How Important is AMMY and Youth

[JWC sr.]

I started this thread from a thought provoked by another thread.

What is the general opinion of the importance of Youth and Amateur classes to the overall success of the two registries in "Your Opinion"?

No wrong or right answers on this one, I would just like to know what you think!!!

I will go ahead and give you mine to get it started:

1. Youth classes are the most important part of shows as this is where the majority of growth can be attributed to.

As an example Grandma/Grandpa or Mom/Dad want little Betty and Johnny to spend time with them and animals. They are introduced to small equine an buy 1 or 2 to get the kids going and thru whatever programs they can find on a local club or registry basis they start exhibiting. A win for breeders who sell the horses, a win for the respective registry, a win for the kids, a win for the grandparents/parents and a win for the local club in my opinion.

2. Amateur classes are the second most important in that the same group of Grandparents/Parents& kids, the adults think it looks like fun and start to show. In the AMMY ring they run into stiff competition from "professional amateurs" and decide to try and become competitive, so they need better horses in some cases and acquire horses for themselves. Again a win for all concerned.

I personally believe a large amount of the advertising budget of both registries should be spent on things such as Youth programs/awards, ammy awards and promoting new shows in virgin or forgotten areas to attract these type people. We need them and the only way we are going to get them is to have a strong local based well thought out program for them to participate in and then we have to scour 4-H clubs, FFA chapters, other breed functions and anywhere else we can think of to get them. The other breeds are doing it and we need ot fight fire with fire so to speak by putting money where it will benefit the overall industry as much as possible.

I also think we should have grands for both divisions madatory at each and every show that is sanctioned. Additionally, the classes need to be broken down as per age for the kids and levels of experience of the amateurs. I knwo we have some break down now, but it needs to be more difinitive.

If that means beacuse of the number of other classes we offer we have to delete some of the ones that are not used regularily then so be it. For instance the model classes could go away, they are seldom used at most shows except as an afterthought by most exhibitors.

Yes the open classes are always going to hold the honors for being the most competitive and toughest place to win. But they by no means should overshadow the importance of the Youth and Amateur classes.

 

[~Lisa~]

I think our youth are very important however I feel that offering incentives and programs to those few that show and even less that show at a National level is not really helping the cause.

The reality is very few of our members and mini owners actually show. Incentives or not they do not want to be in the show ring for whatever reason.

Perhaps parents can not take time off work, buy a trailer, afford show clothes or the shows themselves however those kids are still out there every day loving on their minis. I think we need more programs to acknowledge them.

The youth committee in AMHR is working on this and their are some good programs now available I would like there to be more although I am not sure what that more is

 

[ohmt]

I completely agree with your opinions. I know the registries have done such a great job so far giving incentives for youth and ammy classes. I would like to see a lot more advertising for the classes though-my local club does such an awesome job of promoting youth classes, AMHA and AMHR should do the same.

I have a friend who runs a youth program in her area and I just love what she has done. She invites all youth to her farm 2x a week for scheduled meetings. The youth pick a horse that they would like to work with and that is the horse that gets assigned to them for the show season. She brings them to as many shows as she can and they have so much fun. She takes pictures and documents everything and makes a folder for them. She's had parents so impressed with the program that they have bought horses from her so their children could work with them every day and show. Now THAT is a heck of a way to promote miniature horses!!

I love the amateur classes because it is such a great way to get new people involved with showing. It is still competitive, but just not quite as scary as the open classes.

Youth and Amateurs are the key to keeping the registries a success. Why? Because EVERYONE starts as either one or the other.

 

[kaykay]

Thank you John Cherry!!

My previous post about putting in more ammy and youth money isnt just for ammy and youth showing. There are many different ways to promote youth and adults with horses outside of the show ring and inside the ring. I do believe some of those programs have started but they need more funding.

For ones that do show the Royalty program is also hurting. This is a great program to encourage and reward youth for their participation in small equine. I do worry it will disappear. My son was given the opportunity to participate in that program and I know what a boost it was to him. I would like to see this program continue so that more youth are given that chance.

And for youth and ammy that do show---their participation is the backbone of everything. Without them it would just be a trainers show. Without them who are we going to sell horses to? I would venture a guess to say that AMHR nationals would be a far cry from 1500 horses without the youth or ammy people entering.

 

[JWC sr.]

I completely agree with the thought that the incentives offered on a National basis is not going to benefit more than just a few youth and amateurs that are already involved anyway. We still need the extra breakdowns and champions classes for them though.

The program that ohmt spoke about is more along the lines I would love to see.

Getting those kids involved in that manner promotes from the ground floor up. Additionally we need to get both registries to be approved by 4-H & FFA as recognized programs, so that when kids take days off to attend a show it is an excused absence for them.

I would also be in favor of subsidizing programs sponsored by local clubs such as that. I know from just our farms standpoint we would be more than willing to donate geldings, time etc. to working with something like that.

 

[Echo Acres]

I too believe the youth and ammy programs are important. I have 2 chldren now 4 and 9 that show all the way to nationals. I strongly believe that the age groups need to be broken down into the 3 divisions. But I have seen my daughter as a 2 year old with a yearling beat kids that are 15 and 17. I think it is important for them to show against kids their age and not get discouraged when showing against kids that are 17.

Out of the 2 I feel the youth is the most important as they are our future. Of course I like to see the hard working ammy rewarded, but myself I get more out of seeing my kids out there working hard and earning the recognition they receive.

Here is a little different twist on it. Some of the breeders are now offering young geldings to youth to show. This is a win win for all I think. It gets the kids involved, having to work and train them and it puts the farm name out in the show ring as well. We have experienced this first hand more than once and I think it is a great idea.

I think the previous posts hit it right on the money. Nationals would be a lot smaller if it was only trainers and yes who would those breeders/trainers have to sell to if the youth/ammy people weren't out there showing?

Thinking outside of the box, I feel my kids get a lot more than working with the horses out of it. They help clean barns, feed, train, exercise and show our horses all the way from yearlings on up. They learn responsibility, good sportsmanship, and that life is not always fair. They feel proud when they win knowing they earned it rather than just getting things handed to them. They also learn the other aspect of getting the gate. I think a lot of life lessons get learned through the whole process if done right.

 

[bevann]

I too believe the youth and ammy programs are important. I have 2 chldren now 4 and 9 that show all the way to nationals. I strongly believe that the age groups need to be broken down into the 3 divisions. But I have seen my daughter as a 2 year old with a yearling beat kids that are 15 and 17. I think it is important for them to show against kids their age and not get discouraged when showing against kids that are 17.

Out of the 2 I feel the youth is the most important as they are our future. Of course I like to see the hard working ammy rewarded, but myself I get more out of seeing my kids out there working hard and earning the recognition they receive.

Here is a little different twist on it. Some of the breeders are now offering young geldings to youth to show. This is a win win for all I think. It gets the kids involved, having to work and train them and it puts the farm name out in the show ring as well. We have experienced this first hand more than once and I think it is a great idea.

I think the previous posts hit it right on the money. Nationals would be a lot smaller if it was only trainers and yes who would those breeders/trainers have to sell to if the youth/ammy people weren't out there showing?

Thinking outside of the box, I feel my kids get a lot more than working with the horses out of it. They help clean barns, feed, train, exercise and show our horses all the way from yearlings on up. They learn responsibility, good sportsmanship, and that life is not always fair. They feel proud when they win knowing they earned it rather than just getting things handed to them. They also learn the other aspect of getting the gate. I think a lot of life lessons get learned through the whole process if done right.

I think Youth and Amateur are EXTREMELY important.Our club, DELMARVA MINIATURE HORSE CLUB, with our annual AMHR show in Delaware gives a break in cost for Youth and Amateur classes.We also offer A&B Amateur Champion of Champions, High Point Performance and Youth High Point and Youth High Point Classic.We give large rosettes in club colors(burgundy and grey) and VERY nice trophies for each winner. We encourage Youth and Amateurs to come to our shows.

 

[backwoodsnanny]

As with any club or organization the youth are the future whether you are AMHA, AMHR, or a local club. If we want to maintain or grow into the future the youth is of ultimate importance. I also agree with all that has been said about AMMY as without the regular guy all that would show would be trainers or the bigger breeding farms. Youth and Ammy are the backbone of any organization be it horse showing or any other activity.

 

[targetsmom]

I certainly agree with what has been said so far, but I tend to think outside the box and offer anther suggestion. I think that anything that gets more youth and ammys involved has great potential for long term growth in the miniature breed. I feel that there are potential mini owners at every local open horse show and feel that if mini classes could be added to these existing shows, it would be very cost effective. And why would a show add the classes or mini owners want to show in them? What if someone (registry, group of breeders, Lil Beginnings...anyone) offered awards through a point system that ammys and youth could earn at these local shows? The Pinto Association already has a point system that works this way (for registered Pintos showing in Open shows) and I have also seen it work at the state level open to any breed. Shows & classes have to be approved and a show secretary has to verify class size and placing. Performance classes are stressed over halter, offering something for almost everyone. A fee would be required to register and cover the cost of awards, which could be as simple as certificates.

 

[ruffian]

While this "What if someone (registry, group of breeders, Lil Beginnings...anyone) offered awards through a point system that ammys and youth could earn at these local shows? " Is a good idea, I think it needs to be closer to the source.

I would LOVE to see a YOUTH CHAMPION classes, and AMATEUR Champion classes at local shows. The open champions get the big trophies, neck ribbons, points. The Y/A can go into those classes, but typically don't do as well against pro trainers and pro amateurs.

If I were managing a show - did before and might start one again - I would work hard to get Y/A champion awards. It has to be recognition at the LOCAL LEVEL - INSTANT GRATIFICATION!! Not everybody can or wants to go to Worlds or Nationals. No problem. Make the local shows mean more to the YA!!

A couple of our local shows have high point youth and high point amateur awards. Most winner's don't realize it's going on and it's awarded at the end of the show when 90% of the folks have gone.

I say add Champion Jr and Sr and Grand Mares and Gelding classes for Youth, and those plus Jr & Sr Stallions, plus Grand Champion Stallions for Ammys at your local shows. They can be "non rated" if AMHA/AMHR won't approve, but so what? The RECOGNITION is there! Get a few trainers to kick for the neck sashes!! They are potential future clients!

I can GUARANTEE you will get more Youth and Ammys showing. Plus - those "amateurs" who win consistently at Worlds and Nationals?? Come on, give the local folks a break and stay out of the local show Ammy classes.

YA'S RULE!

:yeah

 

[hobbyhorse23]

2. Amateur classes are the second most important in that the same group of Grandparents/Parents& kids, the adults think it looks like fun and start to show. In the AMMY ring they run into stiff competition from "professional amateurs" and decide to try and become competitive, so they need better horses in some cases and acquire horses for themselves. Again a win for all concerned.

OR they become extremely discouraged and stop right there. I've seen it happen and darn near done it myself! It is not fair for so-called "professional amateurs" to continue to float around in those classes when professional trainers are asking those individuals to catch handle their horses at the national level because they're so good. Since there's no way to mandate that sort of thing except on the honor system, I wish AMHR would implement a version of the AOTE program so those who aren't with a trainer have somewhere they can be against other true amateurs instead of folks who got handed their horses at the gate. I felt this was an issue with Arabs back when I was showing them and it certainly is with the minis IMO.

The reality is very few of our members and mini owners actually show. Incentives or not they do not want to be in the show ring for whatever reason.
Perhaps parents can not take time off work, buy a trailer, afford show clothes or the shows themselves however those kids are still out there every day loving on their minis. I think we need more programs to acknowledge them.

Here, here! I know I personally hate body-clipping with a passion and it takes a lot of the fun out of it for me to do so much prep work for just a few classes I might not even place in. Ugh! Comments from a few family members and friends with full-sized horses who attended the Can-Am show with me this last weekend were that they thought the "skinned look" was ridiculous, the halter horses looked "bizarre" balded and they hated the shanking. Driving was "cool" but they didn't like the way a couple of horses were roaring and struggling to breathe. They were very impressed with the horses themselves but wished we'd show them more naturally. They also found it frustrating how you couldn't actually see any horse in the barns as they were all covered nose to tail in multiple layers 24/7. Many people I've talked to cite all the prep work for so little amateur return as one of the major reasons they don't want to show. It seems pointless to them, not fun! They much prefer local open shows where all you have to do is clean them and clip fetlocks, bridlepath, ears and whiskers then get on with the business of showing your horse. I don't share these as things that need to change necessarily, only to show some of the reasons that people may not want to get into the ring with their own horses.

I would LOVE to see a YOUTH CHAMPION classes, and AMATEUR Champion classes at local shows. The open champions get the big trophies, neck ribbons, points. The Y/A can go into those classes, but typically don't do as well against pro trainers and pro amateurs. ...

I can GUARANTEE you will get more Youth and Ammys showing. Plus - those "amateurs" who win consistently at Worlds and Nationals?? Come on, give the local folks a break and stay out of the local show Ammy classes.

Yes to all of the above! I'd never noticed the lack of an amateur halter championship in AMHR because I only showed driving but now I'm discouraged from showing my 2 year old as we likely won't be competitive in open and I don't feel like doing all that work just to go in one Ammy class and not even be eligible for a championship. AMHA does that part MUCH better so I've been showing there this year despite the increased expense.

Reward your amateurs! Reward people for participating in programs outside the breed ring! And yes, encourage your youth through programs like 4-H and FFA. It's so worth it.

Leia

 

[Charlotte]

John, this is EXACTLY why Frank wrote up the proposal that is now working it's way through the system at AMHA.

The foundation of any breed is the 'small breeder', one or two horse owner. GIVE THEM SOMETHING TO DO WITH THEIR HORSES! Hence the half day and one day show ... Youth Performance Show or Amateur Show which provides the exhibitor with the chance to earn AMHA points towards Honor Roll and other awards....or World if they want to go. ...... And FUN, without hotel bills, travel expenses, etc etc.

I think this comes up for vote at the next Annual Meeting. If you support it, talk to everyone you know who might be going to the meeting and encourage them to vote for it.

How many more youth and amateurs do you think would show their horses if they could do it in a morning at, say, the local roundup club arena 3 miles away?

Charlotte

 

[Karen S]

Good afternoon,

Just so that folks will know, the ASPC/AMHR Club of N. Texas did try to host just an All Youth/Amateur show two years ago. We needed the show in order for us to take back to the BOD showing the number of youth, amateurs, class participation etc so that we would get a rating. I had the class list with ALL of the youth classes, even those performance classes that were broken down by age, 7 & Under, 8-12, and 13-17. I had ALL of the amateur classes listed in the rulebook. We wanted to be sure that Hall of Fame and All Star points were given too.

Well, I only ended up with ONE entry for the show, so guess what folks, it was dropped like a hot potato. The comments we got were they didn't want to spend the money on a show that they were not going to reap anything in return. So Charlotte, I tip my hat to you and Frank if you can pull it off. I keep saying, if you offer that type of show they will come...but apparently they (youth/amateurs) are not interested in one.

Let me know if you are successful in getting it passed at your next meeting. I still have all of my paperwork and class list that was drawn up for an all Youth/Amateur show for those that wanted to show with like peers without trainers.

Karen Shaw

Chairman

ASPC/AMHR/ASPR Triple A Amateur Program

 

[Zipper]

What a great topic.

I am newbie. I am older but I have went to a couple of fun shows and with all the help from this group on cleaning up my horses and how to dress and what I am doing wrong. I am going to go to some bigger shows. I want to show.

Starting out is hard though

You have to buy everything at once almost for your first show. So it is expensive.

Show horses are expensive and lots of people dont want to show unless they have a show horse. Well I cant afford one so I am showing my 2 boys that I have. I know I will enjoy going and showing the country bumpkins.

It would be a big help if anybody had older show halters that they dont use anymore to sell them to newbies at a reasonable price or loan them to them to get them started bcause I know this is some of the hardest things to find money to buy.

I also find it hard to find the proper place to go to find out the answers on how to fill the forms out and what classes etc. what is allowed and what isnt as the AMHA and the AMHR books are hard to read for the rules and what to do for the classes.

I am not complaining about anything just some things that would make it easier for a amateur to get started as I am sure there are people that will get discouraged before they make it to the ring. Not me I am going to be there. I cant wait. I love it.

 

[~Lisa~]

We do not have even one AMHA show in our state so that would be wonderful do be able to do a youth only show. Not sure how many people would come but would be nice to have that option

 

[kaykay]

OR they become extremely discouraged and stop right there. I've seen it happen and darn near done it myself! It is not fair for so-called "professional amateurs" to continue to float around in those classes when professional trainers are asking those individuals to catch handle their horses at the national level because they're so good.

I so agree and have tried for years to get something along a novice class going but hit a brick wall every time. I was just chatting with Karen about this. I have seen so many new people come to one or maybe 2 shows and once they figure out who they are showing against in ammy class they just quit and you never see them again. I have said so many times you can give a novice handler the best show horse and they can still lose simply because they have to get experience in the show ring on presenting a horse.

I remember when I first started and someone explained to me that ammy just means "doesnt get paid/take money. I was told to just pay my dues and keep going in and I would get better. And I did. And I loved every minute of it. But I was extremely lucky to have some really good mentors to help me a long the way. Not everyone has that.

I would rather invest in a novice class and try to keep these new people interested. You could just go by points and once they attain a certain amount of points they go up to ammy. But I think the points should only count with competition.

Kay

 

[Charlotte]

We do not have even one AMHA show in our state so that would be wonderful do be able to do a youth only show. Not sure how many people would come but would be nice to have that option

Lisa, that is exactly what Frank found when he started researching this idea.....24, or something like that, states have no AMHA shows. What a shame.

Of course, you wouldn't expect many exhibitors when the shows first become available...........people have to find out about it and hear others talking about it to become interested in giving it a try. The shows would be cheap to put on and cheap to enter and exhibit in. The youth performance shows wouldn't necessarily require clipping so could be held in a half day outdoors at all times of year in moderate climates. Then the kids could go on to their basket ball game in the afternoon...or viceversa.

I really hope there are enough people interested in trying the concept to get it voted in at the meeting.

Charlotte