Riding horse problems

[rhea]

Well I know some of you have had tons of experience with big horses, so wondering if you had any ideas. I have an ArabX gelding who has a tendency to be a bit hot, but the last few times I've ridden him he has been so out of character and I'm kind of stumped. He's always had halting "issues", get very worked up at the canter, but the last few times in the canter he's started throwing his head excessively, to the point he almost hits me in the face. In addition when I canter him to the left he's definately not right, and will switch leads in the back (even on a circle). I've only ridden him a few times since September due to school, but he's always had most of the winter off and we've never had this on return to work. At first we thought it was his teeth, but I don't see how that would make him canter disunited?! As far as we can tell his back isn't really sore, but we can only tell so much (Going to try and get my mom to get the chiropractor out here asap just to make sure) I'm just not sure what to do in the meantime, don't really want to ride him in case he really is sore but a friend also suggested that I should ride him in case he's just playing with me. I rode him in our roundpen today and he didn't throw his head nearly as much, but he was cantering disunited and then would try and run away from all my aids.

: I was going to try a running martingale on him but I'm afriad that won't fix the problem, more of a temporary thing. This is sooo out of character for this guy, he's my love

: and has been an amazing show horse, and now he has me all worried! Has anyone experienced anything like this? Or at least have any ideas why he'd throw his head/switch leads? The vet isnt coming out until the end of feb/beginning of march so any ideas in the meantime would be really nice...

 

[nootka]

Does he do the same thing in long lines?

I'd check his ears, too...that can cause a LOT of problems for horses, having an issue with ears, or teeth, etc. and I wouldn't rule anything out.

How about vision? Sinus problems?

There very well could be a pinched nerve or other issue with your equipment. So many things and I hope you can determine which it is.

Good luck and i think the chiro and vet may have better ideas for you. In lieu of that, I would find a trusted trainer to help determine what might be causing the problem and how to get past it.

I'm no real expert, just going by what I might consider if I were in your shoes.

Liz M.

 

[Marty]

There is going to be a million reasons that he is doing this but I'll give you the reason that first comes to mind.

If you have only ridden him a few times since September, well this is the middle of February. ........If I did that with Sonny, he's not only be dis-united, he'd be crow-hopping me sideways all over the place. hehe

I know cause I tried it and I do know better than to pull that on him!

I'll vote that he's flat out of condition and you are rushing him into way too many gaits when he is not ready or even warmed up.

This is winter, right?

:

Maybe he's really feeling wonderful and way too frisky. If he has not been conditioned all along, I'd say he's just being silly.

I'd go back to basics, and just ask him for the walk and halt with a lot of bending until he has that down again perfectly and don't ask for another gait until he does that much.

Also, any chance he's arthritic?

 

[FoRebel]

IMO, if you can free lunge him in the round pen, I'd start with that and do that for about 10 -15 minutes total. Then tack him up and go back into the round pen and work with the free lunging for another 10 - 15 minutes. After all that I'd get up on him and do 5-10 minutes of walk, bending and halt. If that goes well do 5-10 minutes of walk, trot, bending and halt. Then if the trot goes well go up to a lope. You will need to keep some sort of consistency with this though (i.e. once or twice a week)

I wouldn't entirely rule out his teeth, ears, or another problem, definitely have the vet check him over. Hopefully he's just being full of himself and there's not an under lying problem. I'm spoiled with the horses I have now, I can just take them straight from the pasture after not working with them for 3 months and jump on them without any worries!

: The arab mare I lost in April 2006 was the same way your guy is when she didn't get the consistency that she needed. And she needed that twice a week work-out or she was complete h@#% on me! She actually threw her head so bad that she broke my nose twice!

:

Good Luck!

:

 

[rhea]

Thanks for your replies!! I haven't checked ears yet, will definately have to do that. I have changed equipment recently, but it's been in about the last month, and he started doing this before I switched things. What worries me the most is how out of character this is for him. LOL Marty I've definately had a few horses who could not handle the winter off then going back into work, but he's never had these problems before.

: And something just doesn't feel "right"... I've never had him throw his head like this before, even when he had problems he'd be way more likely to just take the bit in his teeth and go. I'll keep working him slowly over the next and see if he'll work out of it. Hahah I guess I'm spoiled right now because the two other horses I rode today are both supergreen and hadn't been ridden in months, and they were both old pros. Typical. I'll also try the free-lunging beforehand and stuff.

I really wouldn't *think* that he's arthritic, he's only 9 and wasn't even started uner saddle until he was 6, did some jumping as a 7 y/o after serious conditioning, and did a just a little jumping last year. I can't imagine why he'd have arthritis, but will definately look into it. Gosh the vet can't come soon enough, it's worrisome having my boy like this!!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

OK- what bit??

If using a martingale use a loose STANDING one, attached to the noseband not the bit- it will just save your face but not exacerbate the problem.

Any chance of taking the bit out altogether??

How old is he, it could be Lampas.

 

[laughingllama75]

Hi.....Just my opinion and experience, but I believe he has a back problem. I have worked MANY horses, some mine, some not and 99% of the time when there is a problem like this it is the back. Especially when you ask him to canter and he throws his head up repeatedly. Same thing when you ask him to switch leads. It desnt hurt so bad one way, but using the other lead bothers. I wouldnt ride him until the chiro sees him. It could lead to him bucking and throwing you or hurting himeself. also, have you changed saddles at all? A not so proper fitting saddle can bother thier back.......Sometimes, as a horse ages, thier backs DO CHANGE and the saddle no longer fits properly. Just things to keep in mind. I hope the chiro gets to see him soon, I know how frustrating it is not to know what is going on with your horse, and waiting for someone else is no easy task! :lol:

By the way, my appendix QH mare is more than willing to take long periods of time of work. She is never hard to work with when I do get back on. The winter is a busy time for me, and I spend more time riding client horses than her. So, your not alone in not riding for a while, :bgrin

Alicia

 

[tracerace]

I would start with a chiro and vet evaluation. To me it sounds like the back as well. On rare occassion the teeth need work and will cause some sort of behaviorial and physical reaction like you describe.

Let us know what you find.

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I am with everyone else i dont think it is a "tack" issue I do think some might be a to much time off issue but I also think there is something going on with his back in fact I am going to totally stick my neck out there and say more so his hips which is why I think he is switching leads behind. I mean really it isnt comfortable for a horse to do that especially in a circle most dont opt to change behind over and over (ok except those that are learning lead changes and some take great glee in trying to do it over and over)

I would think that your weight shifting a bit as you circle to the inside might be causing a bit more pain and is why he is then changing behind. I am also understanding from what you wrote that this is an issue at the canter and not so much if at all at the trot?

Sometimes they really dont need a "injury" to be sore and often in the hips/ stifle area it is from a back foot not being held right or "fought" over with a farrier or owner

Wanted to add it would be a huge help if you could have someone video you riding him even if just for a few min both in saddle and bareback (if you can do so safely) that way you can really be able to see what seems to trigger the reactions and what you are doing seat and balance wise as it happens

 

[Shari]

Saddle not fitting him correctly will also cause the problem you are having.

I went through over 30+ saddle for my grey mare before I found one that would fit her correctly and she would go well in.

That was after the Vet went over her and had her teeth done. She had some wicked hooks on her teeth and at the time her teeth were done she was 6 years old.

 

[Humhill]

think there is something going on with his back in fact I am going to totally stick my neck out there and say more so his hips which is why I think he is switching leads behind.

I agree!!

I saw a demo one time of a chiropractor and accupuncturist. She showed us a horse with misaligned hips, then adjusted them, and it was a huge difference!

I used to have a big horse that we also used in a riding camp. He was horrible when adults rode him, did want to be tacked, would stand when mounted, ornery under saddle. He would actually do this low nicker when I would move to dismount. Well, I never thought anything of it and finally sold him to a 9 year old girl. She hasn't had a moment's problem from him. She was even jumping him over low fences!

Now, it's highly likely that she's just a better rider than me. But, I really think (I'm kinda big) that his back was hurting him. He was a joy on the ground, complete sweetheart, but when I rode him, he was horrible. Looking back on it, I feel bad that my ignorance was causing him pain. But, he's much happier now, they've retired him and he'll always have a good, loving home with them.

 

[rhea]

Thanks again guys: We're gonna call the chiro once the weekend's over...unforunately she lives far away so has to coordinate all her appts to this area. I'll try hopping on him bareback this aft and see if I can get a video too, it would definately be nice if it was just me, easier to fix lol. When he started this we were using the same saddle I've had on him since I bought him (a bates with CAIR) and since it's started I've tried two other saddles on him, a close contact and a dressage. Nothing really seems to make a difference so I dont *think* it's the tack unless none of them fit him

: . Anyways, will probably have the video up by 6-ish and then if anyone can yell at me about anything I'm doing wrong that would be great LOL. I can take it

:

Oh, and Rabbitsfizz: When he started we were using an eggbutt french link snaffle(again I've used it on him as long as I've had him) and once he started doing this I switch to a normal copper d-ring, as a trainer told me the french link was actually fairly harsh as the middle bar is flattened ? And he is coming 9 years, I don't really know what Lampas is? Can anyone enlighten me??!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Your trainer is wrong, the French Link is far milder than a jointed snaffle which can be an evil bit in the wrong hands.

It is the Dr Bristol- which looks like the French Link that is harsher- are you sure you have a French Link??

The middle link lies flat.

http://www.equisearch.com/horses_riding_tr...ery/frenchlink/

Lampas is a swelling of the hard palate and he is the right age.



NOTE: Did you know?

Lampas is a surprisingly common condition in riding horses, involving the swelling of the upper hard palate.

It is not unknown for the palate to drop to the level of the incisors in front of it.

Common causes are inappropriate feeding and teething. Do check for this as it may explain why your horse is not able to accept the bit! .

Open his mouth and look at the roof of it, if the soft palate is anywhere near the bottom of his teeth- ie in line with them, then there is a good chance that is the problem- he needs checking as this is more common than you would think and will go away on it's own in three to four weeks but in the mean time you can do untold damage to the horse, his confidence etc.

A Dentist would be best but a Vet should also be able to diagnose it.

Taking the bit out will solve the problem- if he rides OK without a bit - no head tossing etc- then there is a good chance that is what is up

 

[Shari]

I know Dyfra even after her teeth were done...like her bitless bridle better than a bit. She will hold the bit nice in her mouth, not fuss with it at all and it is one of the oval jointed bits so it is very mild. But I just got the best out of her in her bitless bridle.

Know a few horses that are like that. Might be he is like that too.

I would just look at each possible problem one at a time...until you find the one that will help you make him feel better. Do not discount any of the possible problems.......some times one gets suprised.

 

[Magic]

When I was driving a green mini mare, I was having some major problems with her throwing her head, and one judge even told me that my mare was lame in a driving class. I knew she wasn't (but didn't argue the point, lol) but she went fine when not in harness. In fact she took a first in Liberty at that same show.

I didn't consider her teeth as the trainer was *supposed* to have had her teeth done. I paid for it, anyway. Come to find out when I was at Nationals and had Carl Mitz check her out, she had points, and wolf teeth that had to have been banging on the bit. He fixed her up and she was fine and dandy.

I say, first have a vet (and/or dentist) rule out physical problems-- if this is new behavior then it is very much most likely a pain problem. Good luck!

 

[anoki]

Saddle not fitting him correctly will also cause the problem you are having.I went through over 30+ saddle for my grey mare before I found one that would fit her correctly and she would go well in.

k, call me stupid...but the first thing I would check is the saddle!!!!! I've seen this too many times :no:

It sounds to me like he is uncomfortable, whether it is from a bad fitting saddle, or just from being out of condition (is he 100% sound???). That being said, it could be a bad fitting saddle from a lack of condition (I've seen that too many times too!!!) Improper fitting saddles can do more than just make the horses back a 'bit sore'!! They can throw things out of alignment all over the place...depends on the horse.

Hope you find out what it is, and keep us updated!

~kathryn

 

[threeten]

I agree about the saddle fit. Arabs and ArabX's are sometimes hard to fit in saddles. They usually have a shorter back, low or no withers and a large barrel. Have you tried a western saddle on him? A western saddle has longer bars and can spread the weight of a rider over a bigger area. One bad thing about the western saddle is that the skirt can sometimes rub the horse in the loin area if it is too long for them. I have Arabs and I know it can be a challenge to find a good saddle fit. Hope your vet and chiro can help him too. Arabs are wonderful horses, such great personalities!

Bev

 

[rhea]

I got some video today of him, both right and left. He's a lot worse to the left, we're starting to think maybe it is hips or something like that.. he didn't actually disunite today but there was a few steps where it looks to me like he was trying to. I went bareback, so I dont think it's the saddle, and I don't *think* that I've ridden him with a saddle enough lately for it to have hurt him that much. Plus the more I watch the video the more I see it in hip/stifle area...

Rabbitsfizz - I changed his bit back to the nice french link and he's much much happier with his face. So I'm thinking that the headtossing was totally unrelated and maybe he just didnt go for the single jointed. I was skeptical about the french link being harsh too, but thought I'd try it. She's not my trainer anymore either... :no:

So here's the video :lol: . First one's to the right, second one's left (I think, if it's not, I apoligize - I'm having a blonde life ) I'm really sorry about my riding too, haven't ridden bareback in a looooong time. Bet I'll be feeling it tomorrow. As said above it a few times in the left canter it looks to me like he's trying to disunite, and he just doesn't feel "right" going to the left. If anyone has an eye for that kinda thing maybe they could agree/disagree with me that it looks hip/stifle??? Thanks sooo much for everyone's help. Definately gives more things to look into.





Edited to add: *coughs* I just realized I'm not wearing a helmet I promise that I usually do!!! Im usually the one lecturing the friend about wearing a helmet...

:

 

[cameominis]

Have his hocks checked.not wanting to stay on the correct lead is a sure sign,also the head tossing is a sign.We have a horse with bad hocks and that was what he was doing with us.Saddle fit could also be the promblem.Always listen to your horse.He is telling you there is something wrong.Good luck! :saludando:

 

[tracerace]

I see what you're saying....and it does seem that she is stiff somewhere in the left hip area - at least there is something "not right" in that general area. It could be the stifle too. I hope your chiro visit squares it all away.

By the way -- French link really can hurt a horse with a low pallet. I was recommended FL's by everyone and their brother when I got my tb and he hated it because the flat part gouged him just like a single jointed bit. I finally ended up with a broken snaffle with a "bean" in the middle - it's a Herm Sprenger, I think the KK ultra (can't remember...)...I also have another one by Mylar (sp?) that I like a lot too. There is so much to know about bits! I learn more every single day!

One more thing...you put me to shame riding out there in that snow. I'm such a WIMP...I never ride when there is snow on the ground. What is your footing in the round pen? Oh, you look great, and I'll refrain from the helmet lecture .