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MooreAcres

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I post a thread about how gorgeous the horses are in the MHW practically ever time I get my new issue, but I just can't contain myself so here I go again...

I have to say that DD Silk Egyptian Stryker (front cover), owned by Palace Miniature Horse Farm LLC., is fantastic! I sat there staring at him for a few minutes before I finally forced myself to look inside.

All the Thousand Oak horses are just breathtaking. I have spoken to Sharman through email a few months ago and it turns out that they own a cousin to my Tango. This mare is bred to their handsome stallion Sir Lancelot, and I can't wait to see the foal. Speaking of...she probably already had it. Sharman, would you post a picture please if Crystal has indeed foaled?

Alliance Sign On The Dotted Line and AlliancePiano Man are two of the prettiest Appaloosas I have ever seen! (I have nothing against Appaloosas mind you)

Scott Creek Windwalker, Manipulator's Buckingham, NFC's Fire & Ice, Samis Tripolo, Champion Farms Sirs Signature, LITTLE KINGS BUCKEROO BACCARRA (my favorite stallion...
), Little Kings Buckeroo Bandolero (full brother to Baccarra and just as handsome), and SO SO SO many others!

I'll be staring at this magazine for weeks!

Erin
 
K

kaykay

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But did you read the color article?? I was just shocked as it said something like "a common misconception is that breeding roan to roan can throw a lethal roan foal. that simply isnt true"

I have always been told that breeding roan to roan gives you a 25 percent chance of a lethal roan foal. So thats not true???

Also i really didnt like that they put that there are very few true roans. It says that most roans are appalossa and are incorrectly identified. While i agree that alot of roans are incorrectly identified i dont agree that true roan miniatures are rare. I have one standing in my pasture with no appy background. She is definately a black roan (blue) and i have seen alot of other true roan minis.

Okay ill stop venting now LOL
 

Dona

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kaykay said:
But did you read the color article?? I was just shocked as it said something like "a common misconception is that breeding roan to roan can throw a lethal roan foal.  that simply isnt true"
I have always been told that breeding roan to roan gives you a 25 percent chance of a lethal roan foal.  So thats not true???

Also i really didnt like that they put that there are very few true roans.  It says that most roans are appalossa and are incorrectly identified.  While i agree that alot of roans are incorrectly identified i dont agree that true roan miniatures are rare.  I have one standing in my pasture with no appy background.  She is definately a black roan (blue) and i have seen alot of other true roan minis.

Okay ill stop venting now LOL

444244[/snapback]

I haven't seen the article yet....but they may be talking about roan "looking" horses in general. And even if they were talking about breeding "true roans"....well, technically, they are correct in that statement. Breeding true Roan to true Roan does NOT throw lethal roan foals. "Lethal Roan" fetuses abort (or reabsorb) early on in pregnancy so you would never know. It's not like the LW Overo foals who actually are born looking healthy, but die soon after birth. You don't get that with roans.

A "truer" statement would be.... "Breeding true roan to true roan will give you a 25% chance of CONCEIVING a lethal roan which will die in utero."

I don't know how "rare" true roans are in the Miniatures. But I do know there are a lot fewer of them than people think. There are so many other color genes/modifers that can mimic roan...such as Sabino & Appaloosa. Of course, if you are knowledgable about color genetics, you can pick out a "true" roan very easily...but generally, people call anything that has roaning a "Roan". (whether it be a horse that's going "gray", Sabino, or Appy.)
And sadly, this is reflected on their registration papers.
 
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wildoak

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I think this issue is an especially nice one - gorgeous horses to drool over and what looks like good articles, haven't had time to sit down and read yet.

Jan
 

minicount

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There are some very, very nice ads in the World this time. I would name some of my favorites but would end up leaving one out and feeling bad.

Doubt Barbara Naviaux? Perish the thought.
Not the first article that she has wrote that made me say what.

That roan to roan is lethal has not been proven or disproven.

Ok I'm hot and crabby and should not have set down at the computer.
 

Debby - LB

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Actually I've posted this a few times over the years when folks talk about lethal roans. Theorizing that the fetus dies in-utero when it carries two roan genes was disproved by Dr. Anne Bowling of the University of California at Davis before her death.

Quote...The original study that started that theory of lethal homozygous fetuses was never replicated, Dr. Bowling did a study and proved that the percentages of foals with and without color followed the statistical projection as if there was NO lethal state.

So, according to the modern research (2002, I believe), it is just fine to breed two roans together. Statistics for live foals will match any other color matings.
 

REO

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I agree that many of the horses are awesome! Totally drool worthy! MmMMMmMm!!!


And here I'm all happy that one of our very last ever Bran colts is on the bottom of page 128 with the SHG ad! We sure were shocked to get a blue eyed Tovero!
 
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kaykay

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i wasnt "doubting" Barb N. But this was what i had always read in color books and color sites. (regarding Lethal Roan foals--i guess we should say fetuses?) And i have seen posted many times on this forum not to breed Roan to Roan. Id really like to know since i own a roan. To me even losing a foal in utero is not a good situation. This could throw your breeding season off. For ex i breed roan to roan and she settles. Then two months later comes back in season because the foal died. Now im two months later into the season and have to rebreed the mare. But if this isnt at all true (as Debby posted) and there is no foal/fetus loss then id really like to know. Because then i would definately breed roan to roan.
 

[email protected]

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Debby is right about Anne's research regarding the roan (heterozygous).

Muc of the research is incomplete or flawed (as is much equine color), as it's based on old information and old theories.

Look at much of pinto info out there in print - it's not current for what has occurred in recent time with the new tests.

The same goes for much of the advances in other color testing.

I haven't seen the article, but as for true roans being appy - that is a crock if that is what was written. The problem does lie with people calling 'roaning' a roan. That is a big difference.
 

SBrown

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Erin, thanks for the compliment!

Yes, Crystal had her foal. We hand bred her and know she foaled a colt at 10 months gestation. Had a bumpy start with him but now he's doing great. He is on our "2005 Foals" page, Thousand Oaks Lancelots Merlin. I'll put photos below. We named this colt Merlin because he is indeed a magician. He was born a bay with dark blue eyes but at 2 weeks he lost all his hair except a few patches. Vet thought he had some mysterious disease, did blood work, took a skin biopsy and sent it to several places including Texas A&M. Everything came back normal. Sure enough his hair did grow back in but he is now black. Apparently it was stress from the early birth. He's a beautiful colt!

 

Amy

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Well, I have heard about the "lethal" roan gene-- again it seems that it absorbs rather than a foal born like a lethal white.

I don't know if it is true or not. However, we breed roan to roan each year & get lovely roan foals. We have red roan, blue roan, bay roan & of course the blue roan-- which is our very favorite.

Our buckeroo stallion is a true blue roan and several of our mares are roan as well.

I never thought roans were my favorite, but even now, when a horse catches my eye to make me turn around for another look, it is usually a roan. I really do love them it seems.

We had a matched pair (stallion & mare) of true blue roans & we drove them together-- they were absolutley stunning to look at. We lost the mare last year due to foaling complications. We have several different colored roan babies, so KayKay, I would tell you not to be afraid to breed them together.
 

rabbitsfizz

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Some of if not a lot of, the animals used in Dr Bowling's research were not true Roans, Sabinos and Appy roans were in there too. I have a Bay Roan mare who went empty four years bred to a minimal Roan stallion. As soon as I bred her to a non Roan she took. Coincidence?? No, I do not think so. As far as I am aware Roan X Roan will cause a percentage of reabsorbtion- I have never heard of abortion but do not preclude it's possibility. Doubt Naviaux- Yes, of course!! I will always question things that I do not accept as true, like all the stuff on "Silver" Chestnuts and Bay !!! If you do not agree you question. If you do not understand, you question. Only an idiot would object to being questioned and I do NOT believe Barbara Naviaux is an idiot!! We should never be afraid to question things, however "knowledgeable" and an "Authority" people are believed to be.

Myself included, although I do not believe myself to be an authority
 

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