Needing DOT#s

[ponyarab]

Well all I can say is that I did check this out with the FMCSA (Federal Motor Carrier Safety Adminiatration) and they told me 2 different times that I would need a DOT number if I traveled out of the state of Texas (Texas is NOT a DOT state) into Oklahoma or other DOT states. But like I said don't believe me as you need to check things out yourself with FMCSA. You can do that by calling the FMCSA field office and the link to find your office is below. When calling you DO NOT have to give your name. I guess if this is not true you have nothing to worry about......better to be safe than sorry...... but if it is true and you don't comply then get pulled over well I guess you will pay the piper then.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/about/contact/off...fieldroster.asp

The FMCSA is the big dog of the transportation system so get it straight from the horses mouth. It was mentioned that if this was true an announcement would have been made NOT true as it is your obligation to know the law and ignorance of the law will not get you around getting a fine or ticket.

Lisa hit the nail on the head when she said if your a trainer who is hauling other peoples horses for money then you would be considered a commercial vehicle.......well that is one thing that the FMCSA mentioned to me about as trainers are considered commercial since you are taking money for profit.

 

[Tango]

This is what I pulled off qhorses.com:

Do You Need A DOT Number?

The laden weight of your truck and trailer is important as you may fall into the category of needing a U. S. or state D.O.T. (Department of Transportation) number or CDL (commercial drivers license).

Do you need a DOT Number, logbook or Commercial Drivers License if you don’t haul horses for money?

If your vehicle or combination of vehicles has a GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) or GCVWR (Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating) of less than 10,001 lbs., you do not need to be concerned about these things. However, if your rig has a GVWR or GCVWR of 10,001 lbs. or more, you must make some decisions. (The GVWR is determined by the manufacturer and should be marked on your trailer and your tow vehicle. The GCVWR can be obtained by adding the two together. A two-horse trailer and a pickup truck can easily be rated over 10,001 lbs.).

Even if you don't haul horses for money, the US Department of Transportation (USDOT) can consider you "commercial". Operating a commercial stable, hauling horses for show (with intent to profit), rodeo, race, sale, training, or for compensation are examples of "commercial ventures" as defined by the DOT for those who are traveling interstate. Those who only travel intrastate need only be concerned with the regulations within their own state of residence. Most states have the same regulations and some have even more stringent laws.

If you fall into the commercial category, you must follow the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations (FMCSR). This means that you must carry a logbook, medical card, certain safety equipment (such as flares, triangles, fire extinguisher etc.) and your vehicle must be equipped with certain features such as required lights, safety chains, brakes, and breakaway brake. You must also have a federal inspection sticker, ID number, and a sign on your truck.

For interstate travel, a commercial drivers license is only necessary for driving a vehicle or combination of vehicles over 26,001 lbs. Some states have additional classified licenses for those who drive vehicles or combinations under 26.001 lbs.

Farm exemptions are available, but if you have a farm plate, you may not travel more than 100 miles from your farm.

Explanation of GVW, GVWR, GCVWR, and GW (weight terms for your truck and trailer)

GVW (Gross Vehicle Weight) and GW (Gross Weight) are interchangeable terms meaning the actual weight of the vehicle (trailer) and its complete load. This weight can be determined by loading the horses, tack, feed, and hay etc. into the fully equipped trailer (mats, spare tire, etc.) and taking it to a truck scale to have it weighed. Most gravel yards or truck stops have truck scales.

GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weigh Rating) is the value specified by the manufacturer as the recommended maximum loaded weight of a single vehicle. For a trailer this value is determined by the axle capacity and the coupler capacity. For example, a trailer will be rated at 5000 lbs. GVWR by the manufacturer if it has two 2500 lb. axles and a 2 inch ball coupler that is rated 5000 lbs. Loading the trailer to excess of the GVWR is not only unsafe, but is illegal.

GCVWR (Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating) is the value specified by the manufacturer as the recommended maximum loaded weight of a combination of vehicles. (The GVWR of the tow vehicle plus the GVWR of the trailer.) In the absence of a value specified by the manufacturer, GCVWR will be determined by adding the GVWR of the power unit and the total weight of the towed unit and any load thereon.

If your vehicle or combination of vehicles has a GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) or GCVWR (Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating) of less than 10,001 lbs., you do not need to be concerned about these things. However, if your rig has a GVWR or GCVWR of 10,001 lbs. or more, you must make some decisions. (The GVWR is determined by the manufacturer and should be marked on your trailer and your tow vehicle. The GCVWR can be obtained by adding the two together. A two-horse trailer and a pickup truck can easily be rated over 10,001 lbs.).

Even if you don't haul horses for money, the US Department of Transportation (USDOT) can consider you "commercial". Operating a commercial stable, hauling horses for show (with intent to profit), rodeo, race, sale, training, or for compensation are examples of "commercial ventures" as defined by the DOT for those who are traveling interstate. Those who only travel intrastate need only be concerned with the regulations within their own state of residence. Most states have the same regulations and some have even more stringent laws.

If you fall into the commercial category, you must follow the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations (FMCSR). This means that you must carry a logbook, medical card, certain safety equipment (such as flares, triangles, fire extinguisher etc.) and your vehicle must be equipped with certain features such as required lights, safety chains, brakes, and breakaway brake. You must also have a federal inspection sticker, ID number, and a sign on your truck.

For interstate travel, a commercial drivers license is only necessary for driving a vehicle or combination of vehicles over 26,001 lbs. Some states have additional classified licenses for those who drive vehicles or combinations under 26.001 lbs.

Farm exemptions are available, but if you have a farm plate, you may not travel more than 100 miles from your farm.

Each state has a different weigh station policy. All commercial vehicles must stop, but sometimes even non-commercial vehicles must pull in. As a general rule, if the sign says "All Trucks" must pull in, it probably means pickup trucks too. Some states want to see vehicles that have "commercial" plates even if they are not classified "commercial" by use. They may want to check vehicle registration, driver's license, weight, or safety equipment and often they will want to see the health papers of the horses or do a brand inspection. Most of the time, the weigh station personnel will be too busy with big trucks to bother with you and they will probably wave you on. Some people have even been told they should not have stopped. Horse trailers fall into the cracks, and any enforcement official has the option to enforce the regulations as he sees fit. Any sign that says "Vehicles with Trailers" or with "Livestock" means you must pull in. In this case, they will want to inspect the horses. If you do not stop, they may pursue you and bring you back. The fines can be very steep and you can be held for a very inconvenient period of time.

What I am getting out of this is that even though our combined weight exceeds 10,001 lbs, as long as we are not considered commercial we do not have to have a DOT# even if traveling through a DOT state. We are just going to pick up a horse we purchased. Now, if we were going to go to a show, we could then be considered commercial. Am I reading that right?

 

[Shari]

Think the problem happens when someone leaves their home state to go to another state or through other states, to go to a show or pick up a horse they bought. Their State doesn't need a DOT or CDL licence but the states they travel to or through might.

And those other states inforce their rules.

However... I do not think it is that easy for people to find out what they need to do in other states, so they don't get their Truck/trailer/horse impounded. (ya I know I can't spell)

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

My trailer is a bumper pull 3 horse slant, and the tag on the side of it doesn't have any weights. (odd?) But with a 6 h slant having a GVWR of 6899, mine has to be a lot less than that, so I should be ok.

Uhm... no 6H trailer will WEIGH less than 7000lbs, never mind have a GVW that low. You will have at least dual 8k axles, meaning at least a 16k GVWR for the trailer, plus the 12k from the truck.

Unless its specifically a mini trailer, in which case I'd need to know the length and material to hazard a guess. My roomate's 18' 3H slant trailer has dual 5400lbs axles, 11000lbs GVWR. My trailer is a 20' stock (16' plus 4' tack) and has a GVWR of 14,000lbs.

 

[CHARLOTTE & JOHN]

I just thought I would add this knowledge since I did not see anything refering to this in this thread. In many states, like Indiana, any truck pulling a trailer is suppose to go through a weigh station. Also in Indiana if your GVW is less than 26,000 and you don't cross state lines you don't need a CDL, but you do need a Chauffers license, a state DOT number, a yearly inspection for your vehicle, and a DOT physical for the driver.

 

[Davie]

Well I decided I better check into this myself . I live in OK and drive an F250 Diesel that has a GVWR of 8,800 lbs and my bumper pull 16" trailer GVWR of 7,000 and my alumi-lite gooseneck has a GVWR of 9600 lbs.

This is what I was told. ANY vehicle or combination that is over 10,001 lbs MUST have a DOT #. If you are over 26,001 you must have a CDL. You go onto www.fmcsa.dot.gov and apply for your DOT #. When you apply it will ask you if you are a commercial carrier or private.

I told the gentleman I was a private individual and traveled outside my home state for a few horse shows and to pick up a horse or two on ocassion when I have purchased out of state. He said my DOT # would indicate that I was a private individual and not commercial carrier, but that I was required to have a DOT #.

The only additional item I would need would be my medical card.

UPDATE: After talking with Oklahoma Highway Patrol I was told this. IF you get a DOT # you subject yourself to the FMCSA Regulations #387, 390-399 (look on their website). You would need to carry a logbook, have a medical card, No CDL or random drug testing because under 26,001, you are REQUIRED to stop at all weigh stations and subjec to all inspection. You basically become AS HE SAID - Walmart.

 

[minimomNC]

I also just checked with the NC Drivers Licence Bureau. If your truck and trailer are under 26.001 then you do not need a CDL, DOT# or keep a DOT log. As for my trailer GVWR Ummm, it does say 6899 I am not wrong about that, but what I didn't see was the conversion. That is in KG, my trailer is 15,210, with my truck being 11,500. my rig is 210 pounds over the limit so I either will sell this trailer for a smaller one or get my CDL. That is $123 for eight years, the written test takes about and hour and a half and the skills test will take about 2 hours. All of this is according to the book they gave me at the DL office.

 

[Tango]

Okay, I just called the western field office of FMCSR and because we are making an interstate trip to pick up a horse we bought, we DO NOT need to have a DOT# or a CDL. Even though our combined GVWR is over 10,001 lbs, was told by two different people that because we are just making a one time trip to pick up a horse we bought, we don't need either one and are good to go.

Now, I asked them when would we ever need to have a DOT or CDL and they told me only if we were hauling to horse shows and possibly making money, they told me it was "all about the making money thing".

So, if anyone is in doubt about their own situation, just call one of the field offices in your region. They are very helpful.

 

[Sandee]

Okay, I just called the western field office of FMCSR and because we are making an interstate trip to pick up a horse we bought, we DO NOT need to have a DOT# or a CDL. Even though our combined GVWR is over 10,001 lbs, was told by two different people that because we are just making a one time trip to pick up a horse we bought, we don't need either one and are good to go.
Now, I asked them when would we ever need to have a DOT or CDL and they told me only if we were hauling to horse shows and possibly making money, they told me it was "all about the making money thing".

So, if anyone is in doubt about their own situation, just call one of the field offices in your region. They are very helpful.

So if that "all about making money" were true, very few of us would have worry. Since when do miniatures put you in the position of "MAKING money"? It's usually all flowing out not IN our pockets!

 

[wpsellwood]

My truck, a 1 ton 4 door Turbo diesel Dodge duelly has a GVWR of 11,500 lbs.

Its a good thing you live in a non dot state, as you would need one to just drive your truck LOL

 

[joylee123]

[SIZE=12pt]I sure wish the mods would keep this tread for future reference for us all.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]Joy[/SIZE]

 

[Little Indian Acres]

Okay, I just called the western field office of FMCSR and because we are making an interstate trip to pick up a horse we bought, we DO NOT need to have a DOT# or a CDL. Even though our combined GVWR is over 10,001 lbs, was told by two different people that because we are just making a one time trip to pick up a horse we bought, we don't need either one and are good to go.
Now, I asked them when would we ever need to have a DOT or CDL and they told me only if we were hauling to horse shows and possibly making money, they told me it was "all about the making money thing".

So, if anyone is in doubt about their own situation, just call one of the field offices in your region. They are very helpful.

Yeah that is because they do not realize how expensive showing horses is and that most could never possibly "make money" doing it! I bet a lot of our husband would love to know how this making money on showing horses works.

:rofl