Gay marriage - taking a step away from progress

[ozymandias]

Brain vs. half a brain. Scary that half a brain still gets to vote :0

At least there is some good coming from all of this. The religious right wing extremists are finally been seen for the hateful bigots that they are.

 

[ozymandias]

But of course there's no hope when gay people are infecting innocent animals with gay demons

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/05/18/former-navy-chaplain-insists-gay-demons-can-infect-animals/

 

[tagalong]

Wow. That link that Ozy provided is bizarre. Klingenschmitt is an ex-navy chaplain with some very "special" ideas.

Some excerpts... Pakman is the interviewer...

“The problem is, nobody’s born a homosexual,” he said, explaining that all gay people are converted via “marketing” because the LGBT community “has an agenda” to “repopulate their population by recruiting the children of heterosexuals.”

Klingenschmitt added that “anyone who’s studied” genetics knows that homosexuality is not an inherent trait, simply because LGBT people aren’t capable of reproducing and passing that genetic trait along. Though Pakman didn’t immediately challenge it, that’s a claim as bizarre as it is untrue, as scientists have long knownhomosexuality can be attributed to genetic traits and many LGBT people have reproduced thanks to the help of platonic opposite sex partners.

“That’s what this whole marketing scheme for pro-homosexual movement is all about,” Klingenschmitt insisted, reiterating his point about repopulating the LGBT community.

“So, what you’re saying is, in humans it’s marketing that makes people gay; in animals, it’s the souls of gay humans who have invaded the animals,” Pakman replied. “That makes them gay?”

 

Klingenschmitt laughed and scratched his temple. “Well, I think you twisted what I’m saying there,” he said.

“No, I don’t think I did,” Pakman responded.

Backpedaling, Klingenschmitt explained that he believes marketing to be “related to the demonic, because the devil wants to recruit people into sin.” He added that even Pakman himself was being used by the devil to promote “the homosexual agenda.”

“I don’t promote homosexuality any more than I promote being tall,” Pakman deadpanned.

Dear lady being interviewed by Anderson Cooper.... you did not do a good job of defending your pastor.

 

[weebiscuit]

I am a conservative, but I am not a christian and I am not gay. I fully support gay marriage. When someone denies gays the rights to marry, it seems they are telling them that because they were born biologically different we wish to keep them set aside as freaks and not allow them to live their lives the same way we live ours because they are "different."

It is beyond the ken of my understanding how anyone has the right to tell any legal-aged loving couple that they cannot be legally married. I guess it would be the same people who think that instead of being biologically born gay that it's a choice, or a lifestyle. (I hate the word "lifestyle" when it is applied to gays. Being a bull rider, a mountain climber, a socialite, a deep sea fisherman, or a beach bum is a "lifestyle." A gay person no more chooses to be gay than I chose to have hazel eyes).

We have several gay couples in our lives and we feel completely comfortable around them. One lesbian couple lives in Georgia and comes to our home every few years for a few days' visit, and then we go to theirs. My accountant is gay. One of our teacher friends is gay. And a young man I used to go horseback riding with just came out last October, at age 25. When he announced it on Facebook I called him up and said, "I'm glad you finally came out. We all knew you were gay anyway since you were about 7 years old! He laughed and said, "Probably!" He breaks horses and runs his grandpa's dairy farm for a living, and he rides in rodeos. One of my favorite people in the world. And there's just no way that at age 25 he sat in his room one night and said, "I think I'm going to date guys instead of girls!" Nope... he was born that way and we all knew it.

 

[Matt73]

That article made me want to laugh and then scratch my eyes out lol. WOW....so scary, some of the people that share this planet with us are....

 

[ozymandias]

Hey Weebiscuit - it's so refreshing to meet another non xtian, open minded conservative - we're a rare breed but we do exist

To me all of this boils down to one simple common denominator - religion. Everyone in the video's are religious, everyone who participated and who posted on this thread that they are against homosexuality were xtians and basing it on the bible.

IMO If you can take an average human being and brainwash them enough into believing the world is flat, it's 7000 years old (this is the one that amazes me THE most lol) that it was made in one week (plants and things being made BEFORE the sun!) That there was a world wide flood higher than Mt. Everest and that everything from South American Tree sloths to sedentary giant tube worms living around geothermal vents in the deep ocean floor - all got up and walked to the ark. That Eve and her sons regularly had incestual sex because she was the only woman on the planet etc.etc.etc. If you can convince people of that (and this is just chapter one!) despite ALL of the overwhelming scientific PROOF and simple COMMON SENSE to the contrary. The you can very easily convince them that...

Homosexuality is an abomination

and

It's cool to fly planes into buildings yelling "god is great" as you do it!

These are just tiny petty things compared to the death and killing done during the past 2000 years in the name of religion. There is nothing more divisive on our planet.

Had we lived in another era in a different place there have been many, many gods (Greek, Norse, Celtic etc etc) who not only welcomed gays but were in fact themselves gay. It's kind of a shame folks aren't worshiping a different god these days than the one they picked...I like some of the Greek ones who like to party and drink fine wine and have raunchy toga parties

It's not going to change. You're not going to convince people that discrimination of any type is wrong. Even their common sense won't tell them otherwise because the moment they fully believed the earth is 7000 years old - they gave up using common sense.

It's a 21st century witch hunt and homosexuals are today's witches

 

[Minimor]

Ah, but you're going on the assumption that "7 days" was 7 24 hour days as we have now--in reality, no one know's how long God's days were! For all you know his "day" could have been a million years long. Perhaps when he created "man" it was a neanderthal man and all other of his creations were basic organisms...basic life forms that then evolved into today's creatures. Perhaps Gad shaped the original life forms and then helped them to evolve....or perhaps he simply allowed them to evolve. Perhaps it doesn't have to be creation vs. evolution....perhaps it is some of both.

 

[ozymandias]

Ah, but you're going on the assumption that "7 days" was 7 24 hour days as we have now--in reality, no one know's how long God's days were! For all you know his "day" could have been a million years long. Perhaps when he created "man" it was a neanderthal man and all other of his creations were basic organisms...basic life forms that then evolved into today's creatures. Perhaps Gad shaped the original life forms and then helped them to evolve....or perhaps he simply allowed them to evolve. Perhaps it doesn't have to be creation vs. evolution....perhaps it is some of both.

I understand it must be very hard when you're trying to believe in something for which there is no evidence and long comes every single field of science you can participate in all coming to the exact opposite conclusion backed up with hard facts. I love the "well a day to God isn't like a normal day" argument to try to make the biblical version fit the known facts of how old the earth is just a tiny bit. But if you study the ancient biblical texts, and biblical scholars will back this up, the Hebrew word for "day" as used in Genesis 1 IS the word used for a "normal" 24 hour day. This god claims to have made it all in 7 24 hour days (well 6 as he slept for the last one - must have worn his omnipotent self out )

So this god made plants and trees and fruit etc and left them on a pitch dark freezing cold planet without a sun for over 2 million years!!! Give me a break - that's million years stuff makes the argument ever worse. There's is NO WAY life like that can live on a sunless planet.

Can you tell me how a sedentary colonial coral "walked" from a reef in Micronesia to the Ark (and then back again afterwards)? I'd love an intelligent answer rather than "ohhhh, you're tempting me" *teeth chattering* like I earlier got (chuckle). No, I'm asking you to use your brain instead of blindly believing a bunch of books thrown together almost 2000 years ago by people that didn't even know Mt. Everest existed. I bet if they did they would have changed how much water covered the land lol. Your intelligent Minimor...

"Don't blindly believe what I say.

​

Don't believe me because others convince you of my words.

​

Don't believe anything you see, read, or hear from others, whether of authority, religious teachers or texts.

​

Don't rely on logic alone, nor speculation.

​

Don't infer or be deceived by appearances."

​

"Do not give up your authority and follow blindly the will of others. This way will lead to only delusion."

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Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it,

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no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.

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-Buddha-

​

 

[ozymandias]

Perhaps when he created "man" it was a neanderthal man

Oh, JFYI. We don't descend from Neanderthal man. There may be a few Neanderthal genes in some of us from a bit of cross breeding - before we, Homo Sapiens, wiped them out. Neanderthals branch off from an ancestor we shared but we do not descend from them

 

[KanoasDestiny]

Ozy, since you obviously lived a million+ years ago at the dawn of mankind and know everything about it, I would love for you to share with us exactly how and where we came from. From your own personal observation - not from where you have 'read it in books' or 'been told by someone else'.

 

[Boss Mare]

I am gay. I have lived the straight life and gay life. I was never happy with my pretend straight life..

I didn't choose this life style. I didn't risk the possibility of being disowned by my family just because. My coming out what extremely difficult and devasting for my parents and while they accept my lifestyle now in the beginning I wouldnt have wished what I went through on my enemy.

I wouldn't have chose not to show my affection and love for my partner in public.. I wouldn't have chosen the be hated upon by others for something out of my control.

That being said, gay marriage is not all that important to me. I don't need a paper to be symbolic of my love for someone or to represent unity.

The only reason gay marriage may perhaps intrigue me is for legal purposes. However, there are other alternatives.

 

[ozymandias]

I am gay. I have lifed the straight life and gay life. I was never happy with my pretend straight life..

I didn't choose this life style. I didn't risk the possibility of being disowned by my family just because. My coming out what extremely difficult and devasting for my parents and while they accept my lifestyle now in the beginning I wouldnt have wished what I went through on my enemy.

I wouldn't have chose not to show my affection and love for my partner in public.. I wouldn't have chosen the be hated upon by others for something out of my control.

That being said, gay marriage is not all that important to me. I don't need a paper to be symbolic of my love for someone or to represent unity.

The only reason gay marriage may perhaps intrigue me is for legal purposes. However, there are other alternatives.

I'm so sorry you've been made to feel the way you have by others

I realize Shangri-la is a fictional place but in my never ending desire for global peace I also realize that acceptance starts inside every single one of us (((HUGS)))

 

[Ashley]

Weebiscit....that actually brought tears to my eyes. Thank you for be supportive of "our kind".

I must say I couldnt agree more with Boss Mare. And there are many of us on this board, but very few of us are actually wiilling to speak up about it because of how things in the past have played out.

 

[jyuukai]

Oh that's rich, the article about how gays can't reproduce. My wife and I were thinking of starting our family, does that mean we'll be sterile.

 

[ozymandias]

Weebiscit....that actually brought tears to my eyes. Thank you for be supportive of "our kind".

I must say I couldnt agree more with Boss Mare. And there are many of us on this board, but very few of us are actually wiilling to speak up about it because of how things in the past have played out.

Ashley,

I have been quite surprised just how many folks have come on this thread and felt comfortable enough to say they are gay. If nothing else I hope that those of you who are gay know that you have a lot of people here supporting you

 

[Ashley]

The ones that have spoke up with the exception of one have for years been known here. That said i know others on here that are that don t care to speak up and its sad that they have been made to feel the way they do.

oh and since I have a biological daughter I guess im not unable to have kids. but i suppose then it will be said that im truelly not gay

 

[REO]

I fully support gay marriage. When someone denies gays the rights to marry, it seems they are telling them that because they were born biologically different we wish to keep them set aside as freaks and not allow them to live their lives the same way we live ours because they are "different."

It is beyond the ken of my understanding how anyone has the right to tell any legal-aged loving couple that they cannot be legally married. I guess it would be the same people who think that instead of being biologically born gay that it's a choice, or a lifestyle. (I hate the word "lifestyle" when it is applied to gays. Being a bull rider, a mountain climber, a socialite, a deep sea fisherman, or a beach bum is a "lifestyle." A gay person no more chooses to be gay than I chose to have hazel eyes).

You said it very well

 

[tagalong]

From your own personal observation - not from where you have 'read it in books' or 'been told by someone else'.

Ummmm... all of us have "read it in books" or "been told by someone else". None of us were there to make a personal observation. So I guess I fail to see what your point is... ?

 

[Jill]

I think the point is, no one knows and no set of beliefs should be ridiculed. And if that was the poiint, i very much agree. Like I've tried to say before, tolerance is not a one way street.

 

[ozymandias]

Ozy, since you obviously lived a million+ years ago at the dawn of mankind and know everything about it, I would love for you to share with us exactly how and where we came from. From your own personal observation - not from where you have 'read it in books' or 'been told by someone else'.

Your point?