What do you call this pinto

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Driving4fun

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Ok, Looked at a pinto todaymaybe will buy her. Don't know all the pinto names yet.

She is what I would call a bay pinto mostly a bay body color and white with the color over lapping and seems to have those paw prints everyone talks about, she has a solid head with big star and a large snip on her nose. Black Tail with black and white mane black forelock. Just above the white on leg where bay color begins is about a half inch of black. With black spots on the hair at the coronet band. Would she be a bay tobino? Thanks for any help with this.
 

appypintolady

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From what you are describing she sounds like a Bay Tovero pinto. The Tobianos usually have solid colored heads with no white on them. Some people feel that the bear paws indicate a possibility of the horse being homozygous for pinto
 

Whitewave

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i would call her a bay Tobiano..not all Tobianos have a solid face..Lots of paint horses are tobianos and have star,stripe,snip or even a blaze...I showed paints for years and all my Tobianos had white on their faces...and came from two Tobiano parents...JMO no flaming. The stallion in my Advar is a Homozgous tobiano pinto BUT he has a funny white marking under his jawl that creeeps up his right side of neck...could have Tovero in him form his mom maybe....dunno He also has a star and snip..
 
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rabbitsfizz

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OK, here we go again
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Tobiano is generally accepted to NOT carry face white.

Tobiano's have solid heads.

If a Tobiano has face white then it is generally accepted as proof of the presence of another pattern

This is what confuses people.

A horse can be more than one pattern

Whitewave- your "Tobianos" would have been Tobiano+??? There is no reason why they could not have had two Tobiano parents, just that one or both would have carried another pattern.

This is the generally accepted theory at the moment, and is borne out by breeding experiments.

I have to also point out that the Paint and Pinto and QH Societies are pants at patterns
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From the sound of it your little horse is Tobiano (possible H/Z, which means it would always have a Tobiano offspring) + Splash (by the description of the blaze and snip)

It is quite possible for an animal to be H/Z for Tobiano and also carry another pattern, which it may or may not pass on as well.
 

AppyLover2

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Fizzy that is a GREAT description - even one a greenie can understand!!!

Some time - when ya have nothing better to do than educate us folks new to the mini world - would you consider doing something like that for the other patterns(?) that have been mentioned? Frame - Overo - Tovero - Splash????

Please and Thank You!!
 

rabbitsfizz

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I am afraid I have received FAR too much "Flack" both public and private, both on this and other Forums to stick my neck out like that.

As soon as you challenge anything people have believed for a long time, (ie something as basic as , "Only Frame carries LWO" will have some people spitting bricks!!) people seem to completely lose all sense of reason!!
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But I am more than happy to discuss anything you want me to, in private.

Freeland has a very good "Colour 101" page on his website that I can recommend to anyone who wants colour explained without jargon.

If you want to take it further come to

http://www.equinecolor.com/contact.html

and join the Forum or just look at the site.
 
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Songcatcher

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I am afraid I have received FAR too much "Flack" both public and private, both on this and other Forums to stick my neck out like that.

As soon as you challenge anything people have believed for a long time, (ie something as basic as , "Only Frame carries LWO" will have some people spitting bricks!!) people seem to completely lose all sense of reason!!
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But I am more than happy to discuss anything you want me to, in private.

Freeland has a very good "Colour 101" page on his website that I can recommend to anyone who wants colour explained without jargon.

If you want to take it further come to

http://www.equinecolor.com/contact.html

and join the Forum or just look at the site.
WOW! Thanks for the endorsement! I must say that Jane (Rabbitsfizz) and Lewella were EXTREMELY helpful in reviewing over my information and helping me to correct some mistakes. I tried to simplify the information so it wouldn't be too complicated. You can go to my web page through the link in my signature below and then click the button to go the the "Color 101" page. There is also a couple of links from there to go to more detailed information.

I think one thing that confuses many people on Pinto patterns is the idea that the presence of one must equal the absence of another. That just isn't so. Tovero is not a single pattern, it is a combination of patterns.
 

shane

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:saludando: HI CINDY :saludando: GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR NEW MARE IF YOU GET HER, AND I JUST THAT PHOTO IN YOUR AVATAR!!!!!!YOU SHOULD PUT THAT IN EQUISETE!
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Whitewave

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okay I'll agree with you partly..tobianos do have soild heads but they can also have face markings. My stallion is homo. Tobiano and what else if both parent are homo.Tobianos where does the funny white mark under his thorat latch and up the side come form? just curious.
 

Lauralee

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Whitewave

Marks under the jaw and lower lip and underneath the neck reaching toward the dorsal, as in the shape of a necklace, all indicate sabino.

If your horse has white on its face, it is MORE than just tobiano.

Show us a body pic.
 

Sandee

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This topic is so interesting. I'm going to start a course in genetics at the local college. I'll bet both of my guys are registered wrongly. This one is labeled Tobiano but he has face markings - what ya think?

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Songcatcher

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This topic is so interesting. I'm going to start a course in genetics at the local college. I'll bet both of my guys are registered wrongly. This one is labeled Tobiano but he has face markings - what ya think?

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I think he is beautiful! He is Tobiano PLUS something else. Probably Sabino or possibly Splash (if he has blue eyes. The main thing that confuses people on Pinto patterns is thinking they can be only one or the other. Tobiano alone has no white on the head, but a horse can EASILY be homozygous for Tobiano and ALSO have Sabino, Splash, Frame, or a combination of ALL. Having the mixture will add face white to a Tobiano but it is not the Tobiano causing it.
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shane

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i too think hes gorgeous,
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: whatever colour he is lol :bgrin
 

AppyLover2

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Ooooops! Sorry Jane. I didn't realize it would open a can of worms. Thanks for the reference. I'll go check it out.
 

Whitewave

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heres both sides , he also has two blue eyes..sorry so small photobucket keeps making them small for some reason.

In my advar you can see the white underhis neck it then comes up the left side like ligntening.
 
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rabbitsfizz

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As we have said, being H/Z Tobiano does not mean the horse cannot have another pattern as well.

It only means it is ONLY h/Z for Tobiano.

The presence of face white is indicative of another pattern being present.
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Lauralee

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Whitewave

First off my vision isn't the greatest so from what I can tell in those pictures.....

I think I see pink on his chin in your avatar?

And do I see ALOT of white on the right side of his head?

The white DEFINITELY goes well over his hocks in the rear--which leads me to think sabino or splash.

You said he has two blue eyes so that says "Splash" to me.

I'd love to see a good clear facial picture to analyze his markings.

Bottom-heavy face markings, especially those that slide off to one side or another of the face are generally splash. Blue eyes are also splash, and splash tends to add pink skin around the eyes when it can.

Frame is not ruled out....with those blue eyes.

The white under the jaw, pink on the chin, white over the back hocks, black eyeliner, and the lightning bolt half-necklace are clearly sabino.

FOR SURE this guy has more than just tobiano.

Pictures of parents, full siblings, and offpspring are always helpful too!
 
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