tight behind her ears. So I get that on her, and start walking her out of the paddock. She did ok, kept trying to get to some grass that was along side the road/walking area. After awhile, she wouldn't stay in her space, she would push me, so I would push back, with my hip, she then got upset and just started going willy nilly everywhere. I did what I shouldn't of and got nervous, so my husband was standing there, so I asked him if he would take the lead line, until I got calmed down, well, she then started acting up with him too. So the trainer peeked her head out, and since she had surgery not quite a week ago, she sent out a girl that helps around there, to help us get control of Halo. Well, Halo then acted up with her too. So she got her to the round pen, and she showed us how to lunge Halo. And she got Halo doing some good trotting and cantering. But Halo's attitude got worse, before it got better. She flipped her head around and kicked out, while pointing her rear to that girl, as she was the one that was working the whip. So she popped Halo a good one, with the whip on Halo's backside. The next time she kicked out again, she couldn't get close enough to Halo to pop her, but she made her work some more and wouldn't let her stop, until she stopped kicking out. Finally, that happened, and my husband wanted to walk her again. Halo did better, but still wasn't great. We took her back to her paddock, and from then on she ignored us. The lunging only was about 10 mins. at the longest. It didn't take her long, to realize throwing her fit and kicking out, wasn't getting anywhere. To say she hasn't gotten any respect for us yet, is possibly an understatement.She absolutely wouldn't sinc up with any of us, even while lunging, she kept turning her rear to us, and just trying to stop and eat some grass along the edge. I am feeling like a failure right now, but I have asked that girl, as she is there all the time, to help me. I need to be more assertive and have confidence. I was thinking possibly, having her hold one lead line while I hold another, until I build my confidence and also to help teach Halo better ground manners. I wondered if that was in Halo to do be that way, and today proved it. It was like she had held it all in, since I got her and decided to just let it all out. So, I am now wondering if her mellowness was only there when nothing was really asked of her, but to ask her to do anything, then the hottness will all come out. I really need to buck up and be assertive, but I was so not ready for this. Came out of nowhere.

 

[Rhondaalaska]

Don't give up, my girl acted up today.

They will have days where they will try to be top mare.

With my girl when she even thinks of running us over or kicking we take her lead and put our selves in to her shoulder with our but touching her and make her move in circles around us we stop when she starts licking and chewing .

Then we pet her and go back to what we were doing before.

It does not take long , and is easy to do and they can not kick you this way.

it is hard to explained how we do this, a farrier friend of ours showed us how.

It realy works for diva.

As for rushing home. We do the turn around method. And we always walk home.

Never trot home.

Hope this helps

 

[MyMiniGal]

Thank you, that does make sense. It is weird, when I am home I realize things I should of done, or know what to do, from what I've read or have been told by people here and then when it all happens, so fast like it did today, it was like it all went out of my head. I was so frustrated at myself and I went into flight mode myself. That isn't going to get Halo to respect me. Not giving up...just upset at myself.

 

[Rhondaalaska]

I can understand that. I went through the Samething

. I was used to big horses and hadn't had my own for quite a few years.

I am still learning my girl and she is learning us. But we will find a way that works.

You will go through days like this. Just don't let her get away with it and end on a good note.

Even if it is a simple as just walking a few steps.

I would get another rope halter as well, maybe two that way you have a spare in your car.

It may have been the halter that made her in such a bad mood if it was to tight.

Just keep trying and you will get there together.

 

[MyMiniGal]

That is what I am thinking, that I need an extra, even from the one I have coming...won't order from the same place, but will definitely get another one to have on hand. As I am wondering about that halter too, if that triggered a lot of it.

 

[AnnaC]

It may well have been your halter - tight behind the ears also means tight up her face, and if the noseband was also tight, then the halter is pressing against her teeth! If you suddenly have a 'funny' day or something occurs out of the blue that is not the norm for their behaviour, then always check first the horse for any health problems and then the tack that you are using in case something is pinching somewhere. I'm suprised that the girl who came to help you didn't think of this.

That said, all horses, esecially the youngsters, can have 'off' days - just like we can - and it is sometimes better to revert to doing something simple and just getting that right so you can end on a good note. Then put the horse away and try again another day.

I think you are doing really well with little Halo considering you have only had her a short time - back in the 'old' days we used to say of a new horse that it takes a year to get to know them and two years to gain mutual respect and a true partnership! While this may not be strictly true, I have found that as the years pass I can laugh and enjoy both my girls and boys when they have a 'funny' or 'high jinks/silly moment' type of day, knowing full well that as soon as I say 'enough, lets concentrate now' they will stop and give me their undivided attention.

So just try to relax and enjoy the journey, you are both learning new things about each other and it will all come fine in the end.

 

[MyMiniGal]

Aww, thank you so much. I feel much better, this morning, and of course, will try again. She had a lot of spunk yesterday. She wanted to trot, along side with us, when all we were doing was wanting to walk. So she was testing us and then things just sort of spun out of control. I was in contact with another mini owner, that would love to bring one of her mini's to have play dates with Halo. He is a 10 year old gelding that has wonderful manners and loves to play. So she will do that. Right now, the ranch owner is still getting the bigger horses to get use to her, so that eventually, she can be out with a couple of them, and have some play time. I wish we could afford another mini and have it in with her. An older one, I think would be great with her.

 

[Jill]

I would keep making her stop, but I'd also make her go back to the point where she got ahead... by backing up. Then a short pause, and a slow walk forward.