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BlueStar

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When you have a smoky black foal....how do you register color? Do you do it as a bay, black or do you register as buckskin so that at least the cream gene recognized and is correctly on the pedigree?

And why can't the registries acknowledge more colors on registration?
 

Jill

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Black is what I'd use.

Wouldn't it be nice if the registries ever acknowledge all the correct colors and put them on the papers?

Something similar is I think they should also track the original color of true grey horses. That information is meaningful, in my opinion.
 

BlueStar

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I agree Jill...knowing the base/beginning color of a grey horse would be awesome to know!! Been going through that exact problem just recently.

I hate to register him black when he isn't. He is closer to bay/buckskin although he was mousy grey to start with with creamy spots in his flank area/armpits, muzzle, around his eyes, etc.. It is the colt in my avatar...that pic is at 2 days old and this is him a month ago, and now he is lighter still....





It is crazy that the dilute colors are recognized but not the resulting offspring possibilities. My colt can only genetically be 2 colors....
 

Jill

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He is so cute!!!!!!!!!!!! I love those eyes on him
:wub


I have a stallion who is smoky silver black... I think the registry computers would grind to a halt if that combination of letters was input
 

Irish Hills Farm

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I had a smokey black colt born this year and I checked off the box marked other and wrote in smokey black. AMHA registered him black and changed his facial markings (what a surprise) and AMHR registered him smokey black.
 

BlueStar

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Sheryl~ Why did they change his facial markings?

Can I change the registered color if he continues to change? I just hesitate to register him anything that does not indicate "cream" because it throws so many colors/people for a loop. sigh....

Jill~ Thanks for the compliments...I love him too. His eyes are the bluest blue and against his color, it is so striking. I am so happy he is minimal pinto, with almost as much chrome as possible ( minus face white of course
) without body white and that mixed skunk tail. LOL
 

Songcatcher

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When you have a smoky black foal....how do you register color? Do you do it as a bay, black or do you register as buckskin so that at least the cream gene recognized and is correctly on the pedigree?
And why can't the registries acknowledge more colors on registration?
I'll go at this a little bit backward and answer your last question first. AMHA will sometimes list the correct genetic color on the Registration Certificate itself, but a different color on the online Studbook because of the age of the program and the fact that there are not enough abbreviations for all the genetic colors that have been discovered.

Regarding what color to register the Smokey Black foal as. I would registere as Black, because it is (plus Cream). It is not Bay and not Buckskin because it has no Agouti gene (if it is truely Smokey Black). To register as Bay or Buckskin would be just as inaccurate (or maybe more so) than to register as Black.

Personally, I would do as Irish Hills did (if I knew for sure it was Smokey Black) and write it in. However, that can also pose a problem as so many people use it as a descriptive term rather than a genetic term. Very few Black foals appear really Black when they are born. Many people refer to them as being Smokey Black when there is no Cream gene present and it has nothing to do with their genetics.
 

rabbitsfizz

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If the animal has been genetically tested to be Black + Cream tick the "other" box, put Black + Cream and send a copy of the genetic test result so they know this is proven.

If they then put Black on the papers ask them why they are providing falsified documents when proof of actual colour has been supplied.

It took three times to get Rabbit changed from "Red Roan" (with absolutely NO visual proof of any "roan" whatsoever!!) to Red Dun but they did do it.

And I do not believe they ever changed the colour on papers I submitted after that
 

Irish Hills Farm

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BlueStar - I have no idea why they changed his facial markings from what I had wrote down. Guess they thought they knew his markings better than I.
 

BlueStar

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Thanks guys!! So if I have him tested...would I test for just agouti to determine black or buckskin? Since I already know he has the cream in there because the sire is a double dilute. (below) And also is it just a mane hair sample same thing you do for DNAing? If anyone has a link to the lab info, I would love to have it.

Thanks

Here is his sire~

 

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