Market for the small AMHA

[pam]

I am pretty concerned about what is happening with the market for the small AMHA … I love my miniatures, but …. It is so expensive to keep 13 mares/two stallions – taking the best possible care of them, and then having problems selling the babies…. I guess I am just tired…. It is hard working at my full time teaching job and then also taking care of a small herd of horses, and the expense is huge when you do it right… although I have three babies coming this summer, I doubt if I will breed for 2013.

There is NO market for miniatures in our area – they think of them as $50 pocket pets. My main goal is for my babies to go to good homes – however, one can’t even give away colts in our area 

Hoping that the market improves soon…. I do not want to have a herd dispersal, but my husband and I work long hours, and we are NOT getting any younger…. decisions decisions…. What do others think the future of the tiny AMHA horses will be?

 

[Becky]

Personally, I think the market for small horses is good. Prices aren't generally as high as in years past, but sales have been good for me. I breed 34" and under horses and plan to continue to do so for many years to come. But, it's just like anything else. To sell, you have to advertise, advertise, advertise!

 

[targetsmom]

Personally, I think there will always be a market for miniature horses but that we as breeders (or the registries) may need to modify our marketing techniques. In this economy, fewer people will have the disposable income for horses of any size, and even fewer will be looking for minis as a tax deduction. But what about the people who can no longer afford to keep their "big" horses but might be able to fit a mini in the budget? What if they were educated about all the things the minis could do such as driving, CDEs, therapy work, in-hand dressage, and showing in classes as diverse as showmanship, trail, costume, jumping, and liberty?

We are just starting a 4-H Club for minis and the response has been incredible! A couple of members already have minis and the rest are very interested. We have had to put half of them on a waiting list. Our group represents a wide range in ages (7-15 years), abilities, and racial/ethnic diversity. I also heard from an 83 year old in my town who is thinking of getting a mini. I think the interest in minis - at least in my area - is alive and well, and the goal now is to do some education.

I would also point out that if you check the purchases made by forum members in the past year, there seems to be a very good market for top quality minis.

 

[disneyhorse]

What sort of advertising do you do on the Internet and/or at the shows in your area?

You keep saying "in our area" but honestly many of the horses I've bought and sold (probably MOST of them) have been out of my area. There is a buyer for every horse, and personally I think the market has been much better recently!

The market is pretty saturated with decent quality minis... I don't know your breeding program but buyers are getting pretty discriminating if you are looking to sell to a show or breeding home (I mean an educated breeder of course).

Professional photography, a horse trained to do something, a show record... these things often mean the difference between a horse that sells and one that doesn't. Of course they are not necessary, but if a buyer has a choice between two similar horses, the buyer often picks the horse that has some sort of edge over another.

Although some bloodlines and such are more popular over others at the moment, there still are buyers of every kind of horse whether it's an under-28" AMHA gelding, or a Roadster type ASPC/AMHR stallion. All minis have merits to someone out there!

Good luck to you,

Andrea

 

[fourluckyhorseshoes]

Just wondering what area are you located in?

 

[pam]

Muncie, IN...

 

[ohmt]

Most of my inquiries lately have been for under 30" and show quality. I think the hardest to sell are 34"-35" range. Nobody wants a horse at the top of the height for AMHA in case they go over or produce over, and nobody wants a very small B to show in AMHR against the really tall horses (many local shows just have 34"-38").

I think there will always be a good market or the small minis, just have to keep up with marketing and do some 'out of the box' things to get attention. A good website is also key. All horses I have sold in the past few years have gone to other states. Most to SD, CA, or TX. I have just had to do a little bit of creative financing to help people with shipping costs, etc. Oh yes, and good pictures and videos really, really help. I had to practice a lot to finally be able to get decent pics. I am terrible!

 

[pam]

I gave away a beautiful palomino son last year - he was shown in the Indiana Mini Club and got reserve high point horse in their club, along with other awards.... He was double registered. I realize I need to get back into showing, along with getting professional pics - agree with everyone's comments.... I have just been worried that many seem to be jumping on the Shetland/AMHR bandwagon, and wonder if the tiny mini's still have much a market????

Thanks for everyone's input...

 

[Maple Hollow Farm]

I dont think the smaller minis will ever go out, we still focus on the AMHA/AMHR horses and have no desire to venture into the ASPC world. While we have nothing against shetlands (there are tons of gorgeous ones, just like with other breeds) we simply dont want to breed for them. The quality smaller minis are much harder to achieve than the taller horses, it has taken a lot of years of selective breeding to get to where they are today! Hope I said this right so as to not offend anyone, I am always nervous posting anything like this on here

.

 

[disneyhorse]

Sounds good, Maple Hollow Farm!

I myself am very much in love with the ASPC/AMHR horse, but I don't think that everyone will want to go that route and they shouldn't. I do love that in the entire realm of the "Small Equine" there IS a horse for everyone and I think the diversity is the biggest asset (although it's always debated, because people feel there should be "one type" or "breed standard" or they firmly like the "look" of one type of small equine or another.)

Some people don't want to breed/show ASPC/AMHR, they want to breed 28" and under horses and that is just fine!~!! No one program is more or less valuable than another.

Andrea

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

I do agree with Andrea...their variety is part of the allure - something for everybody!

However (and there's always a however in life

), I do feel that if both registries did certain things that would help to promote the smaller ones, like enforcing the judging standard of all things being equal, smaller horse is placed higher, etc., they would do themselves a favor. What do I mean? Well, think about if at World or Nationals, the 28" and under class and the 28-30 class had as many horses as the 32-34" class? That would be awesome! More entries, more options for people to show, more horses for trainers to take, bigger market for sellers (offer horses of all heights), more money all around! A bigger market always means more money and more money always means more people interested. Just my 2 cents.

Another note, I personally get more interest when I advertise a 28" horse versus a 32" horse.

 

[MiniGaits Farm]

Pam,

A few years ago I really considered selling out of the minis, with the exception of a few mares just to justify having our barn and paddocks. I felt as though I was ready to do so. But just as I had made up my mind and actually put my ad up on the saleboard, something happened....and I never would have expected it. My husband, who was strictly a city boy when I met him, told me that he didn't want to get out of the minis...he enjoys them. A large part of the reason I wanted to sell out was I felt as though it was very unfair to him as he has to do so many of the things that I cannot do, plus we both were working full time jobs and the mowing out here...ugghh...I don't even want to think about that....it takes up so much of his time. I help as much as I can on the riding mower, but only my husband knows how to run the tractor...I guess I need to learn...LOL....Anyway, I have ventured a little off the path here, but what I am getting at is I would think really long and hard before I made any decisions such as selling the herd. 2011 was a great year for us. I worked my tail off at it. If we were going to keep the minis, then I needed to change up my program quite a bit. We made more changes last year than we ever have with our herd. Over twenty head of horses were sold. And yes, they went to good homes. We did not take any of them to sales. All sales were private. I have had the most luck with the LilBeginnings Sale Board and have also made some fantastic friends from that board. I love getting the updates from the current owners. Some of them have been shown and won and that sure does make me proud. Selling horses is work. I have spent hours. So much time on the computer that my husband finally bought me a laptop so he can have some access to the main computer...LOL You must have good photos of all angles...and even the bites of the horses and have all of that in order well before you run your ad. Be ready to hit the ground running when you get the inquiries. Oh yes, you will have to sift through as some are serious and some are surfers. One thing I have learned and it seems to prove true over and over again is that the potential buyer that asks for the least is usually the most interested. Doesn't make sense, but it is true....when they ask for seventy five photos and even for you to raise their tail and photograph the rectum and vulva, then most likely they are NOT going to buy....yes, you must have patience for the good and the bad....and for heaven sake get back with ALL of them....I so hate being ignored, so I refuse to ignore people. Again, it is lots of work, but well worth it IMO. My sentiments are that I can sell them for less off of the farm and pass the savings on to the buyers, than I can take them to a sale. That expense can get astronomical and then you sometimes never know where they end up. The numbers are still a little high for here as I have also taken advantage of the times and added some nice mares this past year. So I am gearing up to cut back some again this year and feel most confident that I will get it done. We are not breeding as much. My problem has never really been NOT being able to sell the babies....it has been "wanting" to keep my fillies. I have finally come to the realization that I do not need to be doing too much of that as I have about 12 young mares 2-4 yrs old that have never been bred...these are home grown mares....and they most likely will not be bred in 2012. At any rate, we are restructuring and I have been excited about it. As far as the value of the smaller minis is concerned, I think there will always be a market for them. I would like to very carefully phrase this as well....I think the shetlands are gorgeous...I love them, but I will never own them. I just cannot branch off in that direction and stay focused on my minis as well, so the minis will prevail at our farm. I know that so many have migrated toward the shetland/miniature crosses and sold off several of their smaller minis. I would think, honestly, that in the years to come, that may be to the advantage of the folks that are breeding for the 34 and under minis. Best of luck in whatever you decide Pam. You have a fantastic little herd of minis, that is one thing I know for sure. Just concentrate on your marketing and I am sure you can get some of them sold if you decide to.

 

[MindyLee]

I too have a hard time selling the small ones as seems like anyone who inquires wants cheap minis or big minis. I know marketing is a huge factor, and I did so 3 yrs ago hard core and still no resaults. With a fixed income, what are great ways to market them? And what are all the best ways to do so?

I do with adds on all the sales boards around the internet, but what else?

This too is my last yr of foals as well, will be my best crop, but also my last as I am over my limit and cant aford to keep them all.

 

[Jill]

I really don't know... my only purchase the past few years was 6mos ago and he's a well under 30" 3x AMHR National Champion, who *I* think would rake in the wins with AMHA, but that's just speculation on my part. Happy to have added him as a part of my breeding program and my current thought is that the surge in the BIG AMHR/ASPC horses may spur on a renewed appreciation for NICE under 34" miniature horses.

With the above said, though, I do truly admire what I see in the B size AMHR / ASPC horses. I just do not have the time and space to devote to pursuing that as part of our program at this time. I've chosen to continue our focus on under 34" AMHA/AMHR horses.

My shrimp, Erica's Can't Take My Eyes Off You, a/k/a Squirt, a 28.75" triple Rowdy bred AMHA/AMHR black stallion... AMHR 3x National Champion with supreme champion AMHA Halter wins. AND, I hadn't originally been a fan of "tiny" horses...

 

[mdegner]

OMG Jill........that is a GORGEOUS stallion. Good thing you live half the country away from me, so we don't have to show against him on a routine basis. Stunning

Mary (MRZ Farms)

 

[Reble]

I am pretty concerned about what is happening with the market for the small AMHA … I love my miniatures, but …. It is so expensive to keep 13 mares/two stallions – taking the best possible care of them, and then having problems selling the babies…. I guess I am just tired…. It is hard working at my full time teaching job and then also taking care of a small herd of horses, and the expense is huge when you do it right… although I have three babies coming this summer, I doubt if I will breed for 2013.

There is NO market for miniatures in our area – they think of them as $50 pocket pets. My main goal is for my babies to go to good homes – however, one can’t even give away colts in our area 

Hoping that the market improves soon…. I do not want to have a herd dispersal, but my husband and I work long hours, and we are NOT getting any younger…. decisions decisions…. What do others think the future of the tiny AMHA horses will be?

sorry to hear that but I have found not always close to home but do have to advertise and hit a wider area.

I also do not believe the AMHA horses have any problems but is always best for us anyways to have them double registered, so I like to have my breeding stock to be both AMHA/AMHR this also helps when selling.

I also find to sell horses too Quebec they like them 30" and under and lot of white, but as far as taller not as good for the market, so I must agree the smaller minis will always sell best for us.

 

[pam]

As always Sherri, you have given great advice! You have been a great friend, and I always respect your guidance with the horses and also being so supportive with the other "issue" that our family went through for 4.5 years

And also....Wish that I could master the PiZap program as well as you!!!

I recently totalled up the expenses for the horses this year

Hay is so expensive now; prices on feed just increased $40 a month; mortality insurance, equine dentistry, farrier, horse supplements and tack, and vet bills add up quickly; and now we have to put a new water pump outside for the horses... carrying water buckets in the winter is NO fun. We finally found barn help, which is a good thing, but also a big chunk of money every month. We never go on vacation, as it is too hard to find a reliable caretaker for the horses. The Blind School is changing the school calendar next year to the "balanced school year" - I go back to school August 1st - which will also make it harder to concentrate on the horses.

My husband and I love the horses, but I am feeling really tired, old, and horse poor today...

Hoping 2012 is a great year for all of us!

 

[shelia]

WOW! Jill!

Ditto on what Mary said!

I can only speculate one which way the market will go. Whaen I got my first mini I wanted the smallest most correct mini I could find. I didn't know much about them or anything about shows. I wanted a pet. Soon after that, I wanted a little friend for her. The next one ended up a little bigger. I still searched for a smaller really nice one. It was hard for me to find. The next one was still a little bigger. I started going to the shows and decided I wanted one to show. I was told that the taller ones do better at the shows. I could find very nice taller ones, but the under 30 always has a special place in my heart. I could never seem to afford the quality in that size range even though the taller ones would do better in show. I love the look of the ones that are winning at the shows, so I have been torn on which direction I need to go.

This year I have decided to go back to the smaller ones. I am tired of worrying that my foals may go oversize. I have finally been able to purchase the quality in the small size. I am probably going to keep some of my tall ones though. I have to think other people will feel the same way as I do.

 

[JMS Miniatures]

The 34" and under horse will never go away. The Under horses is what I prefer. Now if you are talking about the 28" and under yeah its going to be harder to sell. Performance is increasing and I think its doing better in entries then halter and its just harder for something that small to compete in performance. Plus more are breeding less. Also if you are just selling AMHA horses you aren't reaching the AMHR people.

Perhaps give up breeding a year or 2 and reduce your herd. I understand greatly about wanting to quit. I sold all my broodmares and now just have 3 geldings and I enjoy it so much more. No more foaling out and just go out there and enjoy showing.

 

[Charlotte]

Well, I was going to write a lengthy post here, but after having read everyone's thoughts I don't think *I* need to add very much to what has been said. There are some very well thought out posts here.

Maple HollowThe quality smaller minis are much harder to achieve than the taller horses, it has taken a lot of years of selective breeding to get to where they are today!

and because the very good ones are harder to achieve they actually have more value in the market due to limited supply.

Parmelaif both registries did certain things that would help to promote the smaller ones, like enforcing the judging standard of all things being equal, smaller horse is placed higher, etc., they would do themselves a favor

A HUGE favor Parmela, but we need more people who understand this concept to attend the Annual meetings, and to be vocal for the 'Following of the rules'!

MiniGaits Farm

EXCELLENT POST!

You covered the subject quite well

Whinny for me Farm.

Now THAT is a MINIATURE Horse!

Pam, a couple of suggestions.....if you aren't making the sales you want to, perhaps it is time to go look very critically at how you are going about it.

First, do you have a PLAN for your farm?

*a plan for what you want to produce

*a plan for what market you want to sell to

*a plan for attracting the attention of that market

Frank and I have talked many times about doing a seminar on marketing and have just never taken the time to get on with it. We want to help other breeders and try to on a one on one basis but There are so many out there who could use a little bit of 'Miniature Horse Marketing 101'. (Frank's entire professional career was in marketing for the animal health industry so of course, I picked up a lot from him along the way

)

Well! got pretty lenghty didn't I? sorry.