LowriseMinis
Well-Known Member
Whoops! Sorry about the mix up, Lisa!
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Charley
Well-Known Member
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These are two sites that tell a different story about Obama's community organizer experience. I guess you will let me know if they are credible.
http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2...r-was-a-co.html
btw...this one is written by a British lady.
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips...elieve-in.thtml
http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2...r-was-a-co.html
btw...this one is written by a British lady.
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips...elieve-in.thtml
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LowriseMinis
Well-Known Member
I stopped reading the first one after Godwin's Law came up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law and I'm still poking around the second one.
L
LisaF.
Guest
Lowriseminis - I havn't had a chance to read it yet - but, that is ok - that was a easy thing to over look. I just didn't want anyone thinking my dad was so hot headed..LOL
LowriseMinis
Well-Known Member
On the second article posted by Charley-it's an editorial by a biased writer, but I did read it and gave it some thought.
The general summary I gathered from the article was that Barack Obama is a Marxist by association with a man he's never met due to something he did when he was 24 years old and just out of college in the 1980's.
"The seditious role of the community organiser was developed by an extreme left intellectual called Saul Alinsky."
Alinsky did not invent the role of community organizer, nor did he develop it. Community organizers existed without a title arguably for as long as societies have existed. In a loose way, anyone within a community who does anything to create movement, change, or action in that community could be called a community organizer.
From the Wikipedia article (full disclosure: it IS having it's neutrality disputed as pointed out before): "Community organizing is a process by which people living in proximity to each other, are brought together to act in their common self-interest. Community organizers act as area-wide coordinators of programs for different agencies in an attempt to meet community needs for various services. Community organizers work actively, as do other types of social workers, in community councils of social agencies and in community-action groups. At times the role of community organizers overlaps that of the social planners.[1]"
There is nothing about the duties of a community organizer than intrinsically makes them Marxist or anything else.
While Alinsky held Marxist values, he also help to form effective grassroots movements, that are still followed by many today-including Obama. Other notables are Cesar Chavez, and Andrew Vachss who established the National Association to Protect Children.
The Spectator article also claims that Obama himself is a racist, used his time as a community organizer to further his anti-white agenda, and that his church is also racist. You can read a bit about Obama's 'racist' church here: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/church.asp
Now, what did Obama spend his three years as a community organizer doing? Working with the Catholic Campaign for Human Development, which was apparently concerned with a number of it's members were laid off from steel mill work around Chicago. http://www.usccb.org/cchd/
From TheNation.com: http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070416/moberg
"Then he got a call from Jerry Kellman, an organizer working on Chicago's far South Side for a community group based in the churches of the region, an expanse of white, black and Latino blue-collar neighborhoods that were reeling from the steel-mill closings. Kellman was looking for an organizer for the new Developing Communities Project (DCP), which would focus on black city neighborhoods.
Obama, only 24, struck board members as "awesome" and "extremely impressive," and they quickly hired him, at $13,000 a year, plus $2,000 for a car--a beat-up blue Honda Civic, which Obama drove for the next three years organizing more than twenty congregations to change their neighborhoods."
"Obama worked in the organizing tradition of Saul Alinsky, who made Chicago the birthplace of modern community organizing, as translated through the Gamaliel Foundation, one of several networks of faith-based organizing. Often by confronting officials with insistent citizens--rather than exploiting personal connections, as traditional black Democrats proposed--Obama and DCP protected community interests regarding landfills and helped win employment training services, playgrounds, after-school programs, school reforms and other public amenities."
There are tons of articles around about community organizers, about Obama's experience as a community organizer, questioning his effectiveness (even he himself admits he may not have been the most effective, but he does place a lot of importance on what he learned in those years), and all sorts of other things.
But very little real evidence that Obama is a commie.
The general summary I gathered from the article was that Barack Obama is a Marxist by association with a man he's never met due to something he did when he was 24 years old and just out of college in the 1980's.
"The seditious role of the community organiser was developed by an extreme left intellectual called Saul Alinsky."
Alinsky did not invent the role of community organizer, nor did he develop it. Community organizers existed without a title arguably for as long as societies have existed. In a loose way, anyone within a community who does anything to create movement, change, or action in that community could be called a community organizer.
From the Wikipedia article (full disclosure: it IS having it's neutrality disputed as pointed out before): "Community organizing is a process by which people living in proximity to each other, are brought together to act in their common self-interest. Community organizers act as area-wide coordinators of programs for different agencies in an attempt to meet community needs for various services. Community organizers work actively, as do other types of social workers, in community councils of social agencies and in community-action groups. At times the role of community organizers overlaps that of the social planners.[1]"
There is nothing about the duties of a community organizer than intrinsically makes them Marxist or anything else.
While Alinsky held Marxist values, he also help to form effective grassroots movements, that are still followed by many today-including Obama. Other notables are Cesar Chavez, and Andrew Vachss who established the National Association to Protect Children.
The Spectator article also claims that Obama himself is a racist, used his time as a community organizer to further his anti-white agenda, and that his church is also racist. You can read a bit about Obama's 'racist' church here: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/church.asp
Now, what did Obama spend his three years as a community organizer doing? Working with the Catholic Campaign for Human Development, which was apparently concerned with a number of it's members were laid off from steel mill work around Chicago. http://www.usccb.org/cchd/
From TheNation.com: http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070416/moberg
"Then he got a call from Jerry Kellman, an organizer working on Chicago's far South Side for a community group based in the churches of the region, an expanse of white, black and Latino blue-collar neighborhoods that were reeling from the steel-mill closings. Kellman was looking for an organizer for the new Developing Communities Project (DCP), which would focus on black city neighborhoods.
Obama, only 24, struck board members as "awesome" and "extremely impressive," and they quickly hired him, at $13,000 a year, plus $2,000 for a car--a beat-up blue Honda Civic, which Obama drove for the next three years organizing more than twenty congregations to change their neighborhoods."
"Obama worked in the organizing tradition of Saul Alinsky, who made Chicago the birthplace of modern community organizing, as translated through the Gamaliel Foundation, one of several networks of faith-based organizing. Often by confronting officials with insistent citizens--rather than exploiting personal connections, as traditional black Democrats proposed--Obama and DCP protected community interests regarding landfills and helped win employment training services, playgrounds, after-school programs, school reforms and other public amenities."
There are tons of articles around about community organizers, about Obama's experience as a community organizer, questioning his effectiveness (even he himself admits he may not have been the most effective, but he does place a lot of importance on what he learned in those years), and all sorts of other things.
But very little real evidence that Obama is a commie.
Charley
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It is pretty weird stuff when you read the links in the articles. I wonder where all this money he is raising in record amounts for his campaign is coming from, certainly not from the people who are out of work or struggling to have food on the table and gas in the car. I also looked up ACORN and Gamaliel Foundation and IAF with whom he had worked and where he still has ties with to this day ....if nothing else it makes for an interesting read.
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LowriseMinis
Well-Known Member
Turns out some of that info is available online, too.
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib....p;cid=N00009638
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/politic...0,7641355.story
Camelotcavs
Well-Known Member
Actually the NRA stated "If elected, Barack Obama would be the most anti-gun president in American history."
NRA-Institute for Legislative Action
The fact that he supported a ban on firearms kept in the home and a ban on right-to-carry permits made my decision for me and thousands of other gun carrying voters.
LowriseMinis
Well-Known Member
http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/Barack...Gun_Control.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/john_m...gun_control.htm
I'm feeling lazy, so I'm just posting links now.
http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/john_m...gun_control.htm
I'm feeling lazy, so I'm just posting links now.
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