Lori W
Well-Known Member
What are the reasons for DNA testing miniature horses? Is it to verify parentage, the possibility of genetic disorders, the color genes the horse carries? When would I want to have my horses tested?
DNA Testing
- Thread starter Lori W
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Kim~Crayonboxminiatures
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I've done it as required by AMHA rules, to prove parentage, and for color genetics.
ruffian
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There have been breeders in the past who's idea of proving parentage is "If it's a GOOD foal, then it's by Stallion ABC." If it's not, it's by a different one. Or farms that have several herds together with multiple stallions, with the idea that they will band together and not stray.
I had a mare show up prego that should have been open (purchased mare) and had to DNA. It was great to be able to prove who his daddy is.
I had a mare show up prego that should have been open (purchased mare) and had to DNA. It was great to be able to prove who his daddy is.
Carolyn R
Well-Known Member
I have had my horses DNA'd, if you will be breeding and registering in the AMHA you must do it in order to register the offspring. Some horses may not be parent qualified, meaning they have not had their DNA compared to their parents to verify their heritage, however their DNA is on file to compare their offspring to. The registry had to start somewhere.
Some horses prior to a certain date have been exempt, they are grandfathered in, but can still be DNA'd if one chooses in order to PQ their offspring.
Example, my Buckeroo son was DNA'd but not parent qualified. Being that he is a Buckeroo son I really wanted him PQ'd.
I tracked down the owners of his dam and offered to pay the fees to have her DNA'd. They were wonderful about it. I paid the fee, they sent in the test kit. When everything was complete, I requested the AMHA compare his DNA to change his status from "just being DNA'd" to "Parent Qualifying" him to prove his lineage. Voila, I now have a PQ'd Buckeroo son. Once the DNA is on file, it is the property of the AMHA, if someone sells a foal and it does not match the sire's DNA, AMHA has the right to run it against the other stallions that were on that property.
If you have a gelding, he does not need to be DNA'd because he will not be contributing to the gene pool.
You can also have genetic testing done on a horse to see what base color and color patterns it carries, once again, this is done for breeding reasons or to check for genetic disorders (to try to achieve certain color patterns, to avoid crossing horses that are both positive for LWO or genetic anomolies).
Some horses prior to a certain date have been exempt, they are grandfathered in, but can still be DNA'd if one chooses in order to PQ their offspring.
Example, my Buckeroo son was DNA'd but not parent qualified. Being that he is a Buckeroo son I really wanted him PQ'd.
I tracked down the owners of his dam and offered to pay the fees to have her DNA'd. They were wonderful about it. I paid the fee, they sent in the test kit. When everything was complete, I requested the AMHA compare his DNA to change his status from "just being DNA'd" to "Parent Qualifying" him to prove his lineage. Voila, I now have a PQ'd Buckeroo son. Once the DNA is on file, it is the property of the AMHA, if someone sells a foal and it does not match the sire's DNA, AMHA has the right to run it against the other stallions that were on that property.
If you have a gelding, he does not need to be DNA'd because he will not be contributing to the gene pool.
You can also have genetic testing done on a horse to see what base color and color patterns it carries, once again, this is done for breeding reasons or to check for genetic disorders (to try to achieve certain color patterns, to avoid crossing horses that are both positive for LWO or genetic anomolies).
I bought a mare last year ( shes 3 yrs this year) and when I sent her dna sample in it did not match the sire on her paperwork , the AMHA did find the sire and luckily he is already reg amha , but Im still trying to get the breeder to fill in a late stallion report , he agred but hasnt sent it ,( if I dont get the report can I still register her?)
as well as testing for AMHA I have also tested all my horss for LWO , Ive also tested for colours
as well as testing for AMHA I have also tested all my horss for LWO , Ive also tested for colours
Sue_C.
Well-Known Member
Personally, as this "breeder" has been so slack ALREADY in misrepresenting this horse on it's original registration papers, I would be on their butt like wet on water to get these papers in order. In cases like this, if the "breeders" don't step-up and take responsibility (I think they should pay any and ALL costs the buyer suffers) they (the breeder") should be penalized by the registry/association; as far as refusing to allow any of their future horses to be registered without DNA at the time of registration.
IMO, it is time to clean this mess up that is caused by the slack "breeders"...we hear this kind of story much too often.
Riverrose28
Well-Known Member
All of my AMHA breeding horses are tested, just ordered kits for two more. Some of my AMHR horses are tested for LWO, I am trying to get all breeding horses tested for color, just can't afford to do it all at one time.
I agree, it is done to prove parentage.... there were some breeders whose scruples were less than desireable when it came to listing the correct parents, so now AMHA requires it and PQ'ing also.
In answer to the question regarding if the breeder doesnt file a late stallion report- no, if they do not you cannot get papers unless you hardship at age 3 and pay a large some, have the horse inspected, etc.... Perhaps if you offer to pay the late fee?
In answer to the question regarding if the breeder doesnt file a late stallion report- no, if they do not you cannot get papers unless you hardship at age 3 and pay a large some, have the horse inspected, etc.... Perhaps if you offer to pay the late fee?
I have offered to pay all costs , but Ive since spoken to another woman who bought from the same farm and has had similar problems which did not get resolved , this is not a small time breeder , this is a very well known farm , probably the biggest in the country , I thought I was doing the right thing by buying from a well known breeder
Katiean
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DNA is to tell the parents of said animal. AMHA says any mare or stallion has to be DNA'd before a foal can be registered from said pair. I just did the DNA at the same time I registered my colt. I figure it just makes things easier when you have new foals. Besides, it leaves no room for question if your horses are "parent qualified".
l had a weaners PQ come back from AMHA 2 years ago the listed stallion didn't match...turns out looking at my copy of the stallion report l sent in that it was my fault because l listed the mare under the wrong stallion for that year on the stud report l sent in. So if there was no PQ or DNA the foal would have ended up having the wrong sire on her pedigree..
Little Wolf Ranch
Well-Known Member
I don't really mess with AMHA and only register AMHR so none of mine are DNA'd or PQ'd - the only reason I do DNA testing here is for LWO +/- safety for breeding purposes.
I do believe that if a breeder chooses to run multiple bands together in the same pasture - they have to DNA & PQ all the sires, dams and foals!
I do believe that if a breeder chooses to run multiple bands together in the same pasture - they have to DNA & PQ all the sires, dams and foals!
Katiean
Well-Known Member
There is also always "THAT BREEDER" that will have an unregistered horse that they will put the papers from another on it. I knew people that did the same with AKC dogs. I think you should DNA everything if it is registered no matter the animal. Well, maybe not rabbits and the small inexpensive animals. The cost would not be worth it with them.
Songcatcher
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That practice was once used many years ago when registration was OPEN. That is why in some pedigrees you can see dam listed and sire unknown. However, that practice is no longer acceptable according to the rules in either registry. ACCORDING to the AMHR rules, a foal cannot be registered if the mare was exposed to two different stallions during the same heat cycle. I do not know if they make an exception if the foal is DNA tested and Parentage Qualified or not, but without DNA testing, who ever knows if the owner exposes the mare to multiple stallions and just chooses the one he wants to list?
Sue_C.
Well-Known Member
And THEY keep getting away with it...why??? Because they CAN. As far as I am aware, there is no penalty imposed upon these bad "breeders" at all...so why should they clean up their acts??
I have said for years now that there should be a way to post the names of repeatedly bad sellers and breeders...it wouldn't take long for them to either smarten the heck up, or go out of business...preferably the LATTER.
In a case like this, I would send my request through a lawyer, via a registered letter...they would have to reply, or suffer consequences... Whatever it would cost for that one letter, ($100-$150 maybe?) I think it would be worth it...otherwise, the $$ spent on the horse is a total waste as it is unregisterable.
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targetsmom
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I am glad that AMHA requires the DNA testing. I have had all my breeding stock (but not geldings or non-breeding mares) DNAd AND parentage qualified. I love having those blue papers and knowing that at least the sire and dam are correct, especially if they are well-known. I think some cases where the DNA doesn't match are due to stallions being sneaky or poor record keeping .. but not all cases.
I also do color testing, especially for LWO, but to me that is a very different thing. Definitely important for LWO, but otherwise just interesting.
I also do color testing, especially for LWO, but to me that is a very different thing. Definitely important for LWO, but otherwise just interesting.
Joanne
Well-Known Member
We DNA and Parentage Qualify all our horses and all our foals.
We also require parentage qualification on the horses we buy. We have, and will pass on buying any horses if the breeders are not willing to PQ the horse we want to buy from them. I am not willing to bring them in and find that they do not PQ. That is the breeders responsibility to prove who the parents are, not the new owners.
We also require parentage qualification on the horses we buy. We have, and will pass on buying any horses if the breeders are not willing to PQ the horse we want to buy from them. I am not willing to bring them in and find that they do not PQ. That is the breeders responsibility to prove who the parents are, not the new owners.
No longer breeding horses, but when I did - I DNA tested and parentage qualified ALL of my AMHA-registered foals....and really looked long and hard with more than a bit of wariness at any breeders unwilling to do the same. I didn't want to "buy a pig in a poke". (boy! I'm really showing my age with that cliche)
Michelle@wescofarms
Well-Known Member
We DNA/PQ all our foals, and I've gone back and DNA (PQ if possible) all breeding stock we have purchased over the years. That was an expensive project but I felt it was worth it.
I want people to know what they're buying is what I'm saying it is! The only ones I may not DNA/PQ is a gelding (if he wasn't DNA/PQ'd as a foal), as what's the point, he can't be used for breeding.
I won't buy a horse that isn't DNA/PQ tested. I also like to see a pedigree with a few generations DNA/PQ'd if possible too.
It's good to remember the PQ part is the important part of this anyway. All the DNA states is the hair sent in is that hair. The PQ matches against the parents DNA test, so you know who sire/dam are.
I'm sure the crooks can fake all that as well, but it's a better guarantee the horses parentage is what you say it is - IMHO!
I want people to know what they're buying is what I'm saying it is! The only ones I may not DNA/PQ is a gelding (if he wasn't DNA/PQ'd as a foal), as what's the point, he can't be used for breeding.
I won't buy a horse that isn't DNA/PQ tested. I also like to see a pedigree with a few generations DNA/PQ'd if possible too.
It's good to remember the PQ part is the important part of this anyway. All the DNA states is the hair sent in is that hair. The PQ matches against the parents DNA test, so you know who sire/dam are.
I'm sure the crooks can fake all that as well, but it's a better guarantee the horses parentage is what you say it is - IMHO!
