Miniature types

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Lexie

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Was reading through other posts and found this

"When it comes to conformation, miniatures for show and breeding should be held to the same standard as are full size horses. Straight legs, good bites and sound conformation are important. When it comes to showing, there is a type that is preferred in halter class. The current preference is for very proportional horses with high set and long necks, small heads, long clean legs and short backs. However, miniatures exist in all body types and each type has its admirers. The major types are often referred to as Arabian, Thoroughbred, Quarter Horse, and Draft – however, they are all still “just” miniature horses."

I was aware that miniature horses looked different in type, but never knew they were really classified, if you will. So, I would love to see pictures of the "major types", or a description will work too.

Thanks Jill for posting this I found it to be very interesting and informative to read.
 
Thanks, Lexie!!!

So much of it can be in the eye of the beholder. The "types" are not anything official. Just what people will use to describe the style of miniature they are talking about. I think I have some interesting examples of "type" below.

First, I want to show my A division senior show gelding, Tibbs Sundowner (HOF). He is now 9yo (pictured about 6wks ago). I feel he's an interesting example because he's very much a quarter horse type, but he's shown very well. He's a 3x National Champion, 6x Reserve National Champion, has 20 Grand Championships, and his halter hall of fame (with nearly 200 points). Not being the current trend hasn't held him back in the ring. A lot of people will describe a mini as a quarter horse type if he/she is unrefined and big boned, but I think Sunny has a substatial build (like a qh) but also has refinement (like a nice qh).

SUNNY%202007%20VMHC%20Summer%20Classic%20--%20109.jpg

Here's an example that I feel is another type, different than above. This is a filly I own, Harrells Flirting With Perfection. She is a yearling (pictured also about 6wks ago) but is significantly finer in her build than Sunny. I think she's a good example of a refined (arab type? none really look like true arabs to me), but she's not so refined that it looks like a stiff wind would knock her down. She looks like she's built to do more than just be pretty (again, my opinion):

Flirt%20--%202007%20VMHC%20Summer%20Classic%20--%20100%20Touched.jpg

Then this gelding, Little Kings BT Bacardi Gold, is my favorite for how he is on the inside. But, on the outside, apart from being an incompatible color, I think he looks like a thoroughbred type mini. He is a 3y and is a B division gelding. He's a son of Ima Boones Little Buckeroo Too ("BTU") and from all I've heard and seen from other relatives, he puts A LOT of heart into his babies.

BACARDI%202007%20VMHC%20Summer%20Classic%20--%20136.jpg

Other people will post their own examples I'm sure. It's always fun to look at different types, and different people will classify their minis differently, too. They do come in all shapes, and range of sizes.

PS this will probably get moved to the Picture Forum, just so you'll know where to look for it if it does.
 
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Personally (and of course "type" is sort of subjective) I feel the shift has gone from "Quarter Horse/ Draft Horse Type" which, if you will picture the old style mini... overall very thick and somewhat heavy bone... then breeders were able to successfully breed for a lighter bone, flatter topline, more dishy head, longer/thinner necks (the "Arab" type) which were more successful in the ring.

Now, there is a shift for the "Shetland" Type, which is even more extreme with length of leg, refinement, and upright-ness.

I feel there has been three transitions. You will find some judges prefer QH type, some prefer Arab type, and some will pin the Shetland type. You just have to know your judge. The Shetland type definitely is "it" at Nationals.

Let me give you some pictures:

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The above stallion is more "QH type" as he has more bone to his legs and more substance to his body. His neck is not super upright.

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The above filly is more "Arab type"... she still could be identified as a miniature horse by horse people but she has more refinement to her (sorry for the terrible picture). Generally most miniatures can be divided into "Arab type" and "Quarter Horse type" I think... people will add more breed descriptions but generally it is not necessary to describe the horse. Minis just look like minis.

Lastly, is the "Shetland type" which can, also be registered American Shetland Ponies. They are much more refined in appearance and generally more upright. Some staunch "old time" breeders absolutely loathe the look, but I love it! I think it looks even more like a true full-size horse to me. Anyway, here is a Shetland type filly:

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I wish I had better pictures to share... I will see what I can wrangle up.

Andrea
 
At this time, Pinto doesn't classify Miniatures as to type, but I can imagine that the day will come. The types that Pinto uses for horses include: 1) stock type (quarter horse, paint, etc), 2) hunter type (TB), 3) Pleasure type (Arabian, Morgan e.g.) and 4) Saddle type (Saddlebred). No Draft type because Pinto doesn't register horses with draft breeding.
 
This is a very interesting post and goes to show how very subjective "type" is I hope it stays here on this forum as it is educational and helps to get an idea of who thinks what is what type.

From my own herd I would say that this is QH in type

he is a 29.50 in gelding he is a bit overweight in this picture

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I don't really have anything "araby" in type IMO but I have been told by many they would include this horse in that catagory

this is our soon to be gelding Paco-

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As far as shetland/minis go here is our new boy William he is very upheaded (and I am in LOVE with him) not the best picture but shows his type

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Just my opinion on types and as you can see there are many different ideas of what the same "type" is
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I spent all day saturday at the Norco horse show. I was surprized at the difference in the horses there.

One thing I noticed was that alot of the horses had what I call a pencil head. They looked like a sharpened pencil with no jaw. To try and explain, look at Jills Perfection, There is a definent jaw but some of the horses at the show didnt have that. When I asked about it I was told they are breeding more shetland in with the mini's to achieve this look and that that is what is preferred in the ring. To me It seemed that they had really nice bodies, long legs and a head that just appeared to small.

Now I dont know and I am sure there will be alot of stuff about this but...... That is how it was explained to me. Makes me glad I am not one of the ones in the show ring atm but.... I am trying to learn.

There were alot of beautiful horses there I can say that much.
 
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One thing that i have always believed in firmly, just because the horse is refined and fine boned, does not make it arabian type. I've seen many full size arabs that were heavier boned, almost as if they were a QH. I just dont think the horse being fine boned makes it the arabian type. Same goes both ways, just bc the horse is heavier boned does not mean it is a QH type. Both breeds have certian looks and other charicteristics beside general bone size/structure.

Mine are all kind of a medium between the QH type and the 'arab' type.

I agree with Andrea 100%, i think she hit the transitions over the years right on the mark!
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Is the "Shetland type" found in the smaller minis (34" and under)? Or is that look in the smaller minis referred to as "Thoroughbred type"?
 
Lexie... some breeders are starting to get the 34" and under Shetlands.

My stallion "Graham's The Big Picture" is 34" tall here he is:

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They are just harder to find than the larger ones, people right now seem to be scrambling to hardship the 37-38" Shetlands into AMHR to get new bloodlines in there.

Andrea

LilTnT....

I must have missed you at the Norco show! (Actually, I don't know you but wish I had, would have said Hi!) The head "type" is not heavily influenced by the Shetlands but yes, many of the Norco exhibitors DO have ASPC/AMHR horses. I think the important thing at the moment is to get a SMALLER head, as a large head is a fault that minis have had for decades. First, they went for "dishy" heads, now they are trying for smaller heads in general. The developed jowl is not something that many breeders focus on... most breeders in general focus on head dish, neck, topline, tailset, and straight legs. Less-bred-for in general is depth of hip and chest, length of back, leg angles (not just straight, but pastern length, stifle angle, etc.) and points like that. It is interesting to note the trends, I think. But, after all, no horse is perfect and everyone prefers a certain type over another! And as I originally said, type IS subjective... I would put the majority (but not all) of the horses posted so far in the QH category!
 
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So this is fun - what "type" would you say he is? I tend to see him as the stock type based on the way his neck ties in to his shoulders. I like his conformation, to me it is a nice balanced "pleasure horse" look.

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Oh Andrea!!! Your stallion is beautiful
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: , Im in love! I sure wouldnt mind a pasture full of those to look at.
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It is interesting to see how different people see "types" as different. Many of the people who see and advertise as "Arabian" type are seeing something different than what I would call it. And I do agree with liltnt that a lot of "pencil heads" as she called them are showing. I haven't picked a name for them yet but when I see a head that looks out of proportion to the body, be it too small or too large, I don't care for that look. I too like to see a nice jaw and pleasing shape to a head....and I am sure that is subjective to others also. Balance is so important to me and for me everything needs to be in porportion to the rest. Many of the smaller miniatures do have nice jaws and shorter heads but most of the time they seem more in porportion than some of the newer type being shown. Although I do love Arabians, I don't think there has yet been a miniature horse that has the proportions and look of a really good Arabian. Personally I would be happy with the look of a Morgan in Miniature. Everyone to their own thing though! Mary
 
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I have always found it interesting in the minis that many of the minis referred to as "refined" are very often horses that are 3 years of age or much younger. As they mature into what I consider adulthood many of them change in body shape and of course the weight change as they mature also impact on their "look". My personal preference if for a miniature horse that "looks" like a full grown horse but in miniature, basically to me that means it should be balanced. Everything should in proportion. Since we are not a "pure-breed" per say but a height breed, those that are breeding the shetlands (that qualify in height to be considered minis) are looking to add refinement and I would think leg action. I too have noticed some, what people would say are "fine boned" (shetland/mini crosses) but their heads do not look esthetically pleasing comapred to the rest of the body. I guess you sacrifice one thing sometimes in order to get the sought after "action". Now there are some of these "crosses" that are absolutely totally amazing.
 
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I spent all day saturday at the Norco horse show. I was surprized at the difference in the horses there.
One thing I noticed was that alot of the horses had what I call a pencil head. They looked like a sharpened pencil with no jaw.
OMGosh!! I know exactly what you're talking about!! :new_shocked: I can't stand that shape head!!! I like a big, rounded jaw that I can clearly see on the horses profile.

Thanks for the great name for it!! :bgrin
 
Well im not going to "name types" as such as everyone has there own opionion and im not to sure what these would come under
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but these are my different "types" of horses that i own ...

7yr stallion

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3yr old mare

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2year old mare

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Heres another one i found, im trying to find older horses as i dont really like to judge a yearling who can change sooooo much
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i believe the proof is in there age

This mare is my own so im happy to criteque (sp??
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: ) her i took the photo too.

she placed in every class in the show ring always did extremly well yet i feel she is out of proportion (not a good pic only body shots i hav on computer) but her neck is to thick, her body and chest is large in comparison, yet if you look at her skinny fine legs and petite head that has a nice dish in the right place ...
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: i think this mare is where confusion starts as shes a mixture of fine and solid etc lol
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(by the way shes not fat this is her in show condition!! she never puts on weight she is just a solid little body mare. she is now 9 months pregnant and looks exactly the same and shes 3 rising 4 now)
 
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I agree with Mary and others that have stated you must surly be looking at different horses to the ones I have seen- I have never seen Arabs or QHs look like a Mini- and in the show QHs case at least- thank Goodness!!

Let's forget the breeds altogether- shall we??

Minis are MINIS- refined or heavier, not any particular breed, just what the breeder/owner cares to see when they look at their pasture.

There are trends in the show ring that are not too hard to follow, if you care to, without ruining your horses.

Of course, as always, a few poor deluded souls will follow it to the bitter end but all they will do (apart form winning LOADS) is ruin one particular bloodline- luckily for us we are such an eclectic bunch of people (we cannot even agree on one height!!) that we will never get to the point where only one type of Minisi being bred.

Vive la difference, I say.

Over here of course, Shetland is an insult- although I do like the breed it has NO place in modern Mini breeding and, of course, is a completely different breed and type to the "Shetlands" you breed.

Thus I am afraid, most of what you call "Mini QHs" would just be Shetland Type- and discarded- in the main, mostly rightly so.

Poor conformation and heavier legs does not make a Quarter Horse Type- at least, I sincerely hope it does not.

Jill, I have NO idea why you think Sunny is a QH type- I never have!!
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: I can only assume that, since you see him every day and know more about what he looks like than that one photo shows, you have made this assumption but I can assure you he is refined, and to me at least, looks very similar to the one you consider TB Type!!

Anyhoo, people, you cannot consider a horse any sort of "type" until it is a 4 yr old and has finished maturing.

Up till then it is just a youngster and we all know that clipped foals looked the most refined anyway- which is why I consider clipping foals (apart from daft but that is my personal opinion
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: ) to be a mild form of deceit.

Whether you are deluding yourself or the potential customer or the Judge is not really relevant.

Changes the colour too
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Over here of course, Shetland is an insult- although I do like the breed it has NO place in modern Mini breeding and, of course, is a completely different breed and type to the "Shetlands" you breed.

Thus I am afraid, most of what you call "Mini QHs" would just be Shetland Type- and discarded- in the main, mostly rightly so.
Much the same here in NZ i had never seen anything like the shtlands that are posted on here our shetlands are 9hh about 9hh wide and would carry 3 adults :bgrin i always thought that was a shetland amazed to see these tall fine horses
 
Here is one I think is refined but is "senior" at 5yo... but I think she looks good especially considering she has had 2 fillies already (including the silver buckskin I showed, "Harrells Flirting with Perfection"). Also, she passes that "cheek" or jowl onto her foals. This mare is pictured w/o ANY conditioning (and all mine are pictured w/o any sweating). I only clipped her and took her to a show to keep Flirt company since it was Flirt's first show (yet this mare took Grand Champion Senior Mare -- go figure!):

Harrells Rowdys Reflection of Hope
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HOPE%202007%20VMHC%20Summer%20Classic%20--%20057.jpg
 
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