Marketing your horse, what is important?

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Frankie

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If you really want to market a horse and that horse is shown. In your opinion, what holds the most weight for you? There is not a great number of national champions each year, only a select few, so if you are not one of those select few, what else do you use?

What would be the next in line?

National All Star Winner? Top Ten?

Regional Winner?

Honor Roll top ?????

Hall of Fame?

Other.

And if you were the a buyer looking for a top horse and show record was important, what would you look for?

Just wondering, when you find out a horse was a National Winner, or even a top 10, do you ask how many were in the class? Or is that unimportant?

Thanks
 

Marty

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I"ll give it a go because my answer and point of view might probably differ from others.

There's a lot of champion horses out there to choose from all over the place. So, I'd go with the person that I respect above all. I would go with the person that truly is devoted to the animals and treats them like more than merchandise or a money making machine. If I love a horse, but don't like your ethics or morals, or I feel that you don't treat your horses right, then I don't care what you are peddleing, I'd take my business elsewhere.

Just wondering, when you find out a horse was a National Winner, or even a top 10, do you ask how many were in the class? Or is that unimportant?

Michael came home from the races with a 1st place win last week. There's usually 20 or more in the race, but when I asked him how many cars were in there, he said 2..............duh?

Yes this matters. I know plenty of people right here in my area where I live that show various breeds all claming to have champions in their barn. But when asked how many were there in the class, and the answer is "just me" or 1, 2, or 5.......well........I'd then like to know who the other horses were in that class as well. It's not always quantity if you have beaten out quality horses. Sorry, but that is where good solid competition comes into play.
 

Erica

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Well I think it all depends.........

As for Nationals, there are A LOT of quality horses there in every class. But for me a national Champion in Costume, Showmanship, Color, Obstacle, Jumper/Hunter ext would not mean near as much for "ME" as one in Halter, driving or Liberty, JUST for the fact that I am not breeding for color and then things like showmanship can be trained ( talking looking at purchasing breeding animals here) If I was looking for an all around show gelding then yes showmanship/hunter ext would mean something more.

And yes Top Tens are also great, I know last year in the Ammy Jr. under mares class there was 70 something entries in it, all judged at the same time and you can beat I was VERY pleased with BOTH getting a Reserve National Champion and also a 6th place in that class with both my girls.

For all Star awards - to me that is more like a point chasing thing. I usually have good show seasons yet don't get any All Star Champions (do have allstars each year) but I don't go to shows 2,3,4 times a month either so don't get lots of points. With All star points (to my understanding) it is just based on how you place, not how many in the class. So if you were the only one in the class then you still get the points for 1st place, so technically you could go all season showing against yourself and get lots of allstar points.

With Local shows, you would just have to look at which ones. Down here in Area 5 we have awesome local shows with really tough competetion so a win is really great.

A HOF is really good for selling I would think, it takes a lot of work to get one.

*But for me the main thing Marketing a horse is the horse itself. If I am not sold on the horse then no amount of show records are going to catch my attention. If that horse, in its flesh, in a picture can't give me a "wow" it would be good in my herd, then it will just be passed by.
 
L

Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis

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I am pretty much with Erica on this one except i feel that HOF "CAN" be a point issue to

not saying that horses that achieve it dont deserve it and of course a horse who achieves it in a very few shows well that says more but all in all i would like to see the competition the horse was showing against on a local level

so those things would factor in my decision overall but not play heavily like a top ten or win in a open or ammy halter/driving class at the National level would.

But no matter what the horse has won or hasn't won it is the horse itself and its offspring that needs to win me over (if not old enough then sire and dams other get and the consistency of both there good and bad)

I always say if it was as easy as breeding a National champion to a National champion to get a national champion well then most of us would have national champions


so show record is part but certainly not the be all end all for me
 
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Erica

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Yes Lisa, I would think HOF "could" be a point thing, but at least to get LOTS of points for HOF you have to have lots of horses in the class also.............so if you are only the one in the class you only get 1pt, and to get 70 would take a while.

I am sure you could look up how many years it took a horse to acheive it I would think?? Or the owners should be able to provide that info.

I know my HOF horses have got theirs as two year olds and it is something that I am very glad of to accomplished the first year they could, but there are other horses that might not have been shown until they were say 5 and got it then?
 

Cathy_H

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And if you were the a buyer looking for a top horse and show record was important, what would you look for?
WHO was-is-has been showing the horse. The exhibitor is a big factor of who gets the top ribbons sometimes (my opinion). If it was a BIG TIME trainer who wins a lot -hmmmm. A smaller name trainer - good, or the owner, exhibitor himself - I'm even more impressed - tell me more................. Show titles really don't matter if I as the buyer want to earn them myself. Sell me a good horse, let me condition & train it, bring out its best & let us win our own titles. ( in my case, hubby Lee as I don't show). Then again we don't go to nationals so that title is out.... Still - a great horse is a great horse-titles or not - shown or not.
 
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lyn_j

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[SIZE=14pt]National top tens better even natl champion or reserves but if a horse is consistantly year after year in the top 10 in halter, or driving this is as far as showing the most important to me.... HOF also if obtained quickly with lots of competition is important. For me a mare if she is a dam of distinction that is even more important because it means she has at lest 3 foals that also have reached Hall of Fame status.[/SIZE]

Regional championships are next in importance.

Local shows, open shows dont mean didly.

BTW for those who have never been at nationals....class size averages between 25 and 75 for ammy and open halter classes. The only small classes anymore are the PMC stuff with 6-10,Roman Charriot ,and Park harness. Last year one of the ladies driving classes had 3 splits thats how big it was! More than 50 driving horses in one class!

Getting a top ten at nationals isnt as easy as people think anymore or even as easy as it was 3 years ago.

showmanship they are judging you not the horse and obstacle and jumping just mean a horse has brains to learn not that is is a choice for the breeding shed. When your horses are also a business you have to keep that in mind.

Lyn
 

Magic

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lyn_j said:
[SIZE=14pt] For me a mare if she is a dam of distinction that is even more important because it means she has at lest 3 foals that also have reached Hall of Fame status.[/SIZE]

458564[/snapback]


Actually, the rule book states "A mare is designated as a Superior Dam when she has produced two Hall of Fame offspring, and a stallion becomes a Superior Sire when he has six Hall of Fame offspring"

I had to look that up to be sure, because one of my mares just became a Superior Dam.
 
L

Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis

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This may be a stupid question but wont be my first


to be a superior dam or sire do they HOF as well and does the offpsring HOF have to be in the same catagory?

Like say the dam has a HOF in halter can her offspring get it in driving to make her a superior dam

I am thinking the answer to that is yes since some prefer to show one over the other not that the horse cant do both so it would make sense but what makes sense to me isnt often reality
 

lyn_j

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[SIZE=14pt]Thanks Magic for looking that up! Im confused often....Yes Lisa it can be in another category I believe.....Magic can you look that up? Dam of Distinction is a Dog term.....sorry.[/SIZE]

Lyn
 

Vertical Limit

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Frankie said:
And if you were the a buyer looking for a top horse and show record was important, what would you look for?
Just wondering, when you find out a horse was a National Winner, or even a top 10, do you ask how many were in the class? Or is that unimportant?

Thanks

458455[/snapback]

Well, I might be a bit different but when I look for a horse to show I look for one that has little or no show record. I do not want a "made" horse. I do not want to fly on somebody elses coat tails. But that is just me.

And yes, if a horse is a National winner I do want to know how many was in the class and WHAT class. I do not put much merit into some. I also am one who thinks that Top Tens are handed out too freely in Miniatures. I mean, what good is a Top Ten (10th place) if there were only ten to begin with. I do not see much of a personal accomplishment there. I want there to be some meaning behind that win. Again, just my personal opinion.

Erica said....But for me the main thing Marketing a horse is the horse itself. If I am not sold on the horse then no amount of show records are going to catch my attention. If that horse, in its flesh, in a picture can't give me a "wow" it would be good in my herd, then it will just be passed by.
Very much agreed.
 
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Magic

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Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis said:
This may be a stupid question but wont be my first
to be a superior dam or sire do they HOF as well and does the offpsring HOF have to be in the same catagory?

Like say the dam has a HOF in halter can her offspring get it in driving to make her a superior dam

458714[/snapback]


It doesn't have to be the same category, and no, a mare doesn't have to have a Hall of Fame herself to become a Superior Dam. It does so happen that my mare that just became a Superior Dam has Hall of Fame awards in Halter, Country Pleasure Driving, Pleasure Driving, Roadster, and Jumper.
Her two foals that have Hall of Fames are both in Halter.

But the Hall of Fame could be in any category, I believe.
 

[email protected]

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First, any show wins, or lack can be skewed. Look at Orion, he doesn't have any titles to speak of as he wasn't shown or was shown poorly from all I've read. No one can deny he's not a simply stunning mini. So all show info has to be taken in context of the horse itself.

If you really want to market a horse and that horse is shown. In your opinion, what holds the most weight for you? There is not a great number of national champions each year, only a select few, so if you are not one of those select few, what else do you use?

What would be the next in line?

National All Star Winner? Top Ten?

Regional Winner?

Honor Roll top ?????

Hall of Fame?

Other.

I've only recently began showing and learning the whole point deal, and really feel most people do not use the HOF, Superior Dam/Sire type titles enough in their marketing. So, for marketing I use what is available! If you don't participate at the National level, (which for many of us on the West Coast is extremely time consuming and expensive to do as compared to the mid America states), I have to use Regional level competition/wins, and any other awards, etc., the horse may get.

And if you were the a buyer looking for a top horse and show record was important, what would you look for?

If I was buying to show, I wouldn't want a record I would want to do that myself. As a breeder, if buying mature (over 5+) breeding stock, assuming a correct mini, I would be most interested in and have researched their pedigree, produce record (and their parents/siblings) first. But as you asked specifically about show record - I would want to see National level - NC/res, or Top Ten halter or performance. I don't care for color, youth costume, etc. (not that it's not lots of hard work, but not where my interest lies). Then Regional, HOF would all be weighed and considered.

Just wondering, when you find out a horse was a National Winner, or even a top 10, do you ask how many were in the class? Or is that unimportant?

I wouldn't ask, as I would probably have researched that on my own first. I don't want a surprise as a NC in costume - great that someone did that but that doesn't make it a great horse! As for the number in the class - there are so many ways to look at that. As Lyn pointed our with the AMHR National classes being well over 25+ a Top Ten is usually hard earned, but say there were only 5 and think of your top five favorite stallions - what if you placed last to them? Or think of the twenty worst stallions you've seen, would it be important that you beat them? Or if the horse won loads as a weanling and fell apart over the years.

I show an under 28" stallion that I'm lucky if there are three horses in a class - so does that make him not worthy? He's one that will probably never get his HOF, as it would take years because of the lack of competition at any given show. He's fortunately proving himself breeding which is the bottomline anyway for me!
 

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