Bloodlines?

[Horse Feathers]

How far back in a horses bloodline is a TOP HORSE worth taking notice of?

 

[MindyLee]

NONE! In my opinion.

If you like what you see, bloodlines should'nt stop you from being interested in it.

I have a mare whos bloodlines are'nt much to look at but her beauty and confermation is. And that's what everyone comments on. Not her bloodlines.

BUT...

If I was looking for beauty, confermation, movement, AND BLOODLINES in a horse... I would look as far back as I possibly can.

I personally have all the horses names that are in each and every horse I own written down so that way I know. Plus when I sell a foal, the buyer has the same knowledge as well.

 

[Katiean]

As stated before, you would look at bloodlines last. However, If bloodlines were important to me, I would want something to show on the pedigree that I get from AMHA/AMHR known as it's papers. I don't want to have to search back 10 generations and say "Oh look, he has 'MR. GO' in his lines." If you have to search for it, it is too far back.

 

[targetsmom]

I say "it depends". If the horse itself is crap, it doesn't matter who is in the bloodlines. If the horse is nice (what YOU are looking for) then having a well-known sire or grandsire - or even great grandsire - might be a plus. For me, I like to look at all the horses in the pedigree and try to avoid big holes. For example, maybe the name horse is a couple of generations back, but on the dam's side, HER sire was also a big name. Or maybe she was well-known in her own right (e.g. National Champion).

One thing to remember is that the characteristics you see in any horse came from the horses in its pedigree. So I figure that the more you know about them, the better. For example, we have a gray frame overo mare with Blue Boy and Rowdy in her pedigree but not real close. But we can guess her gray color came from Blue Boy and her blue eye is from Rowdy. Of course, those are pretty easy to see but we think there are lots of other characteristics she got from those two that might not be so obvious but are definite assets. We don't think it was a fluke that her first foal (Max) is outstanding.

 

[Minimor]

I do think bloodlines are important in a breeding animal. You can have a very nice mare or stallion, "perfect conformation" and lovely movement, but if there is nothing behind that animal then it's a complete crapshoot what that horse will pass on to its foals. Even with a pedigree with one or two good animals, if there's no consistancy to type and conformation, if out of the 4 generation pedigree there are one or two top animals and the rest are mediocre, then there will be no consistancy in the foals. This is a common thing in the Miniatures--lack of consistancy.

In Morgans, line breeding has been very common. In a 4 or 5 generation pedigree you are likely to see the same name several times--or you may see several names which are different but which you know all go back to a common ancestor another 2 or 3 generations further back. Those pedigrees ensure a good amount of consistancy. There are Morgan stallions that time after time sire foals of the same type and quality. Even when bred to mares that are an outcross, the strong genetics of the stallion will show through, and the foal will come out looking very much like all the other foals by that particular stallion. This is considered a good thing, assuming the stallion is a quality animal & sires quality foals. Obviously a stallion that is line bred to a poor quality individual is going to sire consistantly poor foals--if you're going to have a stallion that sires 'rubber stamp' foals obviously you want him to be a good quality animal that sires good quality foals!!

I like to see good breeding in the first 4 generations of the pedigree. One top animal amongst a lot of dogs doesn't do anything for me--I like to know what those 4 generatins of horses looked like, and they need to be animals I like. If it's a non-breeding animal then the horse standing in front of me is what counts, but if I'm selecting the horse for breeding I have to like the immediate ancestors. If the mare is the most lovely creature going, but her sire and dam were two of the ugliest horses I've ever seen then I'm not going to take that mare as a broodmare. It would be just my luck that she would produce foals that were every bit as ugly as her sire & dam combined!! And if her sire & dam are undesirable to me then it doesn't matter to me that there are 3 top names in the 3rd or 4th generation.

In Morgans I have also seen a foal throw back 6 or 7 generations--the colt was nothing like any closer ancestors, he was the spitting image of a stallion back those extra generations. I know others that have said they had the same thing happen--and in view of that it is important to me to have a horse that has as many good horses for as many generations back as possible--difficult with the Minis, because they are a relatively new "breed" with a very hodge podge ancestry.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I agree with Minimor. I am a horse breeder, therefore bloodlines and pedigree are important, they have to be....have you heard the saying "Handsome is as handsome does"? It is no good having a beautiful animal (if you have bought it specifically to breed, that is) if it has funny looking babies.

Having a "tight" pedigree of good animals does not guarantee the outcome, but it makes it a lot more likely than something with an "open" or no pedigree.

But, to answer the OP's question....I expect the sire and dam to be good, proven, animals, and I expect the grandparents to be the same.

I would not count as "Champion bred, from "King of the Universe" lines" a horse who had "king of the Universe" as his great grandsire, unless all the animals in between had been winners in their own right.

If the horses only claim to pedigree fame is that it's great grandsire was famous, then no, that would not do it for me.

 

[ruffian]

The only thing a horse in a pedigree gets is my attention if there isn't a photo - for example at a well run auction that doesn't have photos up yet. A name such as Buckeroo, Dandy, Blue Boy, etc., will make me more likely to come back to the horse and look at the photo when it's up or when it comes through the auction.

That would be only horses in the first 3-4 generations.

 

[disneyhorse]

Bloodlines are NOT what the emphasis of a "quality animal" should be... but they still should BE there! In breeding animals I always hope to have it all... personality, trainability, conformation, movement, health, AND bloodlines.

That said, I usually want a SON or DAUGHTER of proven (breeding or show) horses. Further back than that is too diluted for me.

Andrea