I'm interested in hearing it from both sides

[River Wood]

Over the years I've run across a few websites that indicate that for horses selling for lets say..less than $1000.00, that the coggins/health etc are the responsibility of the buyer.

Am I the only one that thinks that now matter how much the horse is sold for, this really should just be covered by the seller?

Just seems like the thing to do to me. Not sure how to explain that. Just seems a bit more appropriate to me I guess. Maybe its the customer service/satisfied customer side of my brain thinking than the, I won't make as much money on these lower dollar horses if I have to foot the bill for all of that, (which does of course add up).

If this has been covered already and I've missed it, I'm sorry.

 

[Becky]

Any horse I sell, no matter the price, comes with a coggins and health certificate if needed. That's just good business to me.

 

[StellaLenoir]

as someone who has purchased low end (but much loved)

horses, I can speak from the buyers perspective.

2 of my mare came from the same owner, no info, other than what was said. No shot record, or med record on paper at all. I paid for a preg test and vet visit for shots and over all look at, myself on my first mare. Second mare was preggo, and I had her looked at after she came home to me. I was very new and too inexperienced to know what was a good seller and not, I liked the seller and her horses so I went with my gut.

3rd mare came with paperwork, home records but very helpfull and well put together! I even got baby pictures! No, it was not a vet heath record but it did show when and what this mare had as far as shots, worming trims.

I think even if a full health screen by a vet is not an option sellers should be sure to have all written documentation of shots, worming and major medical to give to the new owner.

But I do think if you are a breeder and you have a website advertising your farm and name, than you should have your horses coggins and health paperwork in order no matter what price you are putting on the horse. Just because a horse is only pet quality or is selling for under 1000$ does not mean it or the buyer deserve any less than the $5000 show horse.

If you are someone who bought a bred mare, or had an oops baby or did not know your mare was bred, then I can see not having the health papers or documentation that a breeder would have.

 

[Kitty]

I- myself do not make expect a low dollar horse to come with coggins or health paper. In fact most of the horses I have bought or sold I have talked to the buyer/seller and decided between us. And I have to tell you even horses I have paid alot for didn't come with coggins or health papers and I had to have it done. We do pull coggins on a number of horses every year that we may show or sell or whatever to help keep farm visits to a minimal. Our vet personally does a coggins special in Jan where coggins are a set price and the farm visit is like $6.00.

With a farm visit being $65.00-$100.00 and coggins $30.00 - $45.00 health certificate being $25.00-$45.00 it is hard for someone to be expected to sell a horse for $500-$1500.00 and have to foot the bill of upwards of $200.00.

If your farm does it I applaud you. I honestly couldn't afford it. I offer free transportation when I can and we do travel alot and have alot of people take advantage of it and are saving sometimes $800.00 or more.

And yes I do tell any buyers all recent wormings, vet checks, ultrasounds (which every mare here is ultrasounded for exact date as 99% are hand bred), farrier, vaccines ect. Trust me my vet bills are probably alot more than most but I don't mind.

Remember everyone does things differently and as long as the buyer and the seller are happy with the arrangement that should be all that matters in the end.

 

[disneyhorse]

I am with Kitty. A coggins/health certificate costs me $200+ here! I haven't sold a horse for less than $1000 so it hasn't been an issue that comes up but...

I don't think it's fair to ask a seller to pay for the paperwork on an inexpensive horse, when they can sell in-state for the same price without needing the paperwork done!

I don't think it's a big deal to request this of buyers. They ARE getting a good deal no matter what goes on!

Andrea

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

It never dawned on me to even consider selling a horse without a coggins and health cert.

I have had one buyer, of my draft horse - not a mini, that when we discussed price he asked if I would skip the coggins and health cert and thus reduce my price by $100. He was picking up the horse at my place, so I was not going to be in trouble personally for hauling a horse without paperwork so I let him decide. He was OK with it, so the mare left without those things. Prior to that I have never thought of that as an option. In this particular case I felt the home was the right one for the horse and since it was the buyer's request I did it. I don't think it has anything to do with the price. Even if I'm giving a horse away I expect to provide a coggins and health cert. I rehomed a pet mare this year and I sent her with a coggins and health cert even though I wasn't getting a dime for her. They ended up coming back and buying a gelding from me for a good price. I think it just makes for good business to provide the expected paperwork.

 

[StellaLenoir]

Do those that have posted give the buyer info such as shots, ect and any vet visits like a personal record? To me it is the knowing things were done and being able to have the info. I like to keep my paperwork just on my little ones.

I so appreiciated when I got the med record from my mares other owner. I refered to it just the other day! It was nice to have a background, even if not signed off by a vet and paid for. \

I can see that with costs like those stated, that it is a lot of money for each horse. Transportaion help is wonderful!!!

 

[dannigirl]

I usually get coggins on anything I may want to sell or show in the spring. That way I have it. If someone comes and buys a horse and takes it that day, I can at least give them a coggins on it. If someone is looking at a horse that I have not had coggins on when I did everyone else, then I request a deposit of the cost of having the coggins and health papers before I will haul the horse to have it done. The deposit is nonrefundable so that I will not be out that cost if they change their mind. The cost is ultimately mine after the sale is finished, but $100 is a lot of money to spend and then have someone change their mind. When the vet comes in the spring, he charges me a bit less because of my numbers (min 25 horses--as a rule--has been up to 38) and then there is fuel cost to transport 70 miles round trip also.

Angie

 

[Minimor]

Low dollar, high dollar, none of the horses I have purchased over the years have come with health papers--and I did not expect them to. There is only one exception to that--my pony, who came up from the US and had to have her coggins and health paper to come across the border. She was not a high dollar pony but the seller offered to supply the coggins and health paper (standard)--that was a pleasant surprise. I paid the extra costs associated with getting the permanent export papers, which included courier fees and such to get the federal seal put on the health paper.

The last US horse we had purchased prior to the above pony was a higher dollar amount, and on that one we had to pay for the health papers. Otherwise all our purchases have been domestic and the health papers weren't necessary. Sellers don't offer to supply them, and I don't ask for them.

If the seller tells me when the horse was last vaccinated and which vaccines were given--also date of last deworming--I am happy!

 

[Sarah's Little Blessings]

Well I am like some of the rest on here, its around 200 total for us to getting a coggans and health certificate on a horse. So when I'm seeling for under 1000.00 its hard to foot that bill. I know it is somewhat my responsibility but thats just my general rule. With that being said, I still provide a complete shot record, farrier record,ect to those buyers. I have also bought before when I'd be the one buying coggans/health certificates so I personally have no problems with it-Sarah

 

[StellaLenoir]

sorry, are we all talking about health papers done at point of sale or health paperwork and record up to date?

I really have noooo idea about buying and selling horses so please I am really trying to learn

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Well, I don't know what everyone else is talking about, but I'm referring to a health certificate from a vet (usually good for 30 days) that basically says the vet took the temp, felt the glands, listened to the heart and looked at the eyes and nose for discharge. Around here I have to get them for every show I've been to or to transport a horse.

And for those that say they've NEVER gotten a coggins and health cert on a horse they bought OR you've paid for it yourself as the buyer...my question is: Who the heck are you dealing with?

I've never even had a seller even suggest that I should pay for those things. Wait... Maybe I'm overpaying for all my horses! OH! And that's why they don't ask. They're already saying "sucker!"

 

[vvf]

I am one that when I sell a horse, it comes with health/ coggins if needed. I just think it's good business.

I have only bought one horse that I had to pay the coggins on. I paid quite a bit for this horse, and I assumed that the coggins would be included. The seller told me that that was my expense. Oh I paid it.... a whole $25. I couldn't believe that this person wouldn't cover that amount

 

[Lmequine]

In the state of Texas any equine changing hands must have a current negative coggins test. My father-in-law sold an old grade pony for a couple of hundred dollars several years ago. The pony had been on his property for several years and his coggins had ran out of date (they are good for 12 months here). The seller said do not worry about it, took the pony, the pony changed hands one or two times before he finally had a new coggins done, which came back positive! So the back-tracking began and eventually led back to my father in law. He was fined for selling the horse originally without a current coggins. Got a huge lecture along with threats from the Animal Health commission. All of his other stock had to be tested at his expense along with his neighbors stock. Anyhow it was a mess. You would think that a fat healthy looking horse that had been on your property for years would be okay to sell without a coggins test, but it does not always work that way!

I sold a donkey earlier this year at the local sale barn, my check was for $27.65 after the cost of coggins, commission and yardage was held out. The coggins was charged to me, the seller, not the buyer, and again that is the law in the state of Texas. Coggins run about $30 around here. Even my pet quality $200 ponies are sold with a coggins that was pulled within the last 12 months. I do provide health certificates on stock that is sold out of state. The only time I have asked for a health certificate to be paid for by the buyer was when I have sold out of the country...those health certificates can run near $200 each and that is more than I can handle on a $1000 to $1500 horse.

 

[REO]

We've always gotten the coggins and health papers, no matter how low the horse sells for. And some times help deliver it. So many times, we lose out, especially on our already extra low priced (but NICE!) horses.

 

[Filipowicz Farm]

We have sold horses with coggins and health papers and USDA papers if going to Canada. We also Include all heath records on horse. Have charts on each horse which includes shot, dental farrier and all health records. If we have I include pictures of sire and dam and information about bloodlines. If the horse has been shown its show results. Pictures and any other information which is helpful to the new owner. We also send some of the grain that we feed the horse.

 

[Margaret]

For a horses to transport across the state border here a health certificate and coggin are required.

I will be footing that bill on the two horses going out of state this year, rather than the buyer.

I do consider that my responsibility.

However, I can honestly understand from some of the low prices that many horses are being offered at why

many sellers would want the buyer to foot this bill.

But I am on the other side of pursuasion, in that once the horse is sold, there are no hidden charges that might dismay the buyer.

Usually I end up throwing in all sorts of unexpected extras to make sure that the buyer is well prepared for their new investment.

I like to think that the buyer will be soo happy with my horses, and dealings,- that they will tell all sorts of people how pleased they are, and send me more customers

Of course I am from the old wine and dine your customers school.

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

I fully expect a horse to come with coggins (not nessesarily recent, but within one year). If I'm going out of state, I expect the seller to arrange and pay for a health cert which I will then reimburse for. Four of my four horses came sans-coggins, and all sales were contingent upon a negative test done before the sale. Most of them were so cheap it didn't matter... when I worked for the hospital I think I paid $7.50, I just had an ELISA done yesterday same-day service, and with HC it was only $18. I expect it yes, but sellers just aren't willing.

 

[targetsmom]

I wonder how many people even think about what the Coggins papers mean? Especially the ones that will buy a horse without one and take their chances transporting it home. I had a really horrible experience about 35 years ago involving someone who did just that. I temporarily boarded 2 horses while I went on vacation and came home to find that there had been a "swamp fever" (Equine Infectious Anemia or EIA, which the Coggins tests for) epidemic there, and my horses were in quarantine. All horses on the premises were tested every 3 weeks (I think that was the interval) until NONE tested positive. By the time the epidemic was over, 17 horses were put down. It was a horrendous experience but luckily both of my horses survived and continued to test negative. (I think there were about 50 horses total). EIA may be less common now (because of all those who do test), but it was also pretty rare then. The disease was traced to a horse that came from out of state, through a dealer who did not test. THIS IS WHY YOU DON'T EVER BUY A HORSE WITHOUT A COGGINS.

 

[h2t99]

Ok I will put my flame suit on,

Coggins are the biggest joke around!! You get tested and as you are drawing blood a mosquito can be biting and exposing your horse to the disease!! SO how can you justify spending the money to have a test done that says yes he WAS negative up until the blood was drawn but who knows if it is still negative?? I think it just another way for the government to get more money. What they need is a vaccine. to take care of the problem!!