Buyer and Sellers

[Windhaven]

Now we know this is a busy time of year for people. Many of us are looking to buy and MANY are looking to sell. Whether it be a show prospect or a breeding prospect, there a are many of us shopping and selling. MOST of us can't make it to every farm we go to, so have to go on the information that the buyer presents.

Now for the buyers:

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?

I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible. If sellers refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping?

Many of us are on a budge and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for. So would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse?

Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from? If so what do you like to see clipped?

How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos?

How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo?

How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)?

Now for the sellers:

Some sellers feel that most people can't see the real horse from fuzzy photos. How many feel there is a way to do a minimal clip so people can see the outline of horse?

Do you still provide fuzzy photos in hopes of making a sale?

Do you refuse to take fuzzy photos and wait until spring even if you might loose the prospect buyer?

If you take fuzzy photos, what do you clip and how do you prepare the horse for the pictures?

How many take new photos every year of young stock (up to age 2 or 3) that they might consider selling?

Are you more willing to come down in price if prospective buyers buy without seeing updated photos?

Do you feel that by not taking fuzzy photos you might be loosing prospective buyers?

How many provide halter and movement photos?

How many think they need to just buy movement or halter photos?

I hope this becomes an informative topic that help people find better ways to market horses for sellers and buyers.

 

[Marty]

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?

No, there is a big change during those years. With a 2 year old pic, you pretty much know what you are getting.

I lost more sales than I can count these past three months and one reason is because I am not willing to risk shaving my horses in the dead of winter for nobody. I wouldn't even head and neck them. I provided summer/fall pictures of the horses in short hair that were taken in every pose imaginable including bite and legs plus a recent video prior to hair growth. That should have been recent enough for grown horses. Sorry, but their health is foremost and I will not compromise that.

Also I learned the biggy: Never, and I mean never buy a horse from a professional show picture with make up. Got a horse shipped in here one time years ago and I said "What horse is that?" when the shipper arrived. Sure didn't look anything like the pictures I saw. A huge lesson learned.

 

[Windhaven]

So Marty just curious, would you take fuzzy photos if asked?

I also agree I won't clip a horse this time of year for health reasons, but I will do what I call a winter clip and take fuzzy photos of young stock (coming yearlings and coming 2 year olds). All my mature horses have updated pictures.

 

[wingnut]

As a potential buyer (although I'm not in the market to buy anything right now), here's how I look at it:

I've seen enough post-clip photos on this site to know that sometimes what is under all the fuzz is incredibly different.

I would NOT insist a seller provide a current, even semi-clipped photo during the middle of the winter. IMHO, that's not good horsemanship to ask that a horse to be clipped and their health risked as a result.

No, I would not expect that a 2 yr old horse could be judged from a weanling photo.

If we ever get to a point where I would be purchasing a horse from a farm where I couldn't physically visit to inspect, I would likely buy in that circumstance after forming some sort of relationship with the breeder/seller. I would have to have a greater understanding of bloodlines. I would be seeking opionions and recommendations from my fellow miniature folks who are more experienced in this kind of buying.

All that said, I'll never know exactly what I would do until I'm in the middle of such a situation.

 

[Maple Hollow Farm]

Now for the buyers:

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?

Personally no I would not buy a horse that is only advertised by weanling photos, horses change a LOT from the time they are weanlings to the time they are 2yr olds. I would be wondering why dont they add new pictures, is the horse malnutritioned, cowhocked, or what?

I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible. If sellers refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping?

I would keep shopping, if you are a seller your purpose is to please the customer therefore get the best fuzzy picture you can, people can tell if a fuzzy horse is a good one if they look.

Many of us are on a budge and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for. So would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse?

I might look at the new pictures but chances are I am not going to buy.

Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from? If so what do you like to see clipped? Bridal path is a must, minimal trimming on the whiskers and under the chin and throatlatch, just to kind of reshape the head. Body you can tell even when they are fuzzy if they are cowhocked, overweight, or anything like that.

How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos? If you really look at a horse in their fuzzies you can still see the general outline of the horse, you can tell if they have straight legs, level topline, and good weight.

How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo? I bought my new driving stallion off of fuzzy pictures but havent clipped him yet but even now I am happy with how he looks.

How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)? Depends on what I would be looking to buy, if I am looking specifically for a driver and dont care if it can do halter or not then I might not need the halter pose.

Now for the sellers:

Some sellers feel that most people can't see the real horse from fuzzy photos. How many feel there is a way to do a minimal clip so people can see the outline of horse? You def. can trim up the head and throat latch to make the horse more visible. I feel that the head is the major turnoff when they are fuzzy because they can have a gorgeous head buy you cant tell because of the hair.

Do you still provide fuzzy photos in hopes of making a sale? If someone asks for current pictures, I take them because that person is the customer and the whole purpose of a sale is to please a customer.

Do you refuse to take fuzzy photos and wait until spring even if you might loose the prospect buyer? No.

If you take fuzzy photos, what do you clip and how do you prepare the horse for the pictures? I will do a bridle path, minimal whisker trimming (just shortening not completely removing), and under the head to the throatlatch. If the horse has some major feathering on the legs I will sometimes trim that down too. I also use miracle groom to smooth and shine the hair a little on the body.

How many take new photos every year of young stock (up to age 2 or 3) that they might consider selling? I definitely take new ones especially in the summer that way if someone asks right after they start fuzzing up if I have a recent picture I can send them that one and say it was from which ever month but I can still get current fuzzy pictures if they need them too.

Are you more willing to come down in price if prospective buyers buy without seeing updated photos? No, without seeing the horse with current photos how can they know how much the horse is worth to them to even offer any amount?

Do you feel that by not taking fuzzy photos you might be loosing prospective buyers? Yes.

How many provide halter and movement photos? I provide both unless I cant get help to get the halter pose and then it would be just movement until I have someone here to either hold a horse or take the picture.

How many think they need to just buy movement or halter photos? Both are important and keeps you open to both halter and performance buyers. If you only have the halter pose the performance shoppers wont look as closely because they want a pretty athletic moving horse. Halter people wont be as happy with the movement poses because they want to see the horse standing square for correctness and proportion.

This is all just my opinion but hopefully it helps, I am interested in seeing other replies!

 

[~Lisa~]

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?No, there is a big change during those years. With a 2 year old pic, you pretty much know what you are getting.

Also I learned the biggy: Never, and I mean never buy a horse from a professional show picture with make up. Got a horse shipped in here one time years ago and I said "What horse is that?" when the shipper arrived. Sure didn't look anything like the pictures I saw. A huge lesson learned.

I couldnt agree more anyone can pose a horse to look good. Well not anyone but a good handler. I am not on that list LOL

Was a buyer and seller I want mature pictures of a mature horse and ask for them to be taken just hanging out in their turn out or pasture in a few of them.

To be honest more then the picture (and usually I know within 3 seconds if I am interested in that horse or not ) I am always sold on a honest seller who is reasonable in answering my questions and who takes the time to tell me about the horse personality wise and how they feel it will fit in with what I am looking for

 

[disneyhorse]

Now for the buyers:

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?

Nope, probably not. Would buy a weanling but if the horse is older and there is no good reason the seller can't take photos, I won't even bother!

I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible. If sellers refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping?

Maybe, it depends if I REALLY liked the horse. Like, if I owned it's full sibling or something, or LOVE the stallion and think the mare the horse is out of is pretty nice, and the price is right...

Many of us are on a budge and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for. So would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse?

If I'm shopping for a horse and the right one comes along, or if I have space and money for a horse and the right one comes along, and it's advertised current and correctly, I'd buy

Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from? If so what do you like to see clipped?

How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos?

I have good weather here in So. California. I can tell if it has decent legs by the way the feet are pointing and somewhat of the body depending on the amount of fur. If the horse is just too furry I'd pass. But a bridle path/beard/throatlatch clip is always good.

How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo?

Usually have been pretty happy.

How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)?

I only buy off of halter photos, but if you can get me a good MOVING photo I am SOLD!!! I have sold a couple of very nice LOOKING horses because I was disappointed with how they MOVED. But I do have a goal of buying a horse that I can halter, until its performance career.

Now for the sellers:

Some sellers feel that most people can't see the real horse from fuzzy photos. How many feel there is a way to do a minimal clip so people can see the outline of horse?

I have the luxury of milder winters, so usually I belly clip, clip the underside of the neck to make it look as long and clean as possible, and clip bridlepath and beard so the head looks as attractive as possible. I don't want to completely shave my horses, but I want the buyer to see the horse presented in its current state, as clipped and honest as I can.

Do you still provide fuzzy photos in hopes of making a sale?

Yep, every buyer who cannot come visit the horse in person deserves to see as many pictures (and maybe even short video, as my old digital camera can take videos and I can post on YouTube) as possible. In this day and age, there is NO excuse for it. I remember i inquired about a horse at Little King Farm, she only had halter photos, she ran right out, turned the horse to an indoor arena and videoed it and e-mailed me the video. i was sure impressed and actually regret not buying him. But that is good salesmanship right there.

Do you refuse to take fuzzy photos and wait until spring even if you might loose the prospect buyer?

Nope, a buyer deserves a seller who will jump through hoops within reason. If the buyer wants furry pictures, then they should get them. As long as they are not asking for a full body clip or something unreasonable like that. If the buyer can't understand that minis are furry this time of year, then maybe they aren't the right buyer.

If you take fuzzy photos, what do you clip and how do you prepare the horse for the pictures?

I clean the horse as good as possible (brush and/or blow with the vacuum) and clip as described above.

How many take new photos every year of young stock (up to age 2 or 3) that they might consider selling?

I take pictures of EVERY horse I consider selling constantly. Well, I take pictures of all my horses constantly, for sale or not. But it's good to have MANY pictures to provide your buyers... "Here is the pictures of them playing in the pasture this spring, and here they are in their great summer coat... here they are now, getting furry for winter..." The more pictures you take, the more likely you will be to get GOOD pictures, too!

Are you more willing to come down in price if prospective buyers buy without seeing updated photos?

No, because they GET their updated photos!

Do you feel that by not taking fuzzy photos you might be loosing prospective buyers?

Yes. I don't feel that you have to have the furry pictures on your website versus the past summer's pictures, but you should have them on hand or run out and take them if you can.

How many provide halter and movement photos?

Yes, both are very important, to market the horse to both halter and performance buyers. Plus I feel my horses can do both!

How many think they need to just buy movement or halter photos?

Like I said, they are both important.

Andrea

 

[targetsmom]

We bought 6 of our 7 purchased minis either in January with VERY hairy coats, or as weanlings. The seventh we bought as a pregnant mare and were more concerned with what her foals looked like than how she looked at the time.

We did not ask for clipped photos in the winter, but we did get to see - and feel - each of those minis before purchase. One was actually brought to our farm for us to look at!!! At one farm it rained and we were able to get a pretty good look at conformation with her hair slicked down. We did have summer photos of all of them. We didn't reject anyone based on fuzz.

For the weanlings - we only bought one sight unseen and we had great photos and a video of her. Others were clipped. But babies can change.....

Some of the things that were key for us:

Bought from people we trusted, who answered our questions, and provided videos (or delivered the mini!). We would not buy without seeing movement or video. We rejected some minis based on their videos.

We checked out as many siblings, sires, dams, foals, etc as we possibly could.

We sought advice from others (videos/photos). Plus, I had years and years (OK, 50 yrs now) of big horse experience.

And maybe we got lucky..... We are happy with all those purchases and still have them all.

 

[Mominis]

I am a potential buyer right now, so I'll answer that end of things.

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos?

Absolutely not.

I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible. If sellers refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping?

I'd hate to miss out on a good horse by not waiting. If the horse was everything I wanted in movement and breeding, then I'd wait.

Many of us are on a budge and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for. So would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse?

No, but I am just looking for one at the moment.

Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from? If so what do you like to see clipped?

I would prefer to wait until spring and get the full look of the horse, body clipped and clean. Sure, you can see if the horse has the pretty with just a head and neck clip, but you jst can't get a real feel for the body unless you are there in person to be able to look from several angles or you can get a bodyclipped shot (or one with the horse shed out fully).

How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos?

I think that the fuzz can make me question what I see and I feel that I have a pretty good eye. So, when investing in a horse, I would wait and not rush into a purchase.

How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo?

I wouldn't but off of just fuzzy and baby photos, especially if the horse were over two and I couldn't see photos of him fuzzy or at least from recent months.

How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)?

Again, I wouldn't buy off of just moving photos. Legs can be funny things and without seeing the horse standing with all four on the floor, I would wonder about his leg conformation.

 

[Marty]

So Marty just curious, would you take fuzzy photos if asked?

Yes absolutely. I have and am more than anxious to stand on my head to please, just ain't going to shave a horse in winter.

 

[Minimor]

Now for the buyers:

If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos? I have bought yearlings from their foal and weanling photos. Don't know as I would buy a 2 year old & older based on just a foal photo--well, not a Mini anyway. A Shetland...I have to say yes, because actually I will be doing that very thing--I've seen foal photos & one yearling photo of the pony when she's just coming out of a very growthy, awkward stage--not a flattering photo really--but with a pony I am willing to purchase from just those photos, even though the pony is now coming 2. After all, I do know how hard it is sometimes to find time & opportunity to take some good photos, and in this case I'm comfortable with the seller's word.

I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible. If sellers refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping? I would probably wait--would depend on how well I liked the horse & other things. Depending on the horse & the seller I might buy anyway--again, especially if it were a pony rather than a Mini.

Many of us are on a budge and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for. So would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse? I would definitely go back & have a look at the clipped photos, and if I had the money to buy then yes, I would still buy.

Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from? If so what do you like to see clipped? Depends on where the horse is located. If the horse is in a milder climate, throatlatch & bridle path could be clipped IMO--hair on croup could be long clipped (with the hair) and so could the belly...or those two areas could at least be flattened down some with gel or water. But, in the northern areas (like here & similar areas) then no--I would say that any clipping at all is out of the question.

How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos? Parts of the horse--yes, can get some idea, other parts no, very difficult. You can see how straight the legs are even when they're hairy--you can't always judge (from a photo) just how fine or coarse boned the legs are. You cannot always judge neck length & refinement of throatlatch in fuzzy photos, nor can you tell what the croup is really like. That big fuzzy peak of hair on top the croup could be hiding a lovely flat croup, or it could just be following a very peaked rear end!! If you visit the horse in person you can get a better idea, IMO, because you can be hands on & FEEL the legs, and feel the croup & neck to see just what is hair and what is actually horse!

How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo?

I have bought some very fuzzy foals(more in person than from photos, and not always tame ones that I got to touch) and have been very pleased with most of them once I saw them without their fuzzies. One could have a smoother croup but I knew that was a risk with that colt--and since he's meant to be a driving gelding it really doesn't matter all that much.

How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)?

I do like to see a conformation shot, but definitely want good movement so like to see the action ones too.

edited to add: I forgot to mention that I would never buy any horse off of professional show photos only. It's nice to see one or two of those mixed in with the other photos, but I definitely want ordinary photos of the horse, that show him as he really is. Some professional photos can make a horse look so unlike himself that you almost wouldn't believe it's the same horse when you compare the reality to that professsion photo.

 

[krissy3]

From my expierence here and for some of my friends in the same boat . I will never purchase a horse under age 3. Its too hard to estimate the height , and AMHR is not recognised here YET, other than an open schooling class. There are too many breeders here that sell oversized horses swearing that they will stay within AMHA measurements. I also will not buy a horse again without seeing it and having the horse for a week trial first , so I can see how it moves once its in a big pasture with some space. If I purchase from a person overseas I will get to know the person first , to make sure they are honest and wont just sell me their reject horses. We have had different horses show up in Amsterdam ..OOPS I like to see the horse clipped, and see how it did in the show season, so I purchase right after the show season when the horse is clipped. Others may do it differently. If I know and trust the breeder , I am not so worried.

 

[Ellen]

As a buyer, I try to find what I need early, but if I can not....I ask for clipped pics and a shot now woolie is fine, then I have a good idea. I will not by on a weanling shot, unless it is a weanling. But I don't epect anyone to clip if it is cold.

As a seller, I will clip a neck and throat latch if it isn't too cold yet. I always have current photos. Moving pictures are fine, I will take those anytime, but if I say it is broke to cart, I will send cart pictures. Pictures of the property, what ever they want, but past October, no clipping will be done!

 

[albahurst]

I take clipped photos in the summer and will be glad to send fuzzy photos in the winter. I will not do even a head/neck clip in the winter-it is TOO cold. It was 30 below here a week or so ago- I am not even cutting bridle paths right now. But, I am glad to bundle up and go out for the fuzzy photos any time - which I have done recently in quite cold temps. I update many photos in the summer.

I think growing horses need new photos updated at least once a year, if not more often.

Good questions, Marcy~

Peggy

 

[Allure Ranch]

[SIZE=12pt]Now for the buyers:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]1) If photos are of a weanling and the horse is coming 2 or older, would you buy from the weanling photos? [/SIZE]

ANSWER: Depends on who the seller is....

2) I know most people want their show horses and breeding stock at their farm as early as possible so if the seller refuses to take new fuzzy photos and wants to wait until spring (when they can clip), would you wait if you liked the horse or would you keep shopping?

ANSWER: I wouldn't expect them to clip the horse in winter. Nor would I really want them to do so....

3) Many of us are on a budget and usually 1 or 2 more are what we are looking for so would you still go back to the farm to look at the clipped photos and still buy, even if you already found a horse?

ANSWER: If I liked the horse in the first place I would typically purchase it verses missing out on it.

4) Do you feel that there is a way to do a minimal clip on the horse and get pictures good enough for you to buy from?

ANSWER: Of Course.... Take a look at Mulligan's Run and Limestone clips

5) If so what do you like to see clipped?

ANSWER: Head/Neck

6) How many feel they can see the real horse from fuzzy photos?

ANSWER: Depends on how fuzzy the horse is

7) How many have bought off fuzzy and baby photos (combined) and where happy when they clipped their horse or wished they would of waited for a spring clip photo?

ANSWER: I've purchased several from fuzzy photos and was NEVER disappointed

8) How many buy off just moving photos (no halter photos)?

ANSWER: N/A for me

 

[Allure Ranch]

[SIZE=12pt]Now for the sellers:[/SIZE]

1) Some sellers feel that most people can't see the real horse from fuzzy photos. How many feel there is a way to do a minimal clip so people can see the outline of horse?

ANSWER: If someone really wanted I'd do the same exact clip that Mulligans Run and Limestone are doing.

2) Do you still provide fuzzy photos in hopes of making a sale?

ANSWER: Of course

3) Do you refuse to take fuzzy photos and wait until spring even if you might loose the prospect buyer?

ANSWER: Nope....

4) If you take fuzzy photos, what do you clip and how do you prepare the horse for the pictures?

ANSWER: Refer to answer above....

5) How many take new photos every year of young stock (up to age 2 or 3) that they might consider selling?

ANSWER: If someone is interested in a specific horse I'll take new photos

6) Are you more willing to come down in price if prospective buyers buy without seeing updated photos?

ANSWER: NO.... Our price is reflective of the horse. If I consider giving a discount its purely based on what you'll be doing with the horse and the home that you'll be providing. That's what's important to me.

7) Do you feel that by not taking fuzzy photos you might be loosing prospective buyers?

ANSWER: Of course

8) How many provide halter and movement photos?

ANSWER: I typically take a flip video of the horse

9) How many think they need to just buy movement or halter photos?

ANSWER: N/A to me but possibly the buyer

 

[LaVern]

I bought a couple yesterday. Kind of went like this.

Buyer- Hey ya got anything I need?

Seller - Yah, couple fillies

Buyer -How big they gonna get?

Seller-About 35-36

Buyer-How much you gotta have for the two?

Seller-$$$$

Buyer- Okay, I'll send the money soon.

I know the people and what they have-- and they know me and what I like.

Reg. Pictures came after the sale of one of them.