What I detest about mini auctions.

[capall beag]

Ditto the above!

You owe it to these horses.

Even if it is a business, there are good business practices and bad and I would never knowingly support a person doing bad business, ESPECIALLY, when it involoves a living breathing animal!

We are domesticated animals caretakers and shunning this responsibuility is not something I could EVER respect or support.

 

[Aggravation Acres]

There is an article in the Miniature Horse World Aug/Sept issue on Horse-keeping News. they say in there to

"Other factors, such as reproductive ability, may also be considered in the final culling decision. Mares older than 16 years of age have a sharp decline in their reproductive ability to produce foals. Often, older mares that produced high-quality foals several years ago are kept far beyond their reasonable reproductive age. Culling poor reproducing mares will result in more foals for sale."

I know breeding horses is supposed to be a business. (good thing I am not not in this for the money) But I find this very cold hearted to think this is a great horse as long as I am making big bucks off of her babies but now she can no longer have a baby every year get rid of her.

Deb

 

[DunPainted]

Big Red Button pushed here!!.......Let's take that one step back.

What I detest are "breeders" who do not provide quality care of their broodmares, such as regular hoof trimming, grooming, etc. How many foals have we seen that are "back on their pasterns" at birth, as the mare was not fed adequately to produce a beautiful foal. Humans (most) take care of themselves during the gestation of their child. How is that different from a broodmare?

For those of us who've had children and our "girlish" figures never were quite the same, it's nice to be fussed over with a new haircut, nails polished, massage, even though we don't look like supermodels. Let me tell you, most broodmares hardly get a glance until it's time to foal and people wonder why the mare won't let them near their baby?

I love my "old" broodmares, they're so wise. If one takes the time to observe their behavior in a herd, there's an awful lot they can teach us about handling our own lives.

Now, on to auctions. I've only been to a big horse auction and became nauseated when a mare/foal came into the ring to be sold separately. To watch the screaming of the mare and foal as they went separate ways out of the ring is indelibly etched in my mind.

Just sayin....is all.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Selling the mare and foal separately, even if the foal is old enough to be weaned, is illegal everywhere in the UK and has been for years. The foal has to be older than four months and FULLY weaned and entered separately and stood in a separate pen, for it to be sold separately. This does not stop the "insider" deals allowing this to happen in the car park (unless it is spotted by the RSPCA- the one thing they do seem to be able to get right!!- then the animal can be seized) but it does stop it happening in the ring.

 

[capall beag]

OK, can you tell I have never been to an auction!

Why would a mare and foal be seperated at the auction?

Would this mean, the foal was not weaned prior??

I can't believe a "respected" breeder would not be embarassed to be associated with such poor bahaviour

 

[RobinRTrueJoy]

I made a decision in the beginning that when It is time for a horse to retire, she will either go with a friend that can offer a good home or she will stay with me. I am 51. At one point I will no longer buy new stock, and will keep the oldies until they are gone and I will no longer be breeding then. I owe them a good life and will see that they get it.

 

[DunPainted]

I made a decision in the beginning that when It is time for a horse to retire, she will either go with a friend that can offer a good home or she will stay with me. I am 51. At one point I will no longer buy new stock, and will keep the oldies until they are gone and I will no longer be breeding then. I owe them a good life and will see that they get it.

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With a philosophy such as this, I don't know which is more preferable...to be your friend or one of your mini mares!

Cindy

 

[whitney]

RobinRTrueJoy thats my plan too.

I bought my last big horse 3 yrs ago. She's a big gray Appendix Q.H.

In 25 years she will be an old gray mare for an old gray mare (ME).

 

[Joyce]

I do not believe in older brood mares going to auction either. If they can be placed privately in a retirement home I would do that. If not, I would keep them until they passed on. They certainly deserve better than to be auctioned off to the highest bidder and not knowing what they are going to do with them. I couldn't sleep nights if I did that.

 

[evedex]

Though I have bought and sold at auctions...there are some practices that I do agree are unsavory. I just attended an auction that was selling mare and foal separately...the foal was just barely 2 1/2 months old and they needed the mare in the ring with him to show him off for sale! Fortunately the same bidder bought both mom and baby, so the foal will have a chance at a good start.

But my biggest agrevation is how many of these little guys are 'shipped' off after the sale. I think the auction house should have some way of preventing some of the transport methods. There are always people there than will trailer for you.

I have seen foals picked up by the front legs and thrown into a trailer on top pf others already loaded...it was much too full of horses.

One of the worst I saw was a B mini put in the back of a pick up truck with a cap. The driver backed to a little hill, put a single sheet of tin roofing he found between the tailgate and the hill and dragged the horse in. Not only could the horse not stand upright in the truck, there was no footing for him and we heard him fall down twice in the driveway alone...I cannot imagine he made the highway trip home without major injury. And the list goes on!!!

Auctions can be a good thing, but there is much to be said against them too.

Eve

 

[Debby - LB]

[SIZE=14pt]Jane I wish it were illegal here as well.[/SIZE]

Yes, it means the foal has not been weaned prior! The mare with foal at her side, even a week or so old is sold seperate. The mare and foal screaming for each other wild eyed, it's sickening. Some people don't want the baby so if a mare comes through with one sometimes they're bid on together, sometimes seperate but then if someone bought them both they turn around and sell the baby......it's horrible. Mares who are brought to these auctions with babies that are old enough that they could be weaned it is done that day. They're seperated right then. I saw it once and won't go back, I hear about it regular from someone who does go. It happens at all what I call backyard auctions. Granted I know some of the babies will end up in a wonderful home BUT mostly it is a trader who buys them up cheap and they are just trucked to another auction in another state, not fed properly, no access to the proper nutrients a foal needs. I just don't like it I'm sorry. If you breed to sell and that's the only way you can move your horses then you shouldn't be breeding them, there's a real special place waiting for you and it's not soft and warm you will feel the emotional pain and hunger you have inflicted.Down off my soap box now, maybe a little off topic.

 

[Laura]

Several years ago we bought a pintaloosa pony mare and her overo-loosa foal that had been through an auction a week before, just before Christmas. The lady selling them mentioned that they HAD separated the mare and baby, but that she decided to buy both. I was looking at the length of the foal's tail and thinking he was YOUNG! He was very tall (likely sired by a full sized stallion), but he looked very, very young. I opened his mouth to check his teeth and he was LESS than a month old!!!! He would have been sold at THREE WEEKS OLD without his Dam, because he looked tall enough to wean

Razzle got to grow up happy & healthy with us, although he was about the dumbest pony I've ever known..."no Razzle, hotwire HURTS your mouth when you bite it...over and over and over"....

 

[k9mini2]

Well my problem with the dumping of older broodmares by large farms at auction it the large farm. I personally don't like the large farms. How can they give individual attention to these mares? I am talking farms that have 50+ mares.

I am just a little iffy on farms with 30+ mares. I don't really want a foal from them either. How could that foal be socialized or learn to like people???

I am not saying that small farms wouldn't dump broodmares too, but it would sure be easier to be detached and unconcerned if you have 100 mares.

My mares are also pets, not just broodmares. all but one are very friendly and like people.

Just my little pet peeve

 

[Charlotte]

These mares have given their LIVES to us and for our use, we do owe them! If I can't care for them properly, I'll foster them out or put them down. I will NOT let them be passed on in the name of profit or cost-efficency.

Laura, Ditto, Ditto, Ditto!

Charlotte

 

[Margot]

The trouble with auctions is you have no control over where your horse goes. I have sat in the parking lot and watched buyers beat minis to get them to load on a trailer. Even selling privately does not guarantee a good home. Several years ago we sold our two Haflingers to a home we thought would be a great one. For a few years things went well than the owner moved them to a barn near us and never let them outside for almost two years. We kept trying to buy them back with no luck, since they were in a barn with food and water the humane society was no help. Finally it got to be inconvenient for him and we got to buy the horses back. They were thin and their feet were bad. In a month they have come a long way and it is wonderful to see them out eating grass. Do we need these horses ? No , that is why we sold them to begin with and I hope to resell them to a better home when we get them back in shape but this whole thing left me with a lot of doubts. With every sale we make I hope they are going to a good home but it is impossible to control their lives after they leave your farm.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Having read all this thread now it becomes obvious that your auction houses are in need of legislation- that Humane Societies are empowered to enforce. Although I know you find our laws about transporting horses puzzling- no equine may be transported in any vehicle not specifically designed to carry equines and to be safe to do so (Open to interpretation) and it MUST be a minimum of six foot from ceiling to floor.- So- the law over here that prevent me transporting a Mini, however safely, in the back of a car, prevents the Tinkers from stuffing an animal in the back of their truck, or overloading a lorry. I'll stick with our laws, I think, even if it does preclude me(legally, at least

), in complete safety, carrying my 28" stallion in the back of a Van that is 5 foot from floor to ceiling

 

[chandab]

Having read all this thread now it becomes obvious that your auction houses are in need of legislation- that Humane Societies are empowered to enforce.  Although I know you find our laws about transporting horses puzzling- no equine may be transported in any vehicle not specifically designed to carry equines and to be safe to do so (Open to interpretation) and it MUST be a minimum of six foot from ceiling to floor.- So- the law over here that prevent me transporting a Mini, however safely, in the back of a car, prevents the Tinkers from stuffing an animal in the back of their truck, or overloading a lorry.  I'll stick with our laws, I think, even if it does preclude me(legally, at least

), in complete safety, carrying my 28" stallion in the back of a Van that is 5 foot from floor to ceiling

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Rabbit, your humane laws sound much better than ours. Granted some of our humane laws are being changed and added to for the benefit of the animals; that will take time, lots of time.

 

[k9mini2]

I wanted to append my earlier post about big farms...I know there are some big farms that the minis are thier whole concentration and they do spend time with their minis and I know there are a couple that come to this board that try to do the right thing. so if I offended you I did not mean to. I just think that the purpose of minis is to be gentle kind creatures that anyone can enjoy. If they are not handled and socialized then they are not gentle and it takes time spent with them.

Maybe small breeders do dump their old broodmares at auctions too. but logic tells me if they are a part of the family that is unlikely.

 

[REO]

The last auction we went to, as we were leaving, the people pulling out ahead of us had a young mini (yearling?) in the back of a PICK UP. NO shell, NO rails, NO liner! Just standing in the shallow bed with someone holding the lead rope through the little window. The horse was scared to death. It didn't look good for the horse. I hope he made it to where they were going. People like that, I'd like to just slap some sense into!

I've seen some of the other things mentioned too and it angers me to no end!

 

[pam]

Reo - I saw the same thing today, and it made me shudder...... I went to Ty's Sale in Greencastle, IN and someone had a mini in the back of the pickup, like you described. I ran to the road and yelled for them to stop as it was not safe, but they gave me "a hand movement" and drove on....... I hope that they got stopped by the appropriate authorities on the way home. What is wrong with people????

It makes me sad to see so many minis come through auctions that are filthy, thin, and uncared for...... I am a teacher, and I see so many parents treating their children so negligently too! There is a real lack of respect of quality of life for all living things, and it is such a tragedy.... It also reinforces my feelings on breeding. I do not understand why many people feel the need to breed every mare that they own.

Pam