Miniature Curly horses

[fireside]

Someone was asking about Miniature Curly horses (hypoallergenic) - www.firesideminiaturecurlyhorses.com I hope this doesn't break any rules!!!

 

[Lizzie]

I imagine these would have to be crossbred and not purebred Minis.

Regarding 'hypoallergenic' animals. A new study published by the American Journal of Rhinology & Allergy suggests that there may be no difference between allergens present in a 'supposed' hypoallergenic animal, compared to a non-hypoallergenic animal. I know that many tout their animals as being hypoallergenic but tests have proven otherwise. A horse or dog which is groomed and bathed regularly, will automatically shed off less allergens, than those who are not. However, too much bathing can sometimes make more dander shed off. It is most usually dander in dogs and horses, to which humans become allergic. Sometimes it is animal saliva. The only way to tell if one is allergic to an animal, is really to live with it.

Know that puppy millers and BYBs are the ones who often tout their animals as being hypoallergenic. It has all pretty much proven, to be nonsense. Just like 'non-shedding' dogs. No such thing. All animals which grow hair, grow the hair, the hair dies and falls out, and new growth appears. Same with humans. Yet people still buy into this falacy.

That said, I believe I heard a few years ago, that some had been working on breeding a true hyperallergenic cat. I didn't follow it further, so do not know the results.

I suspect I might have upset some here, but give only the facts as I know them. All are well documented and can be easily researched.

Lizzie

 

[Tremor]

I had to comment on Lizzie's first statement saying that they can't be purebred minis.

Minis are a height breed. Its highly possible.

 

[Lizzie]

I understand what you are saying Tremor, but wouldn't it be like introducing another breed into established lines, because they had something interesting in coat/ability etc. and then, regardless of size, calling them Minis. Certainly if they met (eventually) height requirements, they would be Mini size, but maybe not purebred Minis??

Lizzie

 

[ohmt]

I get what you're saying too Lizzie, but Tremor is right.

My grandparents used to have a mare (mini with a few generations of AMHA/AMHR pedigreed lineage behind her) that had a very curly coat and about half of her foals had curly coats as well. She was palomino and when she was born looked like a little lamb

 

[disneyhorse]

I think the question is not are they "purebred" miniatures... But are they REGISTERED miniatures? I imagine they wouldn't be registered with the big miniature horse registries, but I'm not familiar with the Curly horse breed. Perhaps they have a miniature division/designation on the papers... Maybe Fireside will educate us on how the horses are measured and papered.

As an aside, I also have seen the information about the "hypoallergenic" debate. It seems some individual animals are, but not all. This was big news when the "goldendoodle breed" started to gain popularity.

Andrea

 

[JMS Miniatures]

These are awesome. I love your lil bay pinto colt. Curious too as they probably aren't registered but if they are out of AMHR or ASPC stock if they can be NSPR registered? Might be a good selling point especially for the larger ones.

 

[Riverrose28]

I have a two year old colt his dam is a grand daughter of Hemlock EK, his sire has three crosses to Gold Melodie Boy, his pedigree also includes, Roan Ranger, NFC Sugar Boy, Boones Buckaroo, Little Kings Black Velvet and our own Lucky Four Sugar Boys sundowner. He was born so curly and stayed that way until this year, I called him my Little Lamb. Now his hair is almost normal except for his mane and tail which are still kind of kinky. Hey! Maybe I'm on to something of value here!

 

[Lizzie]

I think the question is not are they "purebred" miniatures... But are they REGISTERED miniatures? I imagine they wouldn't be registered with the big miniature horse registries, but I'm not familiar with the Curly horse breed. Perhaps they have a miniature division/designation on the papers... Maybe Fireside will educate us on how the horses are measured and papered.

As an aside, I also have seen the information about the "hypoallergenic" debate. It seems some individual animals are, but not all. This was big news when the "goldendoodle breed" started to gain popularity.

Andrea

I have a friend who breeds Curly horses Andrea, but have never heard her mention a division for Minis of the type. Maybe there is a registry which registers Curly Minis somewhere?

Re hypoallergenic dog breeds, here is something which might be of interest. I do think also, that some humans might be allergic to some dogs and others, not. Still, there is (so far) in the animal world, no such thing as hypoallergenic animals. This, unless the scientists who were studying cats, have in fact, come up with something.

What the gentleman (below) said, certainly rings true. He really did start something which became way out of control. Not just in the 'hypoallergenic' thing, but in the vast subsequent breeding of Poodle crosses of all kinds, and those who paid often big money, for something they thought they'd get, but sadly did not.

Lizzie

Labradoodle Creator Now Regrets Cross-Breeding

 

http://www.globalanimal.org/2010/12/...s-breed/25768/

(DOGS) The Labradoodle, a mix between a labrador and a standard poodle, was originally bred for a woman who needed a non-allergenic guide dog. Now, the man responsible for the breed’s creation says he regrets creating a new breed – and all of the problems that came along with it. – Global Animal

Sydney Morning Herald

If Wally Conron had known what was going to become of the labradoodle, he wouldn’t have bred the dog in the first place. It was 22 years ago and Conron, now 81, was working as the breeding manager for the Royal Guide Dog Association of Australia when his boss set him a tough task. A blind woman from Hawaii had written asking if they could provide a guide dog that would not shed hair, because her husband was allergic to it. ”I said, ‘Oh yes, this will be a piece of cake. The standard poodle is a working dog, it doesn’t shed hair, it’ll be great.’ I tried 33 in the course of three years and they all failed. They just didn’t make a guide dog.”

Conron decided there was one possibility left: take his best labrador bitch and mate it with a standard poodle. They created three cross-breed puppies that needed to be boarded out to be trained and socialised but nobody would take them; everyone wanted a pure-bred. And that’s when Conron came up with the name labradoodle. ”I went to our PR team and said, ‘Go to the press and tell them we’ve invented a new dog, the labradoodle.’ It was a gimmick and it went worldwide. No one wanted a cross-breed but the following day we had hundreds of calls from people wanting these master dogs.”

The labradoodle proved to be a brilliant dog for the blind and the woman in Hawaii was happy. So what was the problem?

It’s how the dog has been used and abused and sold under false pretences, Conron says. ”When the pups were five months old, we sent clippings and saliva to Hawaii to be tested with this woman’s husband. Of the three pups, he was not allergic to one of them. In the next litter I had, there were 10 pups but only three had non-allergenic coats. Now, people are breeding these dogs and selling them as non-allergenic and they’re not even testing them.

”All these backyard breeders have jumped on the bandwagon and they’re crossing any kind of dog with a poodle. They’re selling them for more than a pure-bred is worth and they’re not going into the backgrounds of the parents of the dogs. There are so many poodle crosses having fits, problems with their eyes, hips and elbows; a lot have epilepsy. There are a few ethical breeders but very, very few.”

Conron says that despite the fact the dogs have helped so many blind people, he regrets creating the first cross-breed. ”I released a Frankenstein. … People say ‘aren’t you proud of yourself?’ and I say, ‘not in the slightest. I’ve done so much harm to pure breeding.”’

 

[Wings]

What about a curly coat makes them hypoallergenic?

Given that a lot of allergies can stem from dander rather then hair (and also saliva) I've never understood the marketing behind hypoallergenic animals.

 

[disneyhorse]

It appears there are several different Curly registries, but not being familiar with them I don't know which one is the "main" registry and how serious the others are (AMHA versus WCMHR?)

The curly registry websites state that "some" of the horses are hypoallergenic or even just less allergy-triggering for "some" people and that there is no concrete evidence or reason why this might be the case, just some random hypothesis. They say it might be the hair, a protein in the skin...

 

[Marsha Cassada]

There are people allergic to horses??

Poor things!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I am allergic to some horses, some dogs and all strange cats (ie not my own) I also get hay fever, mild asthma and react badly to hay- I could be hired out to tell you if your hay is any good, it is not the dust, quite the opposite. Good , clean, rich hay will start me off every time, and I come out in a rash, too.

I was motivated, so I just put up with it all and got over it!

I am fine with my shedding (oh BOY do they shed) Dobes and with my little (unintentional) Cockerdoodle Frisé, and was OK with the Shelties so long as I combed them through (never bathed them) but I had, eventually and very sadly, to rehome my little Corgi as she was missing out on cuddles as I could not get near her.

 

[Sandee]

There are people allergic to horses??

Poor things!

Yes, unfortunately both of my grandsons test allergic to horses. The older one is getting better with treatment from an allergist and we hope the younger boy will too. Their younger sister -- has no problems--go figure.

 

[Lewella]

I haven't boned up on my Curly genetics lately but there are dominant curlies and there are recessive curlies. Some dominant curlies aren't very curly at all in summer coat and just wavy in winter. Someone on one of the color groups I'm a member of had several curlie ponies in the 40-45 inch range so it wouldn't surprise me in the least if curly genetics are present in miniatures in either registry given how much 'unknown' there is in our pedigrees.

 

[Matt73]

What about a curly coat makes them hypoallergenic?

Given that a lot of allergies can stem from dander rather then hair (and also saliva) I've never understood the marketing behind hypoallergenic animals.

I wonder about this, too. I'm slightly allergic to some cats and many dogs (the worst are the short-coated breeds like Dobermans, Shepherds etc.). The worst allergic reaction I've ever had to a breed of cat was a Sphinx (a hairless breed), whereas I'm not allergic at all to my Himalayan, Casey or my Ragdolls.

 

[susanne]

...my little (unintentional) Cockerdoodle Frisé...

Frisé is the BEST name for any poodle cross!! Darn you for coming up with it first! We do refer to our toy poodle as Velcro dog...

 

[fireside]

Not every allergy sufferer is not bothered by every Curly horse, but if you keep looking you will find a line that doesn't bother you. I've read lots of studies about hypoallergenic/not hypoallergenic animals, too, but you can't deny all the people who have horse allergies yet can be around and own Curlies. Oh, I'll mention, too, that the curls don't seem to have anything to do with it, in fact some people find the straight haired crosses are even more tolerable for them.

My horses are registered with the International Curly Horse Org. and yes they welcome miniatures. (or Miniature crosses I should say)

 

[Riverdance]

All dogs shed, some just a lot less than others. I have two 3lb Yorkies, never have I found a hair of theirs anywhere. They shed like humans. I also raise Tibetan Terriers who are considered non shedders. They shed, but not like most dogs. The most you will find is a tuff of hair here and there. They have hair like humans with a light undercoat. They are also considered non-allergenic, as are poodles, and many of the terrier breeds. I have had many buyers who have been allergic to dogs in general, who were not allergic to the Tibetans.

For this reason, these breeds are consider less allergenic than most breeds.

As for a curly coat Mini, I had one born 2 years ago. His coat is still curly. I will be showing him this year, but shaved down, no one will see the curl.

 

[sfmini]

We have a mare who has had many foals and every one was curly. Double registered AMHA/AMHR, national and world top tens. Their nick names are all Curly .... Started with Curly Sue, Curly Bob, Curly Q, Curly Fry, Curly Who, Curly Maple (SF Mahogany Bay) and this year the most priceless filly sired by SF Mahogany Bay (yes, bred to his dam) and her name is Curly Temple. They usually outgrow their curls so they aren't true curly horses, but as babies, they have curls everywhere. Their dam is 25 and looking great. We just weaned her and our other baby as they were late July, early August babies and mama never lost weight while nursing her filly.