Hello, I'm new and have questions! big belly? training?

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RoleyPoley

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Hi all! I am a recent first owner of a weanling mini, and a lifetime horse person. I always knew I would work with horses, and have been an equine vet tech for 7 years now. But I know very little about mini's and recently have come upon this site, and I am so excited to learn from everyone!

My biggest concern has to do with a topic I read on here, gas or grass belly! When I picked up Napolean to take him home, I noticed his huge belly, and a spine and ribs you could feel very well. So I thought worms, but he was negative and my vet said he's too young to have a fecal show any eggs yet and just to deworm him every month. The breeder had dewormed him 3 times and he was 4 months when I picked him up. So, I thought maybe it was the grass she had him on, (tall and rich and all day turnout I think). But why was he ribby? When I brought him home, his paddock had grass, and I only let him out a few hours a day until I thought it was chewed down enough by my QH to let him have all day turnout. The first night after letting him be out for 6 hours I brought him in, it looked like he swallowed a football like that other person said! Geez guess it was still too much grass! By morning it was back down and by the next night it was back to almost normal. Since then I let my QH chew it down very small and its partially dirt now. I have had him out all day for the last week or so and started him on probiotics to help digest. He also gets 1/2lb Purina Miniature horse feed per bag recommendations. And only a handful of hay at night. But he still gets a big belly, it's wayyyy better than that first time, and when I brought him home, but he always looks better in the morning than at night after turnout. He is less ribby and has more meat over his back now, could that have just been because his belly was weighing on his back? Also, please can I have some suggestions to help him digest better? I read that someone likes brewer's yeast for belly's. Any suggestions? Soon I will be moving them to the new place I just bought that will be dirt, but I'd love to be able to turn him out on grass a little bit, even if he always needs a muzzle. Will he grow out of the belly?

Secondly, I was wondering what everyone does training wise with weanlings. My thoughts are to handle them alot, lead, pick up feet, groom. Is that all I should do until he's older? How about desensitizing? Anything else, or should I just let him be a foal for now?

Thank you for reading!
 
You have the training down to a T! No, it is never too early to start desensitizing! Some people will probably disagree, however, the "let him be a foal" makes spoiled bratty hard to handle yearlings in my experiences. Let him mature, yes, don't expect too much, but don't let him push you over or "play dumb".

It takes A LOT of time for the belly to go away. Granted, my guy was fed "all you can eat sweetfeed" by the looks of his feet and his body condition. His metabolism is screwy because of it.

This was my guy when I purchased him, after he had already lost a lot of weight.



This is him now, almost 2 years later.



Its just as much about fitness and building a topline as it is nutrition. On a foal, just keep him exercised, but dont push him. His little legs need to firm up!
 
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More nutrition (protein) is needed it sounds like... And if you can see ribs, more calories in general is needed.

Even though they are small, weanlings need a lot of food!!!
 
Firstly, welcome to LB - hope you will enjoy being a regular here as there are lots of friendly folk very willing to help you in any way with your new little boy (any chance of a few pictures - we love pictures!!).

I think you have many things to consider. If he was only 4 months when you got him, then he must have been very recently weaned (a little early IMO) so that, together with him travelling to and settling into a new home, will have been quite stressful for him. I'm not sure why he would have been in such a poor condition when you got him (but it could have been the weaning/travelling/etc stress as very young babies can go down like a pack of cards very quickly with any sudden changes in their lives) when he had been out on good grazing 24/7 - all my mares and foals are out on grass 24/7 all year round and the babies are like little beach balls!! LOL!!

Next I think the next 'problem' might be that you kept him away from grazing only letting him out for that short while followed by the 6 hours - as he was used to grass for his main diet, he probably stuffed himself on it as fast as he could given the opportunity - a proven fact is that limited grazing can lead horses to gorge themselves, often eating more in a few hours than a horse grazing for 24 hours will do - hence his tummy blew up.

Lack of protein will cause youngsters to have big bellies, not sure what level is in your feed (I live in the UK) but he will certainly need at least 14-16% protein from now on and through this first winter. Can you find a good quality weaner/growth/foal and yearling feed for him, and feed according to their instructions - or a little higher for the time being - dividing the total fed into 2 or 3 feeds per day? Also, if you are going to keep him stabled overnight (or anytime) he should have access to ad lib soft leafy hay at all times as he needs to 'trickle' feed, like he would do if out grazing, to keep his digestive system working properly. Minis need leafy hay as they cannot digest the more stalky kind that would be fed to bigger horses - so this is something to think about.

Training wise, I think that I would just do what you are doing - plenty of handling and attention, leading about to see and meet up with anything different/unusual, gentle but firm setting of your rules on behaviour, plus plenty of outside time so he can run off some of that energy! It is a pity that he doesn't have a young companion (any chance??) to run and play with - a great way for babies to tire themselves out. LOL!! Are you keeping him separate from your QH? It can be very dangerous to keep the smalls with the biggies as many folk have found out with often tragic consequencies.

Good luck, have fun with your little fella - do keep us informed as to his progress and dont forget the pictures!
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I'll add to the point that he needs more protein. I learned about that when I was feeding my now 4 yr old mares as weanlings. I didn't take into account their growth when I was feeding them then and started seeing that "belly". Some digging around here on this board alerted me to the fact that while I was feeding them a 16% protein feed, I wasn't feeding them enough of it. As soon as I made that adjustment, the belly went away in short order.

Good luck and share pics! We love pics here!
 
Reiterating the "more protein", and welcome to the wonderful world of minis! I like a 16% sweet feed (omelene)-weanlings/yearlings just don't get enough from the pony/mini feed unless on a high protein alfalfa. With Purina, I have always had to increase how much I feed from their instructions. 1/2 cup is probably ok if it's a few times a day and he's getting some alfalfa too.
 
Thank you everyone for your good advice. I will increase his protein for sure, and it seems from reading that alot of you love Calf-manna, so I'll go pick some up. I don't think the length of turnout matters in this case because he came to me with a baloon belly and was on grass all day. So it seems he eats too much with restricted or free access.

Yes, my QH and mini are separate, he's too tiny! But they love each other :) and keep each other good company.

Also, how do you tell how big they will get?

Thanks everyone I'll post a picture soon!
 
I'll reiterate a high protein diet for these weanlings -- and straight through until past their yearling stage. A good mare/foal feed would increase his protein intake, as well as adding alfalfa to his diet. I always recommend adding alfalfa, as it is also a tummy soother and will boost his protein intake, while giving him the natural roughage and fiber he needs.

I alway "creep fed" my weanlings -- making sure they had food in front of them at all times so they could nibble as they wanted to. They have smaller tummies, and feeding them several times a day can be hard on the owners, but letting them always have food in front of them, allows them to nibble as they go, and never "wolf" their feed.

With the higher protein diet, I think you will start to see good changes in his boby -- filling out in the proper places and losing that "bloat" belly look.

Good luck, and welcome from hot, sunny (and awfully rainy) Florida!
 
Higher protein and free access to grass, IMO. You cannot beat Dr Green and any grass belly will take care of itself, trust me! If they get the right protein and are weaned at the right time (although there may have been a good reason to have done so, your foal was weaned far earlier than I like to see) the belly just should not appear. I am not sure I agree with your Vet about the faecal test but even so, the worms that will do the most harm (encysteds and tapes) will not show on a faecal anyway. He is definitely very young to have a tapeworm but I would rather put a little bit of extra chemical down a colt and not take a chance, and definitely use the Fenbendazole five day course to get any possible encysteds as I have actually lost a bought in colt to them, it is not pretty!
 
Hi and Welcome and congrats on your baby.

I would get rid of the MIniature Horse and Pony feed and definately not be giving him Calf Manna.

Put him on a good foal food like Purina Equine Jr. and that's all he needs besides his grass and hay. Be very sure that hay is not coarse in any way because if its the least bit stemmy, he'll not only choke but he won't be able to digest it.

I also disagree with your vet and any vet that says your horse is worm free. Fecals do not show the migrating species and ones that are about to hatch. However another reason for the big belly would be ulcers which most babies have from the stress of weaning so although mine are not weaned so early as yours and have no reason to fret because they don't go anywhere, I do put the on ulcer meds for a good thirty days with probios. Plese don't even think of putting him in a muzzle. I also hope you aren't putting him in with your Quarter Horse. So let's see some pictures! Best wishes.
 
Weanlings do not need muzzles, nor do they need to have their hay/grass intake restricted. Our babies get free choice hay, preferably alfalfa or alfalfa mix hay, and almost 2 litres of grain (half oats, half 14% pellets--a kind that contains brewers yeast) twice a day.
 
Thank you for all your opinions. He is already looking better since I've had him. You can barely feel his ribs and his topline is filling out. I think he was stressed alot at his first home where he wasn't getting enough nutrition, just alot of long grass that he probably couldn't digest and utilize well, and stemy hay. He was the only foal she had this year and he was thrown in with the herd, but nobody his age :-(. She did wean earlier than I wanted but even still, at the 3 month point, the quality of the mare's milk drops drastically and the foal starts to get most of what it needs from dry food. (And since he was loosing mom's nutrition and not getting the proper diet, I'm sure he was a bit deprived) She wouldn't wean later as she was worried about the mare, but that didn't stop me from buying him because I fell in love and wanted to give him the best care I could and the earlier the better to get him home. He was weaned, shipped and moved to a strange place, so the poor guy was stressed, so I put him on gastroguard for a while tying to avoid ulcers. He is all settled in now and doing much better. He is quite a laid abck awesome guy. Hopefully, the following weeks will show the benefits of the increased protein. I'm still baffled by the changing pot belly from morning to night! I will try to upload a pic!
 
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Check out the article on feeding weanlings that I wrote for our 4-Hers. Some math is involved but it points out how much protein is really needed.

http://www.ontargetminiatures.com/images/pdfs/Weanlings_care_feeding.pdf

More articles in the 4-H section of our website, link in my signature.

To add a photo easily, click on the "more reply options" in the lower right corner of the screen when you post. You can then select photos on your computer (one at a time) and add them to your post.

ETA: While I usually agree with Marty, I like Calf Manna because I find it to be a great way to up the protein for foals and weanlings. And they all love the taste. Although the name is Calf Manna, it is also for horses, and many people on this forum use it. You don't need a lot - it is fed here more as a top dressing or supplement to increase the protein, not as the major source of nutrition.
 
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Excellent advice given here. A lot of people new to miniatures mistake the 'hay belly' for fat....but in fact it is the exact opposite. It is the result of not enough "good" calories, protein, and the right kind of fats. Since he is a baby, Marty is right - don't go with Calf Manna....too much corn and corn is (in my opinion) meant to be fed to animals intended for slaughter (i.e., steers, hogs, etc.) and doesn't have (in my opinion) the nutritional balance for a baby horse...it is a generic "all breed" feed. Check your labels....not all feeds are created equal! Equine Jr. is excellent to use as a point of comparison.
 

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